I'm as bearish as they come when it comes to finances, but even I acknowledge the airlines will resume dod-retention germane hiring in way less than five fiscal years. I'm not saying blue is pulling anything surprising by taking advantage of covid to cajole people into a de facto 20 year ADSC, but I think they overplayed their hand by telegraphing for posterity what we all privately knew: the DOD does NOT care about experience retention, get it through your thick Stockholm syndrome skulls already. Any rhetoric to the contrary from senior leadership is rank gaslighting at this point.

10 minutes ago, hindsight2020 said:

I'm as bearish as they come when it comes to finances, but even I acknowledge the airlines will resume dod-retention germane hiring in way less than five fiscal years. I'm not saying blue is pulling anything surprising by taking advantage of covid to cajole people into a de facto 20 year ADSC, but I think they overplayed their hand by telegraphing for posterity what we all privately knew: the DOD does NOT care about experience retention, get it through your thick Stockholm syndrome skulls already. Any rhetoric to the contrary from senior leadership is rank gaslighting at this point.

Exhibit A:  I signed a 3 year bonus last year. I know stupid me. But I already have a line number with a major air line, so I got that going for me. 6,000+ hour, prior EP in the -17.  Requal’d at LTS, then did 2 local flights at CHS. And here I sit with ~80 hours since Altus, that was from April 2020 til now.  I’m now tagged to do a 6-month ground deployment supporting COVID vaccine distribution. How’s that not FWA?  3 CBTs later I’m a vaccine expert!  We need pilots!

31 minutes ago, Nodeskjobs said:

Exhibit A:  I signed a 3 year bonus last year. I know stupid me. But I already have a line number with a major air line, so I got that going for me. 6,000+ hour, prior EP in the -17.  Requal’d at LTS, then did 2 local flights at CHS. And here I sit with ~80 hours since Altus, that was from April 2020 til now.  I’m now tagged to do a 6-month ground deployment supporting COVID vaccine distribution. How’s that not FWA?  3 CBTs later I’m a vaccine expert!  We need pilots!

But we redesigned the PT uniform. 

No bonus for 11Rs?

As I haven't said it a minute, and now I have even more perspective after separating.  

DO NOT TAKE THE BONUS

AFRC and ANG have bonuses too, and they aren't underhanded or insulting.

The Air Force does not value you as an individual...it is a numbers game and they just proved it.  In two years when they are screaming about retention point back to this ACP offering while telling them to suck an egg.

This just circles back to the Wills, "win one for the gipper," FB post.  Not hard to spot when you're being given the "you're not going to like this" speech....seen it plenty of times now.  Dude would have gotten more respect if he'd have just said, sorry gents (can you still say that), you're not going to like the bonus, but we're stuck with what congress is giving us because they think the problem is fixed.  

 

4 hours ago, ClearedHot said:

The Air Force does not value you as an individual...it is a numbers game and they just proved it.  In two years when they are screaming about retention point back to this ACP offering while telling them to suck an egg.

 

Word!  Mongo just pawn in game of life! 

BTW, your post just made me think of the defensive egg post.  Talk about a flashback!

Edited March 4, 20214 yr by SocialD

1 hour ago, SocialD said:

Word!  Mong just pawn in game of life! 

BTW, your post just made me think of the defensive egg post.  Talk about a flashback!

It shall live forever!

Just coming on completing my 6yr 18X commitment. I'm AGR ANG. I'm thinking of signing 12 year 35k bonus because I plan on doing 20yr. Does 18X qualify for the 100k up front for 12 year? Would it be smarter to just sign 8 year? 

Just coming on completing my 6yr 18X commitment. I'm AGR ANG. I'm thinking of signing 12 year 35k bonus because I plan on doing 20yr. Does 18X qualify for the 100k up front for 12 year? Would it be smarter to just sign 8 year? 

Different bonus program for ANG than posted above


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

Just confirmed with AvB Program office- no bonus options for 11R’s due to manning.  The new fact sheets and documents are also on Mypers.  

Edited March 4, 20214 yr by UDEL09
Words

1 hour ago, UDEL09 said:

Just confirmed with AvB Program office- no bonus options for 11R’s due to manning.  The new fact sheets and documents are also on Mypers.  

No, the manning is terrible in 11R. I'm positive because I've asked 69 times to cross train and was told no due to manning. Also I asked to palace chase and was told no due to manning. There must be a mistake here?!?!! Or AFPC is just completely fucked. 

I don’t think I’ve seen a bigger slap in the face to a community than this. Absolutely shameful.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

HAF/A1 devises these policies (with the agreement of all the MAJCOMs and CSAF); AFPC just administers it. Direct your hate in that direction.

I'm going to direct my hate like I direct my JASSMs: with poor timing and in all directions. 

Just read it. Big old nope for me. The AF values rotary wing 11Hs as much as a in' Nav or ABM.

Welcome to being treated second class.


Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk

When was the last time a pilot group wasn’t offered a bonus?


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

8 hours ago, Majestik Møøse said:

HAF/A1 devises these policies (with the agreement of all the MAJCOMs and CSAF); AFPC just administers it. Direct your hate in that direction.

The whiplash will continue and it kills me to see these short-sighted decisions.  Two years from now when everyone is running for the doors again they will re-rollout the "We care about you, what can we do to make it better" bullshit.  This falls SQUARELY on the shoulders senior leadership that doesn't have the stones to stand up and tell Congress and others to help now to prevent chaos later.

 

We need a better union. 

The E-4 application that just dropped is another second order that probably wasn't considered...it carries an 11/12R reclass. Same with the U-2

Dumb question, (because those are the only kind of questions I ask these days) but do any of these "agreements" prevent retirements? 

3 hours ago, Hub said:

The E-4 application that just dropped is another second order that probably wasn't considered...it carries an 11/12R reclass. Same with the U-2

Stupid question perhaps, I’m assuming your referring to those guys that haven’t finished their initial UPT commitment and are considering a reclass? 

Still somewhat unbelievable that there was no mention of 11R in the PSDM. I’m not an 11R so I have no clue as to what their life is really like or how their manning is perceived by those in the trenches...but to not even offer a bonus is a pretty bold move. Whether by design or through some sheer dumb publishing/copy +paste error it sends a very clear message.

“Do you want ants?” 

1 hour ago, Bigred said:

Stupid question perhaps, I’m assuming your referring to those guys that haven’t finished their initial UPT commitment and are considering a reclass? 

It affects "initial eligible" and "contract-expired/non-contracted" since 11Rs are missing from both tiers. Flying a new MWS via the cross-flow/interview programs can change your core AFSC and primary DT functional. For example, you're an 11R that gets picked up by the 89th. You're now considered an 11M and managed by the MAF DT (think IDE, DT vectors, and Sq/CC boards). On the flip side, say you're an 11M that interviews and gets picked up by the E-4/U-2. You are now considered an 11R by core AFSC and managed by the CAF DT. The aviation bonus program uses the core ID to determine who is in what "tier" based on retention goals. Therefore, bonus for 89th pilot...no bonus for U-2/E-4 pilot.

Another consideration in this is UPT. If you're an 11R that becomes a UPT instructor, you'll keep your core AFSC. This means that even though you're outside of an 11R flying community, you're still ineligible for this year's bonus based on the retention of core AFSC.

3 hours ago, Hub said:

It affects "initial eligible" and "contract-expired/non-contracted" since 11Rs are missing from both tiers. Flying a new MWS via the cross-flow/interview programs can change your core AFSC and primary DT functional. For example, you're an 11R that gets picked up by the 89th. You're now considered an 11M and managed by the MAF DT (think IDE, DT vectors, and Sq/CC boards). On the flip side, say you're an 11M that interviews and gets picked up by the E-4/U-2. You are now considered an 11R by core AFSC and managed by the CAF DT. The aviation bonus program uses the core ID to determine who is in what "tier" based on retention goals. Therefore, bonus for 89th pilot...no bonus for U-2/E-4 pilot.

Another consideration in this is UPT. If you're an 11R that becomes a UPT instructor, you'll keep your core AFSC. This means that even though you're outside of an 11R flying community, you're still ineligible for this year's bonus based on the retention of core AFSC.

It's total dumbassery and it's likely going to cause the 11R community to topple. While on paper they are manned 120%, when you really examine the #'s all of that manning is copilots. The community has been overtasked to support RPAs and UPT and their expereinced dudes don't want to go back, so they get out. This is only going to exasperate that drain from the top end. The $$$ isn't as important as the perceived slap to the face, especially when so many volunteered to retrain as 11M or 11S bit were denied due to manning.