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?s on ADSC (Active Duty Service Commitment)

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You can always fail 4 PT tests in 2 years.  And that is still an honorable discharge at the end.  You might not like the things that happen during those two years, though.

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20 minutes ago, pawnman said:

You can always fail 4 PT tests in 2 years.  And that is still an honorable discharge at the end.  You might not like the things that happen during those two years, though.

If he was enlisted it would be an auto-discharge. 

Officer....not so much. 

A pilot in the midst of a shortage .... fuggedaboutit. 

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11 minutes ago, HossHarris said:

If he was enlisted it would be an auto-discharge. 

Officer....not so much. 

A pilot in the midst of a shortage .... fuggedaboutit. 

Perhaps.  I see his point...pretty sneaky for the AF to use "we have a pilot shortage" for a guy they refuse to retrain into an aircraft and will certainly not fill a rated slot in any staff for the remainder of his commitment.

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Perhaps.  I see his point...pretty sneaky for the AF to use "we have a pilot shortage" for a guy they refuse to retrain into an aircraft and will certainly not fill a rated slot in any staff for the remainder of his commitment.

He still has his wings, they can put him in a rated staff billet. Or ALO or AMLO


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IF you really want out figure out how to get not promoted and decline continuation.

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While he still has his wings he is no longer rated because he has been permanently disqualified from rated service.


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5 hours ago, pawnman said:

Perhaps.  I see his point...pretty sneaky for the AF to use "we have a pilot shortage" for a guy they refuse to retrain into an aircraft and will certainly not fill a rated slot in any staff for the remainder of his commitment.

If he turns a slide green...or less red....then it’s a win for management.

 

stop trying to apply logic, common sense, or reasonability to things. It’ll only give you a headache 

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If this is the guy that I’m thinking about... similar stories. He is a really good dude and definitely didn’t deserve the treatment he got from the assclown 4-Star. I wrote that guy a letter to his FEB detailing his performance in UPT and how he would be more than fine in a crew asset.


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3 hours ago, Duck said:

If this is the guy that I’m thinking about... similar stories. He is a really good dude and definitely didn’t deserve the treatment he got from the assclown 4-Star. I wrote that guy a letter to his FEB detailing his performance in UPT and how he would be more than fine in a crew asset.


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The B-1 is a crew asset... unless you mean a different case than the last poster.

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While he still has his wings he is no longer rated because he has been permanently disqualified from rated service.


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Okay. I’ve known of at least one guy who was FEB’d and then went on to serve as an ALO. Given his case, I wouldn’t think staff would be out of the question.


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The B-1 is a crew asset... unless you mean a different case than the last poster.

Good point. I meant a mobility aircraft.


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10 minutes ago, Duck said:


Good point. I meant a mobility aircraft.

Honest question - has anyone seen this happen?  I’ve seen plenty of guys wash out of fighters and go to B-1, C-17, C-130, etc. 

Has anyone seen someone wash out of a crew aircraft FTU and simply go to a different crew aircraft?

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I do want to point out to everyone giving him shit for "washing out in academics"...in my six years as an FTU instructor, academics is the ONLY place I've seen someone wash out.  I don't think we've removed someone from the pipeline once they started flying in almost a decade.  The academics are challenging, and run by a bunch of Cold Warriors who "won't let these slackers in MY jet", despite not having flown a jet since Desert Storm.

So the academic washout thing happens more often than you might think.  But this case, if it's the one I'm thinking of, is the only one where a 4-star general saw fit to overturn the findings of the FEB, the WG/CC, and the NAF/CC.

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7 hours ago, pawnman said:

But this case, if it's the one I'm thinking of, is the only one where a 4-star general saw fit to overturn the findings of the FEB, the WG/CC, and the NAF/CC.

Did this kid run over the 4-star’s dog and get his daughter pregnant?

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2 minutes ago, herkbier said:

...get his daughter pregnant?

Penny Benjamin?

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I do want to point out to everyone giving him shit for "washing out in academics"...in my six years as an FTU instructor, academics is the ONLY place I've seen someone wash out.  I don't think we've removed someone from the pipeline once they started flying in almost a decade.  The academics are challenging, and run by a bunch of Cold Warriors who "won't let these slackers in MY jet", despite not having flown a jet since Desert Storm.

So the academic washout thing happens more often than you might think.  But this case, if it's the one I'm thinking of, is the only one where a 4-star general saw fit to overturn the findings of the FEB, the WG/CC, and the NAF/CC.


That was not the attitude of the contract instructors when I went thru—they genuinely wanted to see us succeed. And academics wasn’t a ball buster either. Weird how shit changes. Sad to hear that.

IIRC Gen Ray was the 7BW/CC formerly.

There has to be more to this story.


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2 hours ago, LookieRookie said:

It has to be Rand. He brought the 4th star from AETC

Yep.  He was the final authority on FEBs in AFGSC and, based on the feedback, he "felt his UPT records weren't good enough to support sending him to a different jet".  Weird, since they were good enough to graduate with pilot wings.

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Yep.  He was the final authority on FEBs in AFGSC and, based on the feedback, he "felt his UPT records weren't good enough to support sending him to a different jet".  Weird, since they were good enough to graduate with pilot wings.

While I can’t vouch for his T-38 time, he did fine in the T-6 and had a great attitude. If he had sucked super bad, the Commander at the time was sending guys to T-1s at other bases due to the pilot shortage and not risking T-38 washouts. Like Pawnman said, everyone in the chain recommended retraining to a different crew aircraft but almighty Rand new better than the people below him. I’ve flown with enough terrible co-pilots to know that he would have been successful in a different aircraft.


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23 minutes ago, Duck said:

I’ve flown with enough terrible co-pilots to know that he would have been successful in a different aircraft.

So what now? Can we just shake our heads at this situation or is this when things change, the people have had enough, and somehow we bloody the General? In other words, any way to get other eyes on this to get this guy retrained?

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24 minutes ago, Guardian said:

What airframe did said individual wash out of?

B-1

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21 minutes ago, pawnman said:

B-1

There’s a dude currently in B-52s who washed out of B-1 FTU...tell us how you really feel big AF. 

 

“Give me your tired, your poor, Your huddled masses...The wretched refuse of your teeming shore.”

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How is it possible that a guys UPT records were good enough to get B-1’s but not good enough to fly something else when that didn’t work out. That’s mind blowing.

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