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The Next President is...

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I live in UT, where it's been mail-in for a while now.  I will get my ballots no later than 9 Oct (I think). I can mail them in anytime up to election day, and I can drop them off any time up to election day.

They did send out warnings that if they're mailed on election day they might not get counted if they're delayed, or something happens.

Love my 1st Amendment, but I like the way the UK does election day.  No reporting on it until the polls close in all districts.  Would suck for our East Americans, but addresses the, "why bother" if someone appears to be down and a area hasn't counted a ton of ballots.  I guess I should add that I heard that was the status in the UK, but now I'm thinking it might be Australia...shit, I don't know.

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Despite his overly dramatic comments, there are legitimate issues with mail in ballots, which are going to lead to a lot of contesting results and everything that goes along with that. Can’t wait for the shitshow.

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4 hours ago, brabus said:

Can’t wait for the shitshow.

Michigan judge just gave a two week extension for mail in ballots to be collected, allowed ballot harvesting.

New Jersey "just discovered" 1,600 mail in ballots from a July election.

Georgia announced 1,000 instances of "double voting" from this past June's primary election.

Pennsylvania just stated that the signatures on the ballot and the envelope don't have to match now.

 

05onfire1_xp-master768-v2.jpg

 

Also, Biden last night: "I'll keep fracking."  "I'll phase out fracking."  "China isn't a threat, it's a competitor."

When the cameras were supposed to be off, Biden goes over to moderator Cooper and whispers in his ear.  A) Distance/masks save lives?  B) Whispering to the moderator?  Didn't read about that with Trump at the ABC "townhall."

 

Last week, Harris in a Spanish language broadcast referenced a "Harris Administration...with Joe Biden."

Same day last week, Biden mumbles through a badly delivered to no one, literally, except media present about a "Harris-Biden Administration."

 

Ladies first, I guess?

 

Edited by brickhistory

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As was said before we just need to accept that the results may not be known at midnight on election night. The electors don't actually vote until December so there's plenty of time to get an accurate count.

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“The American people should have a voice in the selection of their next Supreme Court Justice. Therefore, this vacancy should not be filled until we have a new president.”

— Mitch McConnell, 2016.

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7 minutes ago, Sua Sponte said:

“The American people should have a voice in the selection of their next Supreme Court Justice. Therefore, this vacancy should not be filled until we have a new president.”

— Mitch McConnell, 2016.

If you think for one second that Obama wouldn’t have filed a SCOTUS seat, when his party had controlled the Senate, at the end of his first term; then you’re not being intellectually honest. Parliamentary procedure isn’t about “fairness”, it’s about what party’s in control. Just like Harry Reid in 2013, when they changed to rules requiring 60 votes to approve federal judges and executive branch nominees, to the now accepted simple majority. https://www.heritage.org/political-process/commentary/5-years-after-going-nuclear-democrats-have-reaped-what-they-sowed

This RBG wrinkle is going to make the first 9 months of 2020 look relatively peaceful...

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That may be the case but at least attempt to not talk out your ass and just say "we think we're going to win in November so we're going to kick the can down the road" instead of waxing poetically about the will of the people.

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7 minutes ago, jrizzell said:

If you think for one second that Obama wouldn’t have filed a SCOTUS seat, when his party had controlled the Senate, at the end of his first term; then you’re not being intellectually honest. Parliamentary procedure isn’t about “fairness”, it’s about what party’s in control. Just like Harry Reid in 2013, when they changed to rules requiring 60 votes to approve federal judges and executive branch nominees, to the now accepted simple majority. https://www.heritage.org/political-process/commentary/5-years-after-going-nuclear-democrats-have-reaped-what-they-sowed

This RBG wrinkle is going to make the first 9 months of 2020 look relatively peaceful...

He’s just pointing out blatant hypocritical statements that didn’t need to be said in 2016. Nothing more, nothing less.

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He’s just pointing out blatant hypocritical statements that didn’t need to be said in 2016. Nothing more, nothing less.

A lot has changed since 2016. The left went all out assault and declared war with little regard to anything. I’m 100% for the right to counter-attack.


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2 hours ago, di1630 said:


A lot has changed since 2016. The left went all out assault and declared war with little regard to anything. I’m 100% for the right to counter-attack.


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It must be terrifying for you to live in a world where you are under constant attack from such a ruthless and powerful enemy

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4 hours ago, di1630 said:


A lot has changed since 2016. The left went all out assault and declared war with little regard to anything. I’m 100% for the right to counter-attack.

And the Right was just sitting there as innocent as can be, doing nothing at all and getting sucker punched by the big mean left.  😢

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8 hours ago, di1630 said:


A lot has changed since 2016. The left went all out assault and declared war with little regard to anything. I’m 100% for the right to counter-attack.


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Thank you for your service.

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Hypocritical politicians?

I'm shocked, I tell you.  Shocked.

I believe some guy said "Elections have consequences.  I won"  Or something like that.

And he was correct.

 

And now at least two Republican senators - Murkowski and Collins have said they won't vote for a nominee until after the Inaugeration (sp?) next year.  I fully expect Pierre Delecto to join them.  Won't be surprised if other squish GOP senators join them.

And that encapsulates why I quit the Republican party in 2016.  They don't seem to like to win, only virtue signal about their righteousness.  Add in the disdain for Trump, who beat 16 other run of the mill Republicans to become President, and they take every opportunity to oppose the people who elected Trump and wanted stuff done or undone on their behalf.  And those SOBs ain't having it.  Messes up their cushy gigs and future K Street opportunities.

I commend the Democratic party.  When they win, they use the power given to them by the electorate.

Although the "burn it all down if they appoint someone" mantra probably isn't a good look for getting elected.

We'll see.

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Fair enough, I see your side of it. My question is how do we ever get back to more efficient, less partisan politics when both sides are such babies?

In reality, some principles that espouse fairness, voter representation, or the spirit of the constitution (such as what McConnell hypocritically suggested in 2016) are exactly what would help unite the country. Are we past things like that? Is it so clearly one team versus the other? Are the gloves fully off?

I agree that the dems were blatantly unfair during the Kavanaugh confirmation, and I understand the desire to “get back” at them. It just makes me sad for the future of the country and our ability to actually unite and make meaningful progress against external threats such as China, deficits, or Global Warming.

Here’s to the 2020s being another lost decade of progress, just like the 2010s.

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12 minutes ago, brawnie said:

My question is how do we ever get back to more efficient, less partisan politics when both sides are such babies?

How?  Get rid of the tremendous amounts of Dark Money that really drives what politicians do.  A worthy diatribe from Reddit just a couple hours ago below.  Awful long, but I felt like it was worth the read.

https://www.reddit.com/r/politics/comments/ivlkl2/obama_calls_on_senate_not_to_fill_ginsburgs/g5t1vlj?utm_source=share&utm_medium=web2x&context=3

Quote

 

No.

Once more for the road - McConnell is nothing more than a loathsome mercenary hired by corporate and foreign powers to achieve their ends at the cost of the American people, to shovel our tax dollars and our sovereign power into their hands, for the personal and petty profit of the soldiers in his employ - Republican politicians.

He's not an evil mastermind, he's not the grand architect or the wizard behind the curtain. He serves at the pleasure of Senate Republicans; if they didn't want him there, they would be rid of him in a heartbeat. The truth is, whatever they say, whatever they do, they like him there. He soaks up the anger and outrage and abuse. They can pretend to be "good guys" - like that spineless, worthless shit Mitt Romney - while wholeheartedly endorsing the entire corrupt campaign behind the scenes. Mitch McConnell is despised by everyone, even his own party. Majority Leader isn't a desirable position. Look at Nancy Pelosi - she immediately became the sole target of public ire for decisions like not impeaching Trump, despite the fact that she's almost certainly carrying out the wishes of the consensus of thousands of Democrat officials and politicians. This isn't her plan, just like this is not Mitch's plan.

Mitch McConnell is serving the designs and plans of a few massive corporations and other huge donors. That's it. The religious zealots, the industrial titans and long-time Republican donors - he passes bills like the 2018 Tax Theft bill that pleases them and delivers profits to them, while safeguarding Republican power.

I say this because articles like this blaming him for the entire debacle help him fulfill exactly his purpose: establish a single focal point of blame without addressing the systemic issues and network of corrupt and criminal actors that actually pull the strings. "Mitch McConnell is Really Destroying America" as a headline (which is all that most people read anyway) makes the natural implication that removing Mitch McConnell fixes the problem. But there's always another Mitch McConnell. Articles like this give him far too much credit and cement a perception that without him, the whole machine falls apart.

But this is factually bankrupt. The system, the real agent of America's destruction, is made up of thousands of Republican megadonors donors like the Mercers and Sheldon Addleson, corporate conglomerates like the Oil industry and Telecomm, foreign powers like Putin's Russia and Mr. Bonesaw's Saudi Arabia, and religious organizations like the Mormon Church. They funnel billions of dollars and precise, exact instructions into the Republican party, which is nothing more than a mercenary force to carry out the donors wishes. The donors pay money, the Republicans fight the war. McConnell is just another in a long line of generals. There are endless candidates. Ted Cruz could be a McConnell. So could Marco Rubio or Mitt Romney.

Speaker of the House and Senate Majority Leader are not enviable positions. Look at Paul Ryan. They don't really wield power. It isn't like a President, who is publicly elected. They're appointed by the party, and they're just the hate sponges for the party, the ones who will take all the blame while more "likable" candidates play bridgemaker in hopes of vying for President. It doesn't matter who serves in that capacity. Dark money is the rot, because it stacks the government with people acting directly against the public interest.

All of the emotion, the partisan bickering, the sentiment and loathing, that's all a smokescreen. These people, Republicans, they are not politicians. Not in the slightest. The only thing they have in common with politicians is many of them are lawyers and they wear suits. They don't govern. The Republican party has done literally nothing even remotely resembling governance in a long time. When was the last time they passed a bill meant to improve some part of public or private life for the average American citizen?

Do not delude yourselves. This is not about Trump, not about McConnell, not even about the Republican party. Eliminate one mercenary group, and another takes its place. The Democrats are on the side of the angels currently, but only by default, only because Republicans have devolved so far into criminality and corruption (mostly out of desperation) that it would be impossible not to be the good guys in comparison.

If we do not do something about dark money in politics, any party, no matter how conservative or liberal, can easily be infiltrated and eventually overrun with people acting in the interest of dark money over public interest.

If McConnell were following his own comprehensive grand plan, you wouldn't see this ridiculous flip-flopping of stances and interests nearly overnight. That's why Republicans are such demonstrable and laughable hypocrites. Their hypocrisy is almost absurdist - their actions frequently contradict their words because they have no real guiding ideology. They're just working for the highest bidder. Much like a mercenary might fight for one side on one day, and then the opposing side the next day, Republicans do whatever they're told by their masters, while doing preposterous verbal gymnastics on TV. Just look at what we've witnessed in a short period of time:

• Republicans outspoken against Russia pre-2016; immediately turn into vocal and ardent Russia supporters (because Russia started paying them and helping them win).

• Republicans outspoken against and opposed to executive power pre-2106; immediately and vocally support the extreme tryannical overreach of Donald Trump (because he's a Republican).

• Conservative think-tank The Heritage Foundation creates outline of Affordable Care Act & Republican Mitt Romney puts it into place as governor of Massachusetts - immediately and vocally condemn it as soon as Obama makes it the foundation of his healthcare policy

• Republicans bemoan and condemn the increase of the federal deficit - until Trump creates one of the largest federal deficits in recent memory to give tax dollars to corporations. Then they vocally and proudly support it.

• Republicans stoke xenophobia and drone on and on and one about the threat of "Radical Islam" - until Trump wants to sell billions of dollars of weaponry to Saudi Arabia, the most powerful, hardcore "islamic extremists" in the Middle East. Then, Saudi Arabia is a wonderful beacon of freedom (because they're paying them).

This is why they wouldn't be successful without a propaganda wing like Fox News. All politicians do a form of doublespeak, but there is nothing comparable to the hypocrisy of modern-day Republicans. Nothing. No 20th century absurdist novelist could ever dream up these clowns. They need to cut off their voters from reality and isolate them in a sterile alternate universe where they bury certain hypocrisies or explain them away and build a narrative utterly incomparable to the real world, because whatever you want to say about Republican voters, they have all the same mental capacities as your average Joe. They could easily see how badly they, personally, are being ed over by the very people they choose to represent them - if they weren't living in the alternate universe that is Conservative Media.

All this to say that none of this is part of McConnell's grand design. Nor Trump's, nor even the entire Republican party. There's no teleology to any of this, no method to the madness, no overarching evil scheme. That's the fiction junkies in us, always envisioning the evil wizard plotting brilliant and infinitely complex schemes to redesign the world.

Poll Republican voters about what they think they're getting - the world they think their votes are buying - and you'll get a hundred different answers and illustrations of a hundred different worlds, none of which remotely resemble what Republicans are actually building.

The world Republicans are building is nothing more than a grotesque collage of the wants and needs of some of the richest and most morally and ethically bankrupt people and organizations on the planet, disparate in scope but almost all entirely to the detriment of the American people, because the only thing Republicans can trade for their donors' cash is federal tax dollars and the power and sovereignty of the American citizens they represent. It is ever-shifting, ever-changing, but always shitty. Either a perpetual war or economic cycles of boom-and-bust or rampant xenophobia - it doesn't matter. Republicans are a black box that donors put a handful of small bills into and get back trillions of our tax dollars and untold powers over public land or contractual rights or legal rights.

This is why the actions of Republicans need to be firmly divorced from the personalities of single individuals like Trump and McConnell and also from the veil of "conservatism" or political ideology in general. They don't care. They're mercenaries. Start acting like it. Stop talking and yelling to them and start yelling over them, to their masters, because these are the people and organizations destroying America, and we need to identify them, call them out, and recognize Republicans for the flunkies they are.

Everything begins and ends with the money. To begin with Citizens United must be overturned, but we need to keep going. Money and all forms of perverse incentives need to be dealt with, or we will always be governed by the mercenary armies of despots and multinational conglomerates. I don't care which party you vote for, truly I don't. The only thing that matters is to vote for people comitted to removing dark money from politics and most importantly watching over them with intense scrutiny every single day they're in office to make sure they follow up on that promise.

 

 

Edited by Blue
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17 minutes ago, Blue said:

How?  Get rid of the tremendous amounts of Dark Money that really drives what politicians do.  A worthy diatribe from Reddit just a couple hours ago below.  Awful long, but I felt like it was worth the read.

https://www.reddit.com/r/politics/comments/ivlkl2/obama_calls_on_senate_not_to_fill_ginsburgs/g5t1vlj?utm_source=share&utm_medium=web2x&context=3

 

"The democrats are on the side of angels" 

 

🤣

 

"A worthy diatribe from Reddit"

"I felt like it was worth the read"

 🤣 🤣 🤣

Edited by Seadogs
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18 hours ago, kaputt said:

Ginsburg died. 

And somewhere, a Chief Justice of the Supreme Court just earned his permanent liberal wings.

 

Thanks, dubya!

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29 minutes ago, brickhistory said:

And somewhere, a Chief Justice of the Supreme Court just earned his permanent liberal wings.

 

Thanks, dubya!

Roberts has always been more centrist than the other conservative judges, don't act all shocked like when you suddenly started paying attention you didn't like what you saw.  People either have the idea that it should be a balanced court, or it should be full-tilt in their political party.  I think Roberts is in the former camp, and you may see him shift even more left to preserve his legacy as chief justice and not seen as the guy who oversaw the hard right turn that will inevitably happen.

An olive branch was extended with Garland, but it failed quite spectacularly.  I think the gloves should come off and do away with any pretense that the parties can work together. DC and PR statehood, expand the house, expand the supreme court, dissolve the electoral college, ranked choice/instant runoff voting across the board.  Fuck em. 🍺

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3 minutes ago, drewpey said:

Roberts has always been more centrist than the other conservative judges, don't act all shocked like when you suddenly started paying attention you didn't like what you saw.  People either have the idea that it should be a balanced court, or it should be full-tilt in their political party.  I think Roberts is in the former camp, and you may see him shift even more left to preserve his legacy as chief justice and not seen as the guy who oversaw the hard right turn that will inevitably happen.

An olive branch was extended with Garland, but it failed quite spectacularly.  I think the gloves should come off and do away with any pretense that the parties can work together. DC and PR statehood, expand the house, expand the supreme court, dissolve the electoral college, ranked choice/instant runoff voting across the board.  em. 🍺

Yeah! Mob rule!!:beer:

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1 hour ago, Seadogs said:

Yeah! Mob rule!!:beer:

The difference between democracy and mob rule is the legality of their actions.  Everything I mentioned has a legal and fair process and precedent for doing so.

Having a government thats representative of the populace has always been a terrifying thought for the right, but you'll survive.  You always do.

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Just now, drewpey said:

The difference between democracy and mob rule is the legality of their actions.  Everything I mentioned has a legal and fair process and precedent for doing so.

Having a government thats representative of the populace has always been a terrifying thought for the right, but you'll survive.  You always do.

So you don’t think our government is representative of the populous? Interesting, go with data. 

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