Russian Ukraine shenanigans

[DirkDiggler]

  Burn ‘em.

[Random Guy]

On 6/27/2022 at 2:47 PM, TheNewGazmo said:

On 6/26/2022 at 5:06 AM, uhhello said:

Man, nothing like having a relaxing cigar on the balcony on Bastion when those ers would light off.

I remember them firing them off at Kandyland as well. Always made me wonder what we were actually shooting at.

Probably the producer's EBITDA margin. 

[skybert]

[TheNewGazmo]

On 7/18/2022 at 7:06 PM, skybert said:

At least it wasn't an airliner....

[Lawman]

At least it wasn't an airliner....

This time….


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[HeloDude]

Just curious how those sanctions against Russia are working?

“Saudi Arabia more than doubled Russian oil imports in the second quarter, freeing up their own crude for export”

https://markets.businessinsider.com/news/commodities/russia-saudi-arabia-oil-fuel-energy-sanctions-inflation-ukraine-2022-7?utm_source=facebook.com&utm_medium=social&utm_campaign=sf-bi-main&fbclid=IwAR3ESt3yq7zNbuJeefhAs2HEDiT7cFjrlAljLc5ZV0UqAEXAAG4cyw8rm60

[tac airlifter]

Just now, HeloDude said:

Just curious how those sanctions against Russia are working?

“Saudi Arabia more than doubled Russian oil imports in the second quarter, freeing up their own crude for export”

https://markets.businessinsider.com/news/commodities/russia-saudi-arabia-oil-fuel-energy-sanctions-inflation-ukraine-2022-7?utm_source=facebook.com&utm_medium=social&utm_campaign=sf-bi-main&fbclid=IwAR3ESt3yq7zNbuJeefhAs2HEDiT7cFjrlAljLc5ZV0UqAEXAAG4cyw8rm60

Yup, not working at all and making things miserable here in the US.  Clearly the people running international policy are highly intelligent 🙄

Curious if sanctions have ever worked.  I can’t think of a case.

[HeloDude]

2 minutes ago, tac airlifter said:

Yup, not working at all and making things miserable here in the US.  Clearly the people running international policy are highly intelligent 🙄

Curious if sanctions have ever worked.  I can’t think of a case.

Plenty of people on here seemed to believe they would work.  Many are those who also believed the forced covid lockdowns were a good idea.

Emotional decisions don’t usually work out too well in the end…

 

“Germany worries about gas rationing as supply from Russia halted”

https://www.theguardian.com/world/2022/jul/19/germany-worries-about-gas-rationing-as-supply-from-russia-halted

[Sim]

Quote

The Ukrainian military has endangered Ukrainian civilians by establishing bases and operating weapons systems in residential areas - including in schools and hospitals - as it has sought to repel the Russian invasion, Amnesty International said today.

Ukraine’s tactics have violated international humanitarian law as they’ve turned civilian objects into military targets. The ensuing Russian strikes in populated areas have killed civilians and destroyed civilian infrastructure. 

 

https://www.amnesty.org.uk/press-releases/ukraine-military-endangering-civilians-locating-forces-residential-areas-new

[DirkDiggler]

 

[Swizzle]

12 hours ago, DirkDiggler said:

 

Reminds me...

[DirkDiggler]

  Russia just keeps having trouble with their munitions dumps exploding.

[BashiChuni]

How many more BILLIONS are we gonna send our Ukrainian heroes?

[uhhello]

5 hours ago, BashiChuni said:

How many more BILLIONS are we gonna send our Ukrainian heroes?

What's your course of action?  Curious.

[Guest nsplayr]

On 8/9/2022 at 1:13 PM, BashiChuni said:

How many more BILLIONS are we gonna send our Ukrainian heroes?

I’m willing to send many more billions because A) it helps keep the Ukrainian people free from Russian tyranny, and B) it continues to bleed out one of our biggest geopolitical opponents without costing a single American life.

Sounds like money well spent to me!

Edited August 10, 2022 by nsplayr

[Stoker]

13 hours ago, BashiChuni said:

How many more BILLIONS are we gonna send our Ukrainian heroes?

Spending a few billion to kill Soviets is one of the best investments out government has made in a long time. 

[pawnman]

15 hours ago, BashiChuni said:

How many more BILLIONS are we gonna send our Ukrainian heroes?

A lot, I hope. As others have pointed out, I'm willing to spend a lot to destroy Russia's military with zero threat to American lives. 

[busdriver]

17 hours ago, BashiChuni said:

How many more BILLIONS are we gonna send our Ukrainian heroes?

Something to consider: 

-Would Russia stop with Ukraine?  There are geographic reasons to suspect they would not.  Namely that Russia has poor natural geographic borders without controlling the Baltics, Moldova and about half of Poland.  There's a reason it ended up controlling those areas after WW2 (negotiated).

-Based on what we've seen of their performance in Ukraine, I don't think anyone thinks the Russian military would stand a chance against NATO in a conventional war.  I'm not sure US troops would even be needed; but if the US is involved, it is for sure a forgone conclusion that Russia loses badly.

-If you grant me those two points for the sake of discussion, does that increase or decrease the threat of a nuclear weapon(s) being used on the European continent?

[ClearedHot]

5 hours ago, busdriver said:

-If you grant me those two points for the sake of discussion, does that increase or decrease the threat of a nuclear weapon(s) being used on the European continent?

The loss numbers for Russia are staggering.  In my humble opinion as a knuckle dragging ham-fisted pilot we need to do the following:

1.  Continue to enable Ukraine to punish Russia.

2.  Provide Putin an off ramp.

3.  Think about a post-conflict Ukraine and what happens to all these weapons we have provided.

 

 

[Prozac]

4 hours ago, ClearedHot said:

The loss numbers for Russia are staggering.  In my humble opinion as a knuckle dragging ham-fisted pilot we need to do the following:

1.  Continue to enable Ukraine to punish Russia.

2.  Provide Putin an off ramp.

3.  Think about a post-conflict Ukraine and what happens to all these weapons we have provided.

 

 

If Ukraine can emerge from this thing intact or relatively so, and maintain their western friendly government, a heavily armed, non NATO ally on Russia’s border could be rather useful. For instance, Russia knows it can execute a cyber attack on a country like Latvia effectively with impunity. Latvia is not going to start lobbing retaliatory missiles and shells into Russia for fear of dragging NATO into WWIII. The Ukrainians on the other hand? Well they just might do something crazy with all their new toys. Sometimes it’s a good tactic to have that one guy with the crazy eyes and the brass knuckles in your group that makes a potential adversary pause and think: do I really want to fuck with these guys? Of course, the “what-ifs” I posited at the beginning of this paragraph are far from givens and if the Ukrainian state fails, all that weaponry will create some issues. Is there a remote self destruct function on those HIMARS systems? /s

[ClearedHot]

 

[waveshaper]

20 minutes ago, ClearedHot said:

The loss numbers for Russia are staggering. 

Something to think about, both Russia and the Ukraine can take some serious casualties. The top three countries with the most casualties during WW2 = China, Russia, and Ukraine. Note - broken down by country not USSR, etc/keep in mind all these countries had a much smaller population during WW2.

List of casualties from top 8 countries during WW2:

Country	Tot. Deaths	Military Deaths	Civ. Deaths via Military	Civ. Deaths via Famine/Disease
China	20,000,000	3,750,000	8,191,000	10,000,000
Russia	13,950,000	6,750,000	4,100,000	3,100,000
Ukraine	6,850,000	1,650,000	3,700,000	1,500,000
Poland	6,000,000	240,000	5,820,000
Germany	5,700,000	4,456,000	2,135,000
Japan	3,100,000	2,300,000	800,000
India	3,087,000	87,000		3,000,000
Belarus	2,290,000	620,000	1,360,000	310,000

Complete list: World War II Casualties by Country 2022 (worldpopulationreview.com)

 

[fire4effect]

51 minutes ago, Prozac said:

If Ukraine can emerge from this thing intact or relatively so, and maintain their western friendly government, a heavily armed, non NATO ally on Russia’s border could be rather useful. For instance, Russia knows it can execute a cyber attack on a country like Latvia effectively with impunity. Latvia is not going to start lobbing retaliatory missiles and shells into Russia for fear of dragging NATO into WWIII. The Ukrainians on the other hand? Well they just might do something crazy with all their new toys. Sometimes it’s a good tactic to have that one guy with the crazy eyes and the brass knuckles in your group that makes a potential adversary pause and think: do I really want to fuck with these guys? Of course, the “what-ifs” I posited at the beginning of this paragraph are far from givens and if the Ukrainian state fails, all that weaponry will create some issues. Is there a remote self destruct function on those HIMARS systems? /s

That's kind of how I viewed Trump. No one really knew what to expect.

[Lawman]

That's kind of how I viewed Trump. No one really knew what to expect.

That was probably the biggest shortcoming with Obama as far as foreign policy. Putin tested him, validated where and how quickly he would back off any demand, and the rest of the world knew it too.

He was essentially sitting at the poker table with his cards backwards and everybody else knew dead to rights what he had to play.


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[Danger41]

2 hours ago, waveshaper said:

Something to think about, both Russia and the Ukraine can take some serious casualties. The top three countries with the most casualties during WW2 = China, Russia, and Ukraine. Note - broken down by country not USSR, etc/keep in mind all these countries had a much smaller population during WW2.

List of casualties from top 8 countries during WW2:

Country	Tot. Deaths	Military Deaths	Civ. Deaths via Military	Civ. Deaths via Famine/Disease
China	20,000,000	3,750,000	8,191,000	10,000,000
Russia	13,950,000	6,750,000	4,100,000	3,100,000
Ukraine	6,850,000	1,650,000	3,700,000	1,500,000
Poland	6,000,000	240,000	5,820,000
Germany	5,700,000	4,456,000	2,135,000
Japan	3,100,000	2,300,000	800,000
India	3,087,000	87,000		3,000,000
Belarus	2,290,000	620,000	1,360,000	310,000

Complete list: World War II Casualties by Country 2022 (worldpopulationreview.com)

 

The interesting thing with Russian casualties in modern day is how janky their population distribution is and losing more young people further exacerbates their inevitable fall.