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Guys on active duty (at the 10 year point mind you) are completely clueless about the opportunities to continue their service in the guard/reserves, mil leave and still flying for the airlines. When I became aware of all of that my decision matrix to leave active duty went out the window, it was a no brainer. Wait, I can do the same job, part time, still potentially work towards retirement with a quarter of the bullshit, oh and STILL fly for the airlines and make 3x what I do now, AND live where I want!? Why anyone would stay on active duty is beyond me. The fact that these opportunities stay under wraps speaks to the skill of various commanders in protecting the company (sarcasm.)

And the AF was also furloughing, let's not forget Sent from my Pixel using Tapatalk

Aaah, invoking 9/11 to validate a decision to stay in the Active Duty thrash? That's a bit morose...ahem, I mean a conservative, safe view. Don't forget that more than two paths exist...the false dichotomy of a) stay on AD til 20 or 2. totally get out and never get any retirement money or Tricare is a ing lie perpetrated by the same POS commanders promoting the welfare mentality on AD. "Stay with us, and the money will keep rolling in...Boy, did you see the news? It sure looks big and scary out there. Thank God you took that 365...it will be a good career move for you. You're welcome." Join the ARC. Keep getting paid. Stay current. Choose where you live. Build your apps. Get hired at a major. Smile excessively while reading internet chat boards.

I always valued the medical, but going on two weeks of specialized inpatient care with my 3yr old after a terrible accident has put it in a different perspective.. it is one aspect of mil retirement that is pushing me to stay in.

Couldn't agree more. At the beginning of my career I heard people say that they would do this job for free. I maintain to this day that that comment is one of the stupidest I've ever heard. There is something about flying fast jets that causes some of the smartest people I've ever met to make some of the dumbest comments in the world about their compensation. I now have the comfort of cuddling with my DD214 nightly, but I get pissed when I hear borderline geniuses say that it's not about the money. Someone needs to start a workshop on business negotiation. We spend over a decade getting shat on with absolutely no negotiating power and once you finally have a say in your life and a little freedom you give a HUGE concession to big blue by saying it's not about the money! Of course it's about the money. That's just not the biggest part of what it's about.

So true. A few years ago, I did my fitness test one month before I turned 50. My good friend who is 47 was in my group, plus 7 others. Of those 7, one was in his 30's and the rest were young Airmen in the 20's. I finished first in the 1.5 mile run, followed by my friend about 25" behind me. The two of us stood by the finish line and yelled "old guys rule!!" to the rest of the runners as they went by. It was pathetic to watch the ones in their early 20's struggling to make it 6 laps. They should be in great shape, and certainly good enough to beat a 50 year old Lt Col with an artificial hip.

How much effort does it require to pass a fitness test? Not much. No officer should ever fail a fitness test.

While I'm a bit disappointed to see the growing trend of monetizing the guard application process, bogidope's job listings are more comprehensive than afpilotjobs'. And last time I checked the bogidope site, the job listing page is free (not the fancy map, but the basic list). I got interviewed by a unit I never would have known was even having a board due to bogidope, as it wasn't listed on afpilotjobs. (I do not pay a subscription to bogidope)

https://aviationbull.com/2017/mar/28/what-will-year-cost-me

And each was surrounded by a metric sh1t-ton of archie (AAA to you newbies) which is why Frank Luke was celebrated as a mad hero. Being so flammable and a static target, the Jerries (and Allies) put a ring of lead around each one. Brits never did issue parachutes for their balloonists (something about bonus' and being team players...). USAAF also categorized V-1 kills separately.

True! But there is usually a reason the mob is pissed in the first place. Many of us have been on this board since we were Lts just looking to make it through flight school. Now, many years later, we have spent entire careers either getting screwed or seeing our buddies get screwed (sts) by the AF, all the while watching the warrior ethos and camaraderie depart the fix as well. After suffering through poor leadership who spent decades treating us poorly and taking us for granted, we finally have other options. They (the generals) didn't earn or appreciate our loyalty when they had the chance, so why give it to them now? Fucking RUN fellas.

I'm probably like everyone else here, I have a love/hate relationship with the Air Force. But I think when it comes right down to it, as an organiztion the Air Force has its self screwed tightly into the wrong hole (no sts on that, sorry). I think baseops is a pretty good representation of the officers and some enlisted who truly care about what is going with the service and the most active boards and threads are the ones where people bitch and complain about Big Blue. 90% of the time I agree with the points being made, or at least where the frustration is coming from. When I was at SOS and they brought the War College guys in for Capt/Col discussion. I will never forget after taking quesitons from a bunch of angry, know-it-all Captains for the better part of an hour, the Colonel simply told us "YOU have to allow YOUR Air Force to make mistakes." I agreed with him at the time, but how many mistakes is enough? Would we as individuals have been cut the same amount of slack if we spent SIX years trying to figure out force shaping initiatives? How about the idiocy with uniforms? Reflective belts? What about one of the most expensive airframes ever being grounded for five months? Having said that what is OUR problem? If there was one thing (or a few things) that could turn crap around what would it be? I have my theories...leaders not allowed to be leaders is probably the biggest one...but I don't any earth shattering answers but maybe someone else does.

I'm assuming you're being sarcastic which I can appreciate.

Please. Pretty sure you've never had to take our PT test. #CheckYourGruntPrivilege Sent from my Pixel using Tapatalk

what gives me peace about the volatile industry are the mandatory retirements. so assuming zero growth each airline is looking at 600-900 retirements per year for the next 10 years. recession? sure it's possible likely, but i think the odds look reasonable enough to throw my hat in the ring

My perspective is that if they COMPLETELY fixed the QOL/culture/toxic leadership, etc. They wouldn't have to pay people to stay (or pay much). Conversely, if they decided to keep going the way things are, they could fix the problem by paying their way out of it. Something like a $1million upfront bonus and I almost guaran-damn-tee you that even someone as cynical as I would have to rethink my plans. So since you really can't do either to the extreme the best bet is to make a concerted effort to fix the things that we have been squawking about for the last 10 years and up the bonus to grab the fence-sitters. Sent from my iPhone using Baseops Network Forums

true. i dont have much respect for those who are healthy and can't pass. doesn't take much work. be better.

I read all these posts about idealism and how it's not about the money with a half-cocked smirk on my face- the same smirk I make after I leave the money on the table for BQZip's mom. No one wants I admit they are a money grubbing whore, but if the gov were to make it rain and out bid the private sector, we could go back to posting pictures of boobs on this forum and move on. Lastly, the AF aint never gonna out bid the private sector, which is cool because that's not how things should roll in a republic. I hope all who reaching over temp levels of anger can find their chi under a different banner (delta, fedex, etc). In the mean time, the ART bonuses aren't too bad. Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

What 13 year guy is making $160k at Travis without the bonus? Show the numbers.

Ive seen the study. Apparently you haven't. I also can't recall the exact numbers but RAND showed getting out at ADSC was financially best (for pilot), getting out at 20 as an O-5 next, and 25 as an O-6 last. All examples included going to the airlines. There was another situation or two but I don't recall what. And yes, the difference was in millions. About $2.5M at the far end and $1M at the min. That's what the study showed. He's not making it up. What the study didn't account for was life after 65. The comparisons were all made AT 65 as I recall. So it didn't account for the value of the pension at that point (active retirement or guard/reserve retirement) or life expectancy. Nor did it account for health care costs at all. It's impossible to show accurate math because there are too many variables with companies and who the hell knows what the industry will be like in 10 years. I will say that in the late 90s, all my buds were believing the same "indefinite hiring" and "we're all gonna be rich and have tons of days off!" stories that people seem to believe wholeheartedly now. Do you guys think you'll be the only pilots in the history of the industry to go through without a major downturn (furloughs, massive pay cuts)? I hope it's true, but the airline industry has embarrassed a lot of predictions in the past. The only constant is that it's volatile. My sim partner at Delta years ago sold farm equipment 3 days a week for 2 years to get by while furloughed. That wasn't in the brochure when he was hired. Dudes keep saying you can't put a price on quality of life and that's true. Realize for many people, there is also a value to the security blanket of a pension and health care that probably exceeds its direct value. Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

Dude it is way way more involved than that...but I'll try to make it oversimplified. Ok, I'll give you a quarter mil for the airline Capts. Let compare years 13-20 in the AF with years 58-65 in the airlines (250K per year)... Year 13 in the Air Force as a C-17 pilot at Travis you're making roughly $160,000 not counting any TDY, and with the bonus. Tricare is worth another 15K so you're SAFELY making in the 175 range. And about a quarter of that isn't even taxable. That 160K only goes up as you get closer to 20. Compare that to your 250K, taxable and without medical... Its way way closer than you think. Sure the Airlines prob brings you out on top but "millions and millions" of dollars isn't true. Add in the 50K per year with full medical until you die and it gets even closer the longer you live... You can't put a price on quality of life and that's what is really driving people out.

Definitely a good read, but the massive unspoken assumption in all that is continued economic prosperity. Jump ship at 17 years service chasing the promise of those extra millions, get hired, then get furloughed in 2 years in the face of an international crisis and what are you left with? Not sure if anyone here watches world events, but there are currently more than enough boiling cauldrons of stupidity across the globe waiting for the right impetus. No one here can tell the future, it simply doesn't seem wise to pass up a secure retirement check like that. Sent from my iPad using Baseops Network Forums

That Congressman also mentioned that he recommends the Guard and Reserves open up a lot more flying positions. I've seen those spots be limited in some places and I haven't really heard much conversation about opening more spots up except for this article. It seems a lot of guys would happily fly for either of those if there were part time jobs available, but obviously that would be a big paradigm shift. Is this something being looked at seriously anywhere? I'm speaking specifcally to TFI units that could easily absorb a larger Reserve/Guard spot increase with a lack of Active Duty spots.

as someone who is coming up on eligibility soon....this is weak. I see like many have mentioned, a lot of 1-2 yr bonus takers running with their current ADSC commitments. No real change. People in the flying community want to talk about wanting more money as a bad thing. I don't think so and I totally agree it is the easiest thing to fix right now, but its not an either or. Flyers deserve both!!!!! A great bonus that makes them feel appreciated and also the better QOL and QOS talking points we have all heard. But we all know talk is cheap, so until then I want real bonus improvement, not a failed attempt to keep up with inflation.....sad. I also looked into the flight pay approval in the NSDA in section 613 i believe--flight pay can go up to 1k. So thats a 150 bump from the current 850....wow!!!!! smh! Apparently they are implementing this sometime this summer. The question is this: How are we letting fighter pilots that costs 6 million a piece to create walk away. Bc we want to quibble over a 10k/ year bonus bump when it should be atleast a 75k/yr to show they are appreciated while the AF gets the other stuff fixed....The 11M community is full steam ahead to the pilot shortages of 11F with no improvements in sight. Looks like i might be a 1-2 yr bonus taker too:) I see this getting worse, especially with no current changes in the FY 18 budget proposal...smh. In all, we COULD have both, but I guess the AF is waiting out the economy like in the past....With all major carriers hiring 6-700 pilots a year for the next decade---bold move cotton.

Every year you stay in the Air Force is a year people are giving up in seniority, which equates to millions of dollars on the back end of an airline career.

They were manned

You'd be surprised at how much living a life without the abundance of bull$hit is worth to people and if you really do the math, waiting 5 years to get a line number could cost you a million bucks on the last 5 years of an airline career. If you're someone who can deal with the BS for an extra $30k a year (about $22k after tax) and you want to stay and make a difference, more power to you. Sent from my SM-G930T using Tapatalk

I keep hearing guys say, "it's not about the money" but that's a load of bull. It may not ALL be about the money, but at some point, money talks. The AF should find solutions to most of the laundry list of reasons guys get out, but that is going to take years. Make the bonus jaw-dropping and you'll keep enough guys in to buy time to figure out how to fix the rest. I'd bet most of the guys getting hired by the majors right now are doing it for two reasons, money and work schedule. If the AF could figure out either (or both ideally), the exodus would be far more manageable.

It's a spoof article, but as a Nevada County resident, it took me about 3/4 of the way through to realize it. People here are a strange breed of secessionist redneck hippie. Which I guess means they're just Libertarians.

https://futurism.com/lockheed-confirms-secretive-sr-72-hypersonic-plane-will-be-made/

Well if a robot = an A/A kill, then I know multiple, unrecognized aces.

As has already been stated, I'm sure PA had him wear the hat. But honestly, how is it any less gay than the stupid ass bi-fold hats we wear now? Bring on the the squadron baseball hats!

Don't spend one second worrying about UPT until you start...Kenny's advice is solid! The right gouge will be there at the right time, so don't sweat it now.

To the bar (the squadron bar if able), the strip club, sorority parties, Vegas, out on a boat... While you're at it, buy a motorcycle or sports car you can't really afford, travel wherever you can, make a bunch of questionable choices while staying out of jail. Serious advice. Sent from my SM-G920V using Tapatalk

Just another indicator of how self-indoctrinated AF leadership is; pilots are saying LOUD AND CLEAR precisely what is wrong with the AF that is making them leave, and the Generals are intentionally choosing not to tackle any of those things to help fix retention. Maybe if we start poisoning the well for their job prospects on the outside, we'll keep them in. YGBSM. Fuck you and the horse you rode in on, Generals.

I want to know who the first dumb bastard is that accepts the 13 year option. After 20 yrs you get a ~50k per year bonus for doing nothing. Sent from my iPhone using Baseops Network Forums

So the draft outline for the script for Top Gun 2 has leaked (probably Trump and/or Russians. Same thing, right?): "TOP GUN 2: This Time It's Non-Gender Specific" Having been caught up in the 'Fat Leonard' supply scandal, former Rear Admiral, now Captain Pete 'Maverick' Mitchell is given his final assignment as the Commanding Officer, Naval Fighter Weapons School, Miramar Naval Air Station, California. Having been the number two graduate of his class in 1986, 'Maverick's' has unique insight into what the daring young aviators have to face in flying their high-performance, stomach-churning aerial chargers in modern air combat. SCENE 1: 'Maverick' is shown being given a ticket by the Shore Patrol after he was caught driving his Lexus on the flight line road trying to keep up with an F-18 doing touch-and-goes, exceeding the station's 25 mph speed limit by nearly 8 mph. SCENE 2: 'Maverick' puts the auditorium at ease to welcome the Class of 2017B. The roster includes three women, a two-dude married couple, one undeclared person, and four heterosexual men; one black, one Hispanic, one Asian, one White. "Ladies and gentlemen, welcome to Top Gun. I am Captain Maverick Mitchell and I want...yes? What is it, lieutenant?" "Sir, you only welcomed the ladies - which is a very patriarchacal thing to do - and the men - which just demonstrates their historic privilege. But you didn't include the zir. I am offended and have uploaded your comments to youtube. I assume I will be receiving an apology from the Department of the Navy and you after the press conference with Gloria Allred?" SCENE 3: Operations Officer Holly 'Diaper' Nowak briefing the class for a mission: "Today, you are scheduled for a 4v4 DACT - Hornets against the 3rd generation contract air. Unfortunately, the MC rate won't support it, so "Snowflake" and "Cis-G" you two will go fly a BFM. The rest of you can knock out some of your CBTs." SCENE 4: Having sweated their way through the CBTs, the 2017B class makes its way over to the Miramar All-Ranks Club where the SARC and Alcohol Prevention offices check their IDs at the door, carefully noting their data, and placing their CAC cards in the file to be retrieved on the way out, after the mandatory breathalyzer and room sweep checking for sexual assault victims. Finally making their way to the near-empty bar, as the Isley Brothers "You've lost that lovin' feelin'" begins to blare from the speakers, the four heterosexual men are accosted by the irate school instructor that looks remarkably like Kelly McGillis. But not the hot, wild-haired Kelly. No this the haggish, yet with an Adam's apple, Kelly who instantly begins to berate them for building the modern world. SCENE 5: Meanwhile, in an unnamed Middle Eastern country, the despot that rules that arid, worthless land gases and kills his citizens. Despite it having absolutely no strategic value to the United States, the President, fully backed by the hawks in Congress dependent upon the defense contractors in their districts, sends a short-manned carrier battle group to the region. Why it's short-manned, especially in pilots, is never questioned. Class 2017B receives its orders to man, er, person-up the carrier's flight department despite not having worked up or being current in carrier operations. Stepping into their F-35Cs, they find out that "this helmet is too heavy." This ejection seat is "too tall." But this all-seeing, all-knowing fighter is "just right." Flying an Alpha strike (not your father's Vietnam Alpha strike of 50 jets), this one has four F-35s and two UCAVs, our class of heroes flies into the double-digit SAM rings where they all synch their Blueteeth to some Starbuck's selected folk-rock tunes and proceed to ISR the hell out of the dirt. They return to the boat, all take the three wire, shut down. And hand in their separation papers since they each got a call from major airline. AND CUT...

Sir/Ma'am, Thank you for your concern. AFI 13-6969 only directs us to look at x, y, and z when determining continuation. The AFI doesn't direct us to look at AFSC when determining continuation, therefore we do not. Given the complex nature of continuation, it would be unrealistic to expect perfection. May I suggest you refer your concerns about the AFI to it's OPR? You can find that information on the cover page of AFI 13-6969. R/S, SrA Shoeclerk McDilligaf