Aviation Continuation Pay (ACP - The Bonus)

[FLEA]

1 hour ago, jazzdude said:

The AF has done a poor job messaging that we are valued and needed to accomplish the AF mission.

The message went from "go ahead and leave, someone will be there to replace you" to "make the best choice for you and your family, the service will find a way to continue, and thanks for your service."

I posit that essentially, the AF message hasn't changed, just the language got kinder. They both resign the service to not having to tell us they want or need us to stay ("I'm not going to try and convince you to stay"), which points directly to us not being valued by the service.

I don't remember at any point the AF saying during the pilot manning crisis "we need you. We need you to stay because we value your experience and your ideas. Our country needs you. But my words don't mean anything without actions, so here's what we are going to do to show you the service values you." Of course, that also has to be followed up with actual action, or it undercuts the credibility of the GOs, and pushes people out.

That's not to say there's been no improvements to show the AF might care about our value you as an individual. Probably the biggest improvements are the MyVector assignment bidding process (better communication of assignment desires and visibility on what is available your vml cycle), and the ability to turn down school without prejudice. Both do give individuals more say in their careers, which may help them decide to stay in. The bonus is still there, though it seems to lag by 2+ years to what's needed, and probably is too low to push people over the fence, so partial credit there (I'd give it a D-).

Yes, a military career will probably net you less money than going to the airlines. But it's a similar problem with other fields out in the civilian sector.

For example, someone working at a non-profit versus at a for-profit organization where they could make more money. What drives them to take the lower paying job? Likely, a sense of purpose and mission gets them there, and a sense of accomplishment and the organization valuing their efforts keeps them there.

Another example at the extreme is volunteering (like Habitat for Humanity): here there's no pay, yet people participate, sometimes with large chunks of their time? So what motivated them to work for free, and continue to do so? Again, my guess is a sense of mission, pride in that mission, and the organizers valuing and encouraging their participation.

That's not to say pay doesn't matter. It's much easier to stay when you can pay your mortgage, take care of your family, and have money leftover to pursue what you want (hobbies, travel, toys, side businesses/investments, opportunities for your kids, etc).

This article was posted somewhere here several years ago, but it's still relevant today and I think with reposting. It's a blog by a former RAF fighter pilot turned motivational speaker/consultant and it's his take on pilot shortage in the RAF, and his take on why pilots leave the RAF.
https://www.fastjetperformance.com/blog/when-pilots-quit-why-we-must-stop-telling-people-they-are-valued-unless-we-truly-value-them

You nailed it man. I'm all about serving my country. But when you communicate to me that you do not value me, I don't believe I'm actually contributing any service, because I am not providing any value. Hence, I will leave, and go find a position that either pays better or offers higher quality service. When the AF tells us they don't value us, you are doing exactly what noone wants you to do, you are sticking around for the money (which isn't great). And thats a problem. 

[youdontknowthis]

Wills is a fraud. He talks out of both sides of his mouth. Listened to him speak about a year and a half ago, talking to a room full of majors and senior captains. Here are some things he said. (if not verbatim, pretty damn close).

1. “If the grass is greener on the other side, go ahead and jump over the fence.” He went on to basically question our patriotism.

2. “I’m not going to ask you what I could do or what the Air Force could do to keep you.”

3. When questioned about going to a professional pay system like doctors, he first acted as if he had never heard of pro pay and then he asked “can any of you perform surgery?”

[Motofalcon]

25 minutes ago, youdontknowthis said:

Wills is a fraud. He talks out of both sides of his mouth. 

Shack. His other fb post from earlier seemed worthwhile at face value, especially the phrase about not saying “our punks suck” but actually trying to find the solution to make them not suck. Sounds great, I’m on board (I mean, I’ll still tell them they suck, but also have the resources to make them better.)  Then he comes to visit the viper FTU and continually pushes the 6 month syllabus, fully acknowledging that it shortchanges our wingmen and puts more of a training burden on the CAF (overall reducing our tactical ability as a fighting force), but that is overlooked because we MUST produce our way out of this shortage. 
 

  When all the pieces are put together, it’s the same message that all GOs are pushing, “We value you, but not enough to pay you more, listen to your suggestions to improve, or make any large changes to your quality of life. But we will publicly say we value you!  That and your sense of duty should be enough.”

To me, it seems like the conversation goes like this:

AF: “Please stay, Major Instructor Pilot!  We need your experience and IPness!  You and your millions of dollars of training are really valuable to us!”

Aircrew: “Well, okay, but can you maybe fix this one thing? (Insert your instructional fix here - pay, promotion, ops tempo, etc). Because I like serving, but this one thing is making it difficult for me and/or my family.”

AF: “No. Stay or go, we don’t care.” 

?????? 

[jazzdude]

 Then he comes to visit the viper FTU and continually pushes the 6 month syllabus, fully acknowledging that it shortchanges our wingmen and puts more of a training burden on the CAF (overall reducing our tactical ability as a fighting force), but that is overlooked because we MUST produce our way out of this shortage. 

This right here is the strongest message the AF has sent in years regarding pilot retention: it's unsolvable, so we are focusing on increasing production.

Even the napkin math works out:

1000 pilots per year x 60% retention = 600 pilots retained

Ramp up production and you get:

1500 pilots per year x 40% retention = 600 pilots retained

Sure, I had to make assumptions (take rate staying the same for starters). More pilots per year produced may help ops tempo issues, but in return makes training and seasoning more difficult (FHP probably isn't going to increase significantly to allow for better training of more pilots).

---

I will caveat all this with the fact I did take the bonus. Though probably the biggest change for me was not caring what the AF thinks anymore after I got passed over for major the first time, and focusing on the things I felt were important in my small corner of the AF better. Had a good string of sq/CCs who've helped me overcome some bad luck in my career, and helped me get to jobs working on what I felt was important/interesting work. So it ended up being a win-win for both me and the AF (I wouldn't say the least couple jobs I've had were necessarily "desirable" to most, and me, and in that sense I've been lucky in the latter half of my career.

I will give Goldfein credit for his emphasis on the squadrons-a good squadron climate and command would work wonders for retention. But where the AF failed is consistent messaging from CSAF to staffs to AFPC to Sq/CC about an individual's value to the organization, and making individuals feel like their concerns were at least heard. I think things have gotten better, but we still have a long ways to go to fixing the problem.

[Ryder1587]

These leaders act like money is the devil and we shouldn’t be making any decisions based on it. Completely disagree. The money is a huge reason whether I’m going to stay or not. But not the main one. 
 

Every time I move my wife loses 2-6 months of work which causes a pay cut. A bonus helps with this. 
 

There are some assignments or a 365 that I never want to do. But I would if the bonus was 60-75k. That money Maybe pays for my child’s tuition or funds 3-4 vacations in having to take a less than idea assignment. 
 

Are we all patriots ?  Yes. We signed up to do the job. But once they commitment is up I’ve paid my dues and it’s up to the military to entice me to stay. Not the other way around. 

[Guest nsplayr]

5 hours ago, youdontknowthis said:

3. When questioned about going to a professional pay system like doctors, he first acted as if he had never heard of pro pay and then he asked “can any of you perform surgery?”

In fact I can! Especially if the operation you’re looking to receive is rapid, unplanned, extreme body modification.

[go_cubbies22]

9 hours ago, jazzdude said:

I don't remember at any point the AF saying during the pilot manning crisis "we need you. We need you to stay because we value your experience and your ideas. Our country needs you. But my words don't mean anything without actions, so here's what we are going to do to show you the service values you." Of course, that also has to be followed up with actual action, or it undercuts the credibility of the GOs, and pushes people out.

One of the better GO speeches that I’ve heard was Gen Everhart at the 2017 A/TA convention.  He was AMC/CC at the time.  At the end of the speech he pulls out a chair and talks about retention and flat out says we need you to stay and we need people of your experience level to stay.  He then talks about why he has served for almost 30 years.  It was pretty refreshing to hear that from a GO.  
 

Fast forward to 44:30 for the end of the speech and then 49:30 for the we need you to stay part 

 

[Sprkt69]

I have not heard of anyone that has really enjoyed staff under Gen Wills. Seems if you disagree with him, you will only suffer more

Just ask the dude who connected an increase in class A’s to a lack of training/experience 

[FLEA]

7 hours ago, go_cubbies22 said:

One of the better GO speeches that I’ve heard was Gen Everhart at the 2017 A/TA convention.  He was AMC/CC at the time.  At the end of the speech he pulls out a chair and talks about retention and flat out says we need you to stay and we need people of your experience level to stay.  He then talks about why he has served for almost 30 years.  It was pretty refreshing to hear that from a GO.  
 

Fast forward to 44:30 for the end of the speech and then 49:30 for the we need you to stay part 

 

Surprising because I heard Everheart speak  about the same time and didn't get that vibe at all. 

[Phase4]

So, what’s the latest RUMINT?

[panchbarnes]

In related news...

[Homestar]

36 minutes ago, panchbarnes said:

In related news...

Spoiler: Airlines gonna rebound this year!

[SocialD]

1 hour ago, Homestar said:

Spoiler: Airlines gonna rebound this year!

 

Nah man, during his speach about how you shouldn't do this for the money, the good general let us know the airlines aren't recovering any time soon.  In unrelated news, anyone seen any them bonuses around here?  

[Duck]

Southwest is planning on being almost 70% of normal schedule in April. Saw some weird message online about a hiring webinar or something too. I doubt we hire anytime soon, but I could see where they would hire and leave the guys on leave off property just to keep the pool fresh.


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[BroncoEN]

9 hours ago, Phase4 said:

So, what’s the latest RUMINT?

FY21 AvB releases Thursday 

[hindsight2020]

 

7 minutes ago, BroncoEN said:

FY21 AvB releases Thursday 

and it's a doozy. Ouch. 

[skosh]

go with data...

[Standby]

5 minutes ago, skosh said:

go with data...

$100k/yr (tax free) with 1 year min signing time for maintenance officers, finance specialists and CE.  $69k/yr for WSOs w/ 20 year minimum signing time taxed at 50%.  For any 11-X AFSCs, no bonus because the retention is fixed.

[Breckey]

Just read it. Big old nope for me. The AF values rotary wing 11Hs as much as a fuckin' Nav or ABM.

[MDDieselPilot]

anyone bored and care to post it?

 

[Bigred]

40 minutes ago, MDDieselPilot said:

anyone bored and care to post it?

 

In the interest of keeping the rumor mill fully operational, this is what a dude in my squadron just sent me. 

[CaptainMorgan]

That’s missing tiers 1-3, which should include the initial eligibles.


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[Standby]

Don’t have a picture handy, but for real this time:

Tier 1 Initial 11F/B/S/M, CSAR FW & HC-130s

5-7 years: $25k/yr with $100k up front option

8-12 years: $35k/yr with $200k up front option

Tier 2 Initial CSAR RW

5-7 years: $15k/yr

8-12 years: $25k/yr

Tier 3 Initial 11U/18X

5-7 years: $25k/yr

8-12 years: $35k/yr

Edited March 3, 2021 by Standby

[CaptainMorgan]

Gotta love that the guys that have the shortest commitment after winging and are the easiest/cheapest to replace end up with the best bonus option, while the Air Force shits on the RW guys.

An 18u looking to retire at 20 can take the 12 year bonus after their six year commitment.


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[Royal]

This would've been the perfect opportunity for the AF to prove that people are its most valuable asset. Not only that, they could have doubled down and bridged the gap on retention until UPT output gets fixed by bumping the bonus. What's everyone's guess on how much higher the take rate would've been if they offered $50k/yr? A number which is actually cheap when compared to the cost of training another pilot; not to mention the most important aspect: A dude that has 8-12 years' worth of experience is literally irreplaceable for 8-12 years and has a non-linear impact because that person can train/mentor dozens of fellow squad members.