brabus

Rog, in the 11F world you can use AGR and ART synonymously for purposes of this specific discussion (I’ve also been an ART). But in the end this is a very subjective discussion and there is not a one-size-fits-all answer to post-full time mil life. The biggest point to take away is there are a ton of invalid WOMs out there about airline life that specifically stop people from considering it (stopped me for the longest time). Turns out when you actually listen to people who have lived both lives, you’ll hear some very different perspectives compared to the WOMs.

(Apparently) stabilized approach criteria is for pussies!

SLC base, direct flights from home airport. 3-4 per day (only one mainline), which is actually average at best. Lots of guys have double digit commute options on multiple airlines. So I really don’t have an amazing commute deal, but goes to show even something that’s average is good enough! Guys who get BF’d a lot are the ones who choose to live in a place with one flight a day on an RJ - yep, going to buy yourself some extra nights away if you go that route.

The guard is hands down better than AD, but even on non-drill weeks (so 4 day week) I still left the house before kids were up/just getting up and maybe made it to dinner on time. Still had those nights of sitting at the counter putting my shit together for the next day instead of hanging out with my wife, or staying late for an IPUG debrief and missing the kids altogether. I certainly had a far better QOL as an AGR than on AD, but it’s still a full time mil job. My experience is as a fighter guy, maybe it’s different in other communities. All that to say the guard is infinitely better than AD, but it’s still the mil and still far more days spent working/not getting the max QOL with family you want compared to the airlines (in my experience). I haven’t even touched TDYs and deployments (easy to conveniently forget those months away from home when making a “home life” argument against airlines). I think the night the lightbulb on was when I was making the “yeah but I don’t want to be away from home, done that long enough” argument to my brother, and he laughed while responding, “you’re in the middle of a multi-month TDY right now!” Checkmate… I can commute both ends of my tips about 95% of the time, so I rarely spend an extra night away from home (and I’m junior…probably goes to 99.9% in another 6 months). I do admit that is not applicable across the board as commuting is extremely dependent on what category you’re in, where do you live, what is the flight volume/schedule between your local airport and hub, 1 hop vs. 2 hop, etc. But I think most guys don’t lose many days, if any. A great part about the airlines is you have lots of options for basing, commutes, aircraft, etc. Yes seniority plays into this, but generally you can live anywhere in the country and do this job, so how great (or shitty) your commute is rests significantly on your life decisions and what you’re willing to deal with in order to live in location X. I’d love to live in base, but there’s not a single airline base in this country I want to live in, so I’ll be commuting my whole career. Sure it’s not ideal, but we are living out dream life exactly where we want to be (and want our kids to be). That is worth the commute to me any day of the week.

9-12, 15-16 if I want to do an extra trip. But keep in mind, if I do 15 days, I still have 2x the time off as a standard AD guy, and I spend zero seconds at home thinking about work, texting about work, getting a brief together for tomorrow morning, etc. And I know someone is thinking, “yeah but I’m home at night for the kids”…yeah, that’s real quality time when you see them for about 30 min at night before bed (if you’re lucky enough to get home that early). I used to tell myself that lie too. Now it’s dad takes kids to school, picks them up, goes to activities or plays around all afternoon post-school. That is actual quality of time with them, and I happily trade that for the 5 nights a week I may or may not have seen them for a few min before they’re in bed (when I wasn’t TDY or deployed of course). FWIW I was very resistant to the idea for years and made all the same arguments for why I wouldn’t want to be an airline guy. I only have one regret, and that is I didn’t figure it out earlier.

I say his statement is applicable to everyone, including the NB commuter (like me, for example). Of course I’d love to have the additional benefits of living in base, but even a NB commuter lives a life far exceeding the mil life in several ways (namely compensation and QOL). If one doesn’t find that true, then they’re either doing it wrong or very junior (probably both).

I’ve had double billeting on normal TDYs several times throughout my career. Never heard of it being explicitly not allowed, but of course single billeting is always the goal and generally works out.

I should have put ‘running’ in quotes, I agree.

Not what I was referring to. @Lord Ratner incorrect assertions as they apply to the discussion at hand.

Ha! I’m glad this bullshit is finally getting the attention it deserves.

Talked to someone who has spent time in the room with JB…wow. Unbelievable this guy is running the country.

I get it, but I still think there are situations where some guys go too far with “fuck the company” and fuck over a lot of people because of their quest for ultimate spite. You can play hardball and still seek to minimize pain for people when able, they are not completely mutually exclusive. Don’t get me wrong, I’m not advocating taking extensions, sprinting a mile from TSA to the gate, skipping the shitter, etc. But I’m also not going to purposely come up with a bullshit excuse to force a timeout to force a canx just because I want to be a dick to the company. Seen that one, and I just don’t agree with it.

But you know how confidently wrong they are all the time! They’re good at one thing, and that’s it right there.

@Lord Ratner Valid points. The bitch for quite awhile has been why are DAL pilots flying record premium pay while simultaneously wanting a new contract. But, it has still worked out, assuming TA passes. The “mission focus” vs. “fuck the company, do only exactly what’s required” is a fine balance. I agree do the right thing, which includes not rushing, cutting corners, completely jumping through your ass to make it happen, or doing anything else that may affect safety/your fitness for duty. But also keep in mind your actions can either make a family’s day/life, or they can destroy it. So if safety is not a concern, then I understand wanting to get flights out and help the people in back. You don’t know who on the plane is trying to make it to see their parent in the hospital one last time or make a once in a lifetime family reunion. Once had a CA give me shit for taking 3 min of my time to source a wheelchair for an old lady because Prospect sucks ass. Got it, not my job, but also that old lady doesn’t deserve the screw job either. We all should remember the human aspect still matters for something.

Yep. I’m pretty confident a Bundy type event will happen where I live if required…choose wisely where you live in this country. There are likely rockier times ahead before things swing better.

Seems like a PITA overall, especially international. But can’t say I’ve had an in depth Q&A with an FFDO living it.

At this point fuck KCM, put the delay on TSA.

Only good things happen when fireball is involved!

Wonder what AA management does after that combined with (if) DAL ratifies the TA.

Having the time of his life…until reality sets in the morning.

Who said it came from the PRC mainland…

Just when he got his PTSD under control, you opened it right back up!

2014, Bundy ranch in Nevada. Armed citizens won a standoff with the feds - the feds finally just quit and walked away (I think because they ultimately knew another Waco would be really bad for them).

Looks like they did it, found the video…