I should be leaving the Air Force soon if they process my paperwork right this time.

I spent a lot of time stuck in places and airframes I didn't want to be in. It was UPT and AMC. I didn't end up there due to bad performance, it was mostly due to luck and timing. I had a really hard time watching people who failed courses, struggled in UPT, got in trouble, get the assignments I wanted due to missing VMLs, waivers needed for instructor duty, changing rules, or other factors.

I feel like my youth was just... wasted and I have little to show for it. I don't have much pride in what I accomplished and I never was truly engaged or challenged.

I am angry I spent 15 years of my life generally working hard and not screwing up like many of my peers and I got exactly what I didn't want.

I have a CJO lined up which is great, but I am concerned I am going to spend the rest of my life unsatisfied because I never really scratched the itch of getting enough action or getting anything I wanted out of the Air Force. Some people suggested I stay, but after being dragged through the mud for 10 years I have significant trust issues with the institution, and watching better people than me leave for the Airlines says a lot.

Am I missing something? Was this is it, and does it get better when you separate? I don't want to be resentful for the rest of my life.

Edited yesterday at 03:18 AM1 day by illusive
spelling

That sucks, but also only you can control your attitude. Go forward with life choosing a positive outlook and find something that gives you purpose/sense of accomplishment. The airlines are great for pay/benefits/QOL, but you will get zero feelings of accomplishment or satisfaction out of it. Your AF career should not define the rest of your life.

The way you phrase it makes it sound like you have a superiority complex and blame external things when you don't get what you want. That may or may not be true, but that's the one-post impression.

If the AF doesn't do it for you, go seek greener pastures. Figure out what is important to you, and go do that.

Best wishes that you find what fulfills you.

Edited yesterday at 05:18 AM1 day by raimius
Can't type.

I felt similarly on my way out. Almost a decade later I'm grateful for the training that's enabled me to go out to civilian life and make more money than I ever thought was possible. Once it started to stack up, it got much easier to look back without resentment.

Definitely recommend getting out.

Like others said its an awesome new chapter and its up to you on how you look back. Accept the dogshit but embrace the good (people, good trips, etc.). Don't try and paint it perfect.

You are gonna find a lot of people are having a similar experience. There is a 311 page thread about what's wrong with big blue.

Edited yesterday at 01:26 PM1 day by jonlbs

5 minutes ago, jonlbs said:

Definitely recommend getting out.

Like others said its an awesome new chapter and its up to you on how you look back. Accept the dogshit but embrace the good (people, good trips, etc.).

You are gonna find a lot of people are having a similar experience. There is a 311 page thread about what's wrong with big blue.

Thanks, it seems more common these days than not.

8 hours ago, raimius said:

The way you phrase it makes it sound like you have a superiority complex and blame external things when you don't get what you want. That may or may not be true, but that's the one-post impression.

If the AF doesn't do it for you, go seek greener pastures. Figure out what is important to you, and go do that.

Best wishes that you find what fulfills you.

Yeah I didn’t word things really well. Long story short I got a really bad must-film because people couldn’t or wouldn’t upgrade/pass training and I’ve been stuck ever since.

11 hours ago, illusive said:

I am angry I spent 15 years of my life generally working hard and not screwing up like many of my peers and I got exactly what I didn't want.

Honest question: You're punching out at the 15 year mark?

38 minutes ago, Blue said:

Honest question: You're punching out at the 15 year mark?

Not commissioned, I’m including the time it took to get the commission too as time spent chasing this dream. Commissioned it’s about 11.

For any young readers seeing this, I will say a lot depends on the community you go to, the average leadership in that community, etc etc. We all complain about the same things (aircrew have a masters degree in sport bitching), but in the end I don’t personally know a single pilot who has left the AF with extreme dissatisfaction. Obviously it happens, but I do not think it’s the norm. I think it’s fairly normal to be glad you’re getting out at that specific point in life, but don’t mistake that for equating to “it was all terrible, I hated every minute, and it was totally not worth my time.” I’m excited to be done soon and fully transition to”phase 2” of life, but in spite of the BS that drives me crazy, the last ~20 years has been phenomenal overall and I have no ragrets.

Two words… Go Guard/Reserve. .you got 11 years invested don’t throw it away

for sure get out, go airlines, and part time guard/reserve.

luck and timing affects us all. move forward and don't look back life is too short to be miserable.

51 minutes ago, BashiChuni said:

for sure get out, go airlines, and part time guard/reserve.

luck and timing affects us all. move forward and don't look back life is too short to be miserable.

Working it, I have a guard unit lined up so maybe that will change some things when I get in a different environment

Absolutely talk to the Guard. You can pick mission within reason. Try for a different mission set. ANG removes many of the active duty pain points and allows you to keep earning time toward retirement.

1 hour ago, illusive said:

Working it, I have a guard unit lined up so maybe that will change some things when I get in a different environment

To this point specifically, don't listen to the people telling you that you're wasting 11 years by not chasing the retirement.

The money you make at the airlines can be astronomical. It will more than make up for the retirement, including the medical coverage. That being said, the guard and reserve are a great way to get to retirement after you have a seniority number at the airlines.

But if the military made you as unhappy as it sounds, the garden reserve are not going to be enough of a change for you. Especially the way they are these days.

To the broader topic, I was fortunate enough to figure out the game very early in my career. So I just didn't do the things that I didn't want to do or didn't enjoy doing. The catch to the whole system is that you have to do a bunch of unpleasant stuff to get ahead, but getting ahead just puts you in a position to have to do more unpleasant stuff.

Some people loved the queep. Some people tolerated it. I hated it. So I didn't do it. Now ironically my Air Force career ended rather spectacularly for unrelated reasons, but even if I hadn't been court-martialed, my career was never going to go anywhere. I flew a lot, that's about it.

It would have been more upsetting if I had put a lot of effort in to things I hated doing.

But still. Suck it up. It's just work

Once again I'll disagree with Ratner and do it in a less verbose fashion. Finding the right guard/reserve unit is an absolute game changer. This isn't just work for everyone and it only takes one or two bad leaders on AD to be the difference from the best 20 years of your life to 10+ years of "fuck this shit..." I know a number of CAF dudes that have had similar experiences. I've been there myself. That being said, there are guard/reserve units that have all the things AD should have (good leaders, commaraderie, purpose etc.). Good luck.

Edited 16 hours ago16 hr by Boomer6

To pile on, I had subpar leadership most of my career, with exception to my last assignment (SQ/CC and both DOs were amazing). I left AD this last year for a Legacy airline and a Reserve unit. First year out was a little bit of a challenge, airline training while not hard is fast paced, a FTU for the reserve gig, lots of changes. That being said, it my situation it was 100% worth it. I’m much happier, make more money, and enjoy my time home more. Best of luck, everything is what you make it, and having a good attitude is free.

28 minutes ago, Boomer6 said:

Once again I'll disagree with Ratner and do it in a less verbose fashion. Finding the right guard/reserve unit is an absolute game changer. This isn't just work for everyone and it only takes one or two bad leaders on AD to be the difference from the best 20 years of your life to 10+ years of "fuck this shit..." I know a number of CAF dudes that have had similar experiences. I've been there myself. That being said, there are guard/reserve units that have all the things AD should have (good leaders, commaraderie, purpose etc.). Good luck.

Lol, that post wasn't for you. And not just because I didn't include any pictures.

You're more of a "color inside the lines" guy. Nothing wrong with that, the military needs guys like you more than it needs guys like me.

But our disgruntled poster here is either a "why do things that way when it doesn't make sense" type of guy, or he just expects his rewards to be a direct reflection of his efforts. The military has never and will never be a great place for those type of people.

Addressing the OP: If you thought the USAF screwed you over, just wait until you experience an airline during contract negotiations. It sounds like outside influences have been crafted your outlook for you. It may be completely true that you were actively screwed by the system, but getting bitter only means you're letting the system win. The airlines will happily assume the role of screwing you over if you let them. I can show you a large collection of 30-year widebody captains making millions of dollars who are thoroughly convinced they've been screwed by the system. They are no fun to be around. It's all perspective. Pick your's with care.

Choose gratitude instead of trying to pinpoint who's screwing you over. The answer to that question will always be "someone and/or everyone". Conversely, if you focus on what you're grateful for, you'll find a lot of good things in life. Pick one, you can't focus on both.

I punched at 17 years and joined the reserves for 3 years. Now I'm at a major airline. In all three of those locations it is VERY easy to look around and wonder why the grass isn't as green as advertised. Reality is that the grass on the other side is just a different kind of grass. Once you get into a new organization, you'll see all the warts. You get to decide if it's good or bad, but if you let the system decide, it'll definitely suck.

Truths: The system (usaf or corporate) doesn't owe you anything. Your hard work will be overlooked, but it will craft your reputation among your peers. Once you're gone, the system won't care. Maximize your personal gain without screwing others over, ignore the BS, do your work will, keep your integrity in tact, find a niche you can enjoy.

Focus on good things, and your next career will be great. Focus on the hate, and you'll hate it. It's a DAILY choice.

Edited 10 hours ago10 hr by FourFans

Thank you all for the advice. I didn't want labels to be thrown around. I tried to prepare myself for the adage of "luck and timing" and "no good deed goes unpunished" early in my journey. I don't want to give up too much details about my career but like, holy sh*t. I even begged for any 365s and AFPAK hands and that didn't even work.

I hope I will get a better attitude when I am finally in a different environment after 5 years.

I didn't know how common it was to part ways and be full of regrets but I think I got some of my questions answered even if it will be really difficult to put into practice.

I left active duty decades ago after getting hosed bigger than Dallas and getting the shoulder shrug when I asked someone to explain what happened. It was a bitter pill to swallow but the AF paid for my education, my training, and gave me job experience that I could use elsewhere. I initially went full time with the Reserves then got hired on with the airlines, went part time, still got promoted, and retired years later.

Not having to move every 3-4 years, I got to pick where we live and 25 years ago became part of a wonderful small town. I didn't have too worry about the next job, the next promotion, the next school, or what the AF might do to me next.

Even with getting hosed on active duty and going through 9/11, faux bankruptcy, age 65, real bankruptcy, and a couple mergers at the airline, I'm retiring in 9 months with more money than I'll ever spend.

Revenge may not be the best word but success is the best form of it. I still look back at getting screwed over as a personal insult but, in reality, I'm far better off than had I stayed in.

So, the point of all this is you have skills that the AF is throwing away. Take those skills elsewhere and you can be quite successful and happy with your life. Best of luck to you.

You're not necessarily leaving with nothing. You received skills/experience that landed you a CJO, hopefully with a legacy, which is a pretty amazing job. You also learned many skills that you probably don't even realize are skills because it's just normal amongst your peers in the military. Hopefully you also gained some great life experiences, friendships, etc... You should also be leaving with some TSP, so if you don't want to join the ANG/RES then you're not totally losing out there.

If you want to join the ANG, the world is your oyster. Get into a squadron and seek opportunities outside of the base, we've had guys all over the place the last 10 years. We've sent IP's/FL's to overseas AD bases for 60-90 day stints. We've had a guy on MLOA from the airlines, in cush gig at USAFE for years. He keeps broadcasting other gigs that are available for the taking, shockingly no takers lol. We have another guy who just got back from Hickam, who only came home because he got a SQ/CC spot on base....his orders were indefinite. A few years ago they came around asking if anyone wanted to take three year orders at some pretty decent AD locations overseas (not today satan lol).

Luck of the draw on getting "action," many of us are were in the same boat. I had a squadron mate who PCS'd to Luke a month before his squadron went to Desert Storm I. He then flew F-16 continuously, until 2015 and never once employed a weapon in combat. He had a 26 year career during near continuous combat operations and he only slung concrete at ranges in the U.S. We had an uncanny ability to end up in deployed locations during down times or where the ROE was so tight, we were just very expensive, high-speed cheerleaders.

As to your job satisfaction, I understand that to an extent. It sucks to end up where you don't want to be, but as already stated, only you can control your attitude. As Rainman (don't say his name 2 more times lol) used to say, "bloom where you're planted." Frankly, I enjoyed my flying career in the military (Guard guy only because an mentor who was hosed by AD pushed me that way), but the more I learn, the more I get pissed about how many lives were lost (continue to be lost) and how much of our lives were wasted in the never ending quagmires. However, I have just learned to let it go, not worth dwelling on, life is too short!

If you're the type that needs satisfaction from work, I have bad news, you probably won't find it flying 121. I find that work isn't where I want to seek satisfaction in life. I still strive for excellence and it's great to enjoy your job, but what I love about this gig is that it gives me an insane amount of time off, with plenty of money to do the things that really make me happy. I can work six days in a month and make more than I ever made as a 22 year LTC. That gives me plenty of time to go make up for lost time hanging family, flying my own planes and travel to places other than the green bean in yet another deployed shithole.

Best of luck and thanks for attending my SocialDtalk.

Get out and go Guard or Reserve.

I absolutely understand what you are saying...I saw it time and time again. Many times it is luck and timing other times it is the broken system that is our USAF.

In UPT a dude in our sister class got a DUI AND tried to fight the cops, he still graduated top 3. He was also a complete Chode but he was an academy grad (as was his father), and a lot of senior people stepped in to influence the process. It was blatant and soured a lot of people. In other cases we see people like Fat Tony not only survive but thrive despite ruining careers and extreme narcissism. It is not fair.

A CJO is a great thing for you and your family, a fresh start but I can almost guarantee you will see things in your airline career that will anger you and make you shake your head in disgust. Going Guard or Reserve can also serve as a fresh start, but you have to know you will find warts on that side of the fence.

All of that being said, life is not fair...it just isn't and the sooner you accept that and make the best of where you are, the happier and likely more successful you will be.

Good luck!