waveshaper Posted May 29, 2014 Share Posted May 29, 2014 Maybe extra money will help? How bout a medal?http://www.airforcetimes.com/article/20140529/NEWS/305290064/Bonuses-incentive-pay-approved-some-missileersDo you get a Light Brown Tater Tot Cluster for subsequent awards of this medal? 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Breckey Posted May 29, 2014 Share Posted May 29, 2014 I've sat almost 2000 hours of alert defending america from the terrorists and hippies. How many tater tot clusters does that entail? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
10percenttruth Posted May 29, 2014 Share Posted May 29, 2014 I've sat almost 2000 hours of alert defending america from the terrorists and hippies. How many tater tot clusters does that entail? For the 5th subsequent award of a bronze tater tot device, you're entitled to a silver Star Wars emblem Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TreeA10 Posted May 29, 2014 Share Posted May 29, 2014 I've sat almost 2000 hours of alert defending america from the terrorists and hippies. How many tater tot clusters does that entail? Tater tots with extra salt and all the ketchup you want. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JarheadBoom Posted May 30, 2014 Share Posted May 30, 2014 I've sat almost 2000 hours of alert defending america from the terrorists and hippies. How many tater tot clusters does that entail? AFI36-2803, CH. 69 6.9.6.9: A maximum of four bronze tater tot devices shall be worn on the Nuclear Deterrence Operations Service Medal at any time. Upon award of a fifth tater tot device, and at each multiple of five tater tot devices thereafter, members shall attach a cheeseburger device, silver in color, to the medal. Upon award of a fifth silver cheeseburger device, members shall attach a cheeseburger device, gold in color, to the medal. 6.9.6.9.1: It is not expected that any member will survive the award of five gold cheeseburger devices, therefore no further devices are authorized. I found this interesting, in a "I just threw up in my mouth a little" way... James has said the creation of new medals or awards are one way to address issues of low morale that have been “systemic” among the missileer force. 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MSCguy Posted May 30, 2014 Share Posted May 30, 2014 Per that article that missileer bonus is payable at the completion of initial skills training. So if someone were to complete missileer school and cash the bonus for doing so and then "develops a medical problem" and gets taken off PRP, do they keep that bonus cash? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
F16Rooster Posted May 30, 2014 Share Posted May 30, 2014 "These midlevel commanders would help decrease the “micromanaging” from higher commanders that missileers have complained about." Shenanigans! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pawnman Posted May 30, 2014 Share Posted May 30, 2014 Per that article that missileer bonus is payable at the completion of initial skills training. So if someone were to complete missileer school and cash the bonus for doing so and then "develops a medical problem" and gets taken off PRP, do they keep that bonus cash? They should make it like flight pay. You have to pull x number of shifts in the hole per month to be eligible. You can even do gates. Then make missileer WG/CC, OG/CC, and SQ/CCs pull those alerts to retain the incentive pay, much like we do in the flying world. And just as folks who are long-term DNIF will lose their flight pay, we also take missileer pay away from folks who go long-term medical DQ from PRP. 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Co Th G Posted May 30, 2014 Share Posted May 30, 2014 Just curious, but how does the present day working conditions compare to the working conditions of the Missileers during the heyday of SAC? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Breckey Posted May 30, 2014 Share Posted May 30, 2014 They used to have 4 missileers at each LCC and they would work a 12-on 12-off schedule. Now it's 2 guys working a 24 hour shift not including the 2-3 hour drive time to the site each way and the pre/post alert duties. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
brickhistory Posted May 30, 2014 Share Posted May 30, 2014 They used to have 4 missileers at each LCC and they would work a 12-on 12-off schedule. Now it's 2 guys working a 24 hour shift not including the 2-3 hour drive time to the site each way and the pre/post alert duties. That changed multiple times throughout the SAC years. In my Reagan-era missileer days, before receiving my pardon from the ND governor (and I still have one medium-weight felony to be committed for time pre-emptively served), it was two guys for 24-ish hours. Usual time from checking out the truck to checking it back in was 32-36 hours. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Skitzo Posted May 31, 2014 Share Posted May 31, 2014 Give them back their blue bags. Morale issue solved. Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MSCguy Posted May 31, 2014 Share Posted May 31, 2014 Revolvers too to go along with the blue bags? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Skitzo Posted May 31, 2014 Share Posted May 31, 2014 Why not? Blue bags were distinguished. A pair of six shooters on the hip seals the deal. Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HercDude Posted June 5, 2014 Share Posted June 5, 2014 James has said the creation of new medals or awards are one way to address issues of low morale that have been “systemic” among the missileer force. Holy balls! That this quote came from the SECAF elevates this to the "What's Wrong with the Air Force" discussion in my mind. ---I know! Let's add yet another "here is a piece of ribbon for doing your job" medal to the growing list. That will keep them happy and definitely make people want to keep working here! Hi-5 guys!--- This is actually how they think? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Karl Hungus Posted June 5, 2014 Share Posted June 5, 2014 Holy balls! That this quote came from the SECAF elevates this to the "What's Wrong with the Air Force" discussion in my mind. ---I know! Let's add yet another "here is a piece of ribbon for doing your job" medal to the growing list. That will keep them happy and definitely make people want to keep working here! Hi-5 guys!--- This is actually how they think? Politician managers. The appearance of fixing things is more important than actually fixing things. Move on to the next job and it'll be someone else's problem. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Homestar Posted June 5, 2014 Share Posted June 5, 2014 Holy balls! That this quote came from the SECAF elevates this to the "What's Wrong with the Air Force" discussion in my mind. ---I know! Let's add yet another "here is a piece of ribbon for doing your job" medal to the growing list. That will keep them happy and definitely make people want to keep working here! Hi-5 guys!--- This is actually how they think? Reminds me of "ooh, piece of candy." https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=90Ps2L46dUs 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SuperWSO Posted July 3, 2014 Share Posted July 3, 2014 Saw this and was surprised it wasn't already here. You can check out the full article, but the money quote has to be in the last paragraph. Lt. Col. Steven Folds of the 20th Air Force said he was optimistic that the new operations officers would be helpful in translating the orders of commanders into a language that young personnel in their first assignments and enlisted crews could understand. I believe there was a problem with the flow of information in that career field, but I don't think that "commander down" was the direction that they had trouble with. 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BitteEinBit Posted July 3, 2014 Share Posted July 3, 2014 Saw this and was surprised it wasn't already here. You can check out the full article, but the money quote has to be in the last paragraph. "Lt. Col. Steven Folds of the 20th Air Force said he was optimistic that the new operations officers would be helpful in translating the orders of commanders into a language that young personnel in their first assignments and enlisted crews could understand." I believe there was a problem with the flow of information in that career field, but I don't think that "commander down" was the direction that they had trouble with. Now, I've seen my fair share of socially awkward managers...you know the ones you hate to see speak in public because it is just too painful to watch. But, are they saying that we've promoted so many of those types of managers who can't hold a normal conversation with their "troops" that we need translators to get the message to the workerbees?!? FAIL Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SuperWSO Posted July 3, 2014 Share Posted July 3, 2014 (edited) http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fXSLcYQHqFQEdit: me no good embed video. Edited July 3, 2014 by SuperWSO 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Blue Posted July 4, 2014 Share Posted July 4, 2014 Saw this and was surprised it wasn't already here. You can check out the full article, but the money quote has to be in the last paragraph. I believe there was a problem with the flow of information in that career field, but I don't think that "commander down" was the direction that they had trouble with. Linked at the bottom of that article was this article, from about a week prior. Air Force General Wants Less 'Micromanaging' of Missileers Achieving better morale within the U.S. Air Force's nuclear missileer corps hinges on less micromanaging of its members, says their commander. "The best way to produce leaders of the future is to make sure that when they are junior you properly educate and train them and you let them make decisions," 20th Air Force head Maj. Gen. Jack Weinstein told the Associated Press. Sounds like they're maybe sorta on the right course. But then it also contains this gem: However, the former operational head of one-third of the ICBM missile corps, Col. Robert Vercher, said the approach was important for the Air Force's nuclear weapons mission. "You might call it micromanagement, but I would call it oversight -- proper oversight," said Vercher, who is switching to a new job with Strategic Command after being the commander until Tuesday of the 91st Missile Wing at Minot Air Force Base in North Dakota. "When I hear the word 'micromanagement' I go, 'It depends.' How much do you want your tax return micromanaged by your accountant? Exquisitely or just kind of haphazardly?" Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Breckey Posted July 4, 2014 Share Posted July 4, 2014 Vercher is was the genesis of the most recent round of ass-pain for the Missile Wings. As can be gathered from the quoteabove he didn't micromanage, it was "aggressive oversight." As the OG/CC at FEW he required the helicopter squadron to brief him the risk assessment on every sortie. He also prevented them from flying 30 minutes to Fort Collins to perform instruments because it was "out of the local area". Once he became the MW/CC at Minot he and the other MW/CCs had a pissing contest on who could be the most restrictive. We were prevented from flying any sortie with a flight engineer up front, even though it was required by MAJCOM MDSv1 training requirements. 20% of our FE force was prevented from flying without an IF for 6 months because they couldn't complete the required syllabus and MAJCOM and the MWs were in a pissing contest on who would fold first. His incident response to the Minot H-1 mishap was horrendous and was part of the impetus to the Huey squadrons are now leaving the MWs and will fall under a new Helicopter Ops Group. Unfortunately managers like him ascend the ladder and make policy. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bender Posted July 4, 2014 Share Posted July 4, 2014 Unfortunately managers like him ascend the ladder and make policy. Oh dear. This sounds like a case study someone should be collecting to write a report to congress. I don't necessarily want them in our shit (i.e. Confirmations), but it's hard to argue with at times. Bendy Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Breckey Posted July 30, 2014 Share Posted July 30, 2014 ICBMs have a WIC Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
slackline Posted July 30, 2014 Share Posted July 30, 2014 Wow. This is an absolutely brutal commentary on the Air Force and our nukes: He says of Maj Gen Carey: "Take a moment to consider the run of poor decisions that are required before you're being told you can't play guitar with a Beatles cover band when you're drunk at a Mexican restaurant in Russia..... Then consider this man was in charge of our deadliest nuclear warheads." What's up with the guy wearing the WIC patch? That was awesome! Posted from the NEW Baseops.net App! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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