February 25, 201114 yr Boeing's website says it is a KC-10 style boom with ALAS and IDS. Looks like it is possibly a camera system, though, from what I can tell. The avionics look decent on the pilot side. Boeing reps told me in '07 that the USAF couldn't afford for them to redesign the empanage to install a sighting door/window like the -135. So cameras it is.
February 25, 201114 yr #3 Here's to 50 more years of USAF tanker toads getting type ratings in airplanes the airlines no longer fly. I couldn't help but laugh when I read that one...because it's so true...
February 25, 201114 yr I couldn't help but laugh when I read that one...because it's so true... Not so true. With my DC-10 type, I'm a shoe in @ airlines such as Biman Bangladesh & World Airways. Just waiting for this new round of VSP to come through. Edited because I guess BB just retired their last 3-holer Edited February 25, 201114 yr by Techsan
February 25, 201114 yr I couldn't help but laugh when I read that one...because it's so true... By the time the KC-46A becomes operational in the early 2020s, after the numerous lawsuits, cost overruns, budget cuts, BRAC politics, etc, the key to getting hired in the civilian world will be a UAV type...
February 25, 201114 yr #3 Here's to 50 more years of USAF tanker toads getting type ratings in airplanes the airlines no longer fly. Gee - I don't remember that being a contract requirement for the bid. Maybe EADS can use the fact that pilots that fly their A330 will have a type rating that is truly marketable on the outside and therefore more pilots will be willing to serve in the AF and therefore pilot recruiting costs will be lower in the long run and so they have a point they can use in the their bid protest. Just kidding Tanker guys. I think we are all happy just to fly an aircraft (except maybe Predator guys) and getting a type rating on a current in use airframe is a nice bennie none of have to have to keep us flying and happy. Boeing - Congrats on the win. Now just don't screw it up.
February 25, 201114 yr Gee - I don't remember that being a contract requirement for the bid. Maybe EADS can use the fact that pilots that fly their A330 will have a type rating that is truly marketable on the outside and therefore more pilots will be willing to serve in the AF and therefore pilot recruiting costs will be lower in the long run and so they have a point they can use in the their bid protest. Just kidding Tanker guys. I think we are all happy just to fly an aircraft (except maybe Predator guys) and getting a type rating on a current in use airframe is a nice bennie none of have to have to keep us flying and happy. Boeing - Congrats on the win. Now just don't screw it up. Your humor detector is INOP.
February 25, 201114 yr Who gives a sh!t. I am just happy to get a 30 year old design and a newly built airplane over a 60 year old design and built 50 years ago.... Here's to hoping that Boeing really, really, really, really over-engineered the 135!
February 25, 201114 yr I really don't want the next headline about this to be "EADS taking AF, Boeing to court over tanker victory"...... Or Obama could stop the whole thing by just telling the French to f* off because he wants to keep the jobs and the money in the US. I'm certain Sarkozy wouldn't hesitate to do the same to us...
February 25, 201114 yr Or Obama could stop the whole thing by just telling the French to f* off because he wants to keep the jobs and the money in the US. I'm certain Sarkozy wouldn't hesitate to do the same to us... True. What I'm waiting for is GE to demand a second engine option.
February 25, 201114 yr Or Obama could stop the whole thing by just telling the French to f* off because he wants to keep the jobs and the money in the US. I say, not likely. He hasn't the balls for it, and may not want to do it anyway. If EADS creates enough jobs in the US, then Obama can stop the Boeing sale, and give it to EADS. After all, aren't the French our biggest ally? Don't count out any weird and bizarre scenario when it comes to current political decision making. FM
February 25, 201114 yr True. What I'm waiting for is GE to demand a second engine option. I get your joke, but you do know the CF6 is made by GE right?
February 25, 201114 yr Looks like this win will save the 767 assembly line from the moth ball treatment... https://active.boeing.com/commercial/orders/index.cfm Only 3 orders for 2011.
February 25, 201114 yr I get your joke, but you do know the CF6 is made by GE right? Yes, and everything I've read says that Boeing put the offer together with the PW 4062 on the wings... hence the joke.
February 25, 201114 yr Yes, and everything I've read says that Boeing put the offer together with the PW 4062 on the wings... hence the joke. Ah, my bad, I thought the CF6 was the only 767 engine. Well, GE's getting business to put them on C-5Ms, so... I think I heard that Boeing recently built up a new 767 assembly line on the backside of the Everett factory - move the line out of where it is now and make room for more 787s (though building those isn't a problem in Everett right now, it's where to put them once they're assembled).
February 26, 201114 yr Ah, my bad, I thought the CF6 was the only 767 engine. Well, GE's getting business to put them on C-5Ms, so... I think I heard that Boeing recently built up a new 767 assembly line on the backside of the Everett factory - move the line out of where it is now and make room for more 787s (though building those isn't a problem in Everett right now, it's where to put them once they're assembled). Buyers can get the choice of GE, Pratts, or Rolls on the 76s. But GE has plenty of business from Big Blue, including a slightly possible purchase of new CFM-56s to replace the "new" CFMs on the -135s. Remember, the early 1980's re-engining is new in -135 terms.
February 26, 201114 yr Remember, the early 1980's re-engining is new in -135 terms. Yeah, waiting around for your fourth re-engine really blows...
February 26, 201114 yr Yeah, waiting around for your fourth re-engine really blows... Not my point, I love the engines. Just simply pointing out the time-line of recapitalization that impacts nearly every AF MWS in the inventory.
March 31, 201114 yr Boeing receives subsidies from the US "It's time for Boeing to stop denying or minimising the massive illegal subsidies it gets," said Rainer Ohler, head of public affairs at Airbus. Ironic at all?
March 31, 201114 yr Boeing receives subsidies from the US Ironic at all? The subsidies included money for research and development from the Nasa space agency, a panel of international trade judges has ruled. I guess I don't understand how NASA contracting you for research is illegal.
March 31, 201114 yr Boeing receives subsidies from the US Ironic at all? Nope...if you actually READ the article you will see the WTO ruled Airbus received FOUR TIMES the subsidies the Boeing did... Even if Boeing received the same $20 Billion that Airbus got I would still say buy Boeing, it is American. Adios Airbus...move along...and while your at it go find that plane that fell into the Atlantic.
March 31, 201114 yr Nope...if you actually READ the article you will see the WTO ruled Airbus received FOUR TIMES the subsidies the Boeing did... Even if Boeing received the same $20 Billion that Airbus got I would still say buy Boeing, it is American. Adios Airbus...move along...and while your at it go find that plane that fell into the Atlantic. Airbus bitching about anyone receiving subsidies is just stupid. Pot, kettle...black. But I would argue that a NASA contract is no where near a subsidie...in fact...it's work. But it said that some of the subsidies, including the Nasa contracts and some tax breaks, had had a serious impact on Airbus' interests. "The effect of these subsidies was displacement and impedance of Airbus large civil aircraft from third country markets, significant price suppression and significant lost sales," said the WTO in a statement. I hope this was misquoted...how the fuck does a NASA contract prevent Airbus from selling their jets to 3rd world countries? Last I checked...NASA has never been interested in the technology surrounding B737's or BBJ's... ARES 4? Yes. X-48? Yes. X-43? Yes. Not a lot of practical civil technology in there...
July 3, 201114 yr https://www.aviationweek.com/aw/generic/story_generic.jsp?channel=aerospacedaily&id=news/asd/2011/06/29/01.xml&headline=Boeing%20Liable%20For%20KC-46%20Overage The U.S. Air Force is expecting to pay the largest amount allowable under the KC-46A contract with Boeing to develop a KC-135 refueler replacement, with Boeing picking up the rest of the tab. Two months after Boeing won the contract over rival EADS, which proposed an Airbus A330-based design, the Air Force got news that it would need to pay an additional $500 million to develop the 767-based tanker and deliver the first 18 aircraft. The target cost agreed upon in February for the fixed-price, incentive-fee development was $4.4 billion, according to Air Force officials. However, “Boeing revealed, post-contract award on 25 April 2011, that during source selection it proposed a ceiling price for the [engineering and manufacturing development] contract that is less than its actual projected cost to execute the contract,” says Lt. Col. Jack Miller, an Air Force spokesman, in a statement. “Boeing is liable for all cost above the $4.9 billion contract ceiling.” Imagine that, Boeing lied about their price to get a contract...
July 3, 201114 yr https://www.aviationweek.com/aw/generic/story_generic.jsp?channel=aerospacedaily&id=news/asd/2011/06/29/01.xml&headline=Boeing%20Liable%20For%20KC-46%20Overage Imagine that, Boeing lied about their price to get a contract... Boeing didn't lie...this is pretty much how fixed-price incentive contracts work. The thing is that Boeing is out of rope for overages in the EMD phase. Anything above $4.9B, and they have to pay (which the article implies that they will be).
July 4, 201114 yr Boeing didn't lie...this is pretty much how fixed-price incentive contracts work. The thing is that Boeing is out of rope for overages in the EMD phase. Anything above $4.9B, and they have to pay (which the article implies that they will be). And it's money well spent for Boeing. EADS would likely have been doing the same thing.
December 21, 201113 yr Anyone at EGUN get to see it? Italians Bring New 767 Tanker to Mildenhall: The Italian Air Force visited the 100th Air Refueling Wing at RAF Mildenhall, Britain, with one of its newly acquired Boeing KC-767 tankers. "We are trying to start an exchange program with the US Air Force, so they invited us here so we could show them our aircraft," said Italian Lt. Col. Mauro Del Giudice, 14th Wing operations chief and command pilot. The Italians are still training to refuel using the 767's boom. So far, they have been employing only the aircraft's drogue refueling system and are only cleared to refuel Italian aircraft. "For us, it's an opportunity to work with the best in the world, so we can learn from them," explained Del Giudice. During the visit, which began on Dec. 9, Del Giudice and an Italian boom operator flew on two KC-135 missions to observe refueling operations up close. USAF's in-development KC-46A tanker also is based on the 767 airframe. (Mildenhall report by Karen Abeyasekere)
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