Don't know how I feel about it.

Context?

Depends on how he says it.  There’s a big difference between “Hey sir, it’s your turn to take out the garbage” and “Take out the garbage, Capt”

Absolutely not. I've seen this in 2 different squadrons and it's a culture problem in my opinion.

Is a Capt above taking out the garbage? No. Should a Capt take out the garbage when they see it needs to be done? Sure, lead by example.

Should a CGO listen to the suggestions or mentoring of a Senior NCO? Absolutely. Should a Senior NCO ever undermine the rank of an Officer appointed above them? No. It set's the tone of the squadron and everyone is watching. Shortly after you have 2 stripers complaining that the corn isn't made yet...

Agreed with the above though, asking is way different than telling.

Edited December 19, 20195 yr by Kenny Powers

8 hours ago, 08Dawg said:

Context?

About to ask the same.  It's the the superintendent of an FTU telling a student to take out the trash?  Was it a demand or a request?  Did someone else tell the MSgt "hey, get Capt Snuffy to take the trash out, it's his turn"?

About to ask the same.  It's the the superintendent of an FTU telling a student to take out the trash?  Was it a demand or a request?  Did someone else tell the MSgt "hey, get Capt Snuffy to take the trash out, it's his turn"?

Going to say without a doubt NO. Never is it ok for any enlisted to TELL an officer to take out the trash. It could be the chief master sergeant of the AF telling the newest butter bar and it wouldn’t be okay. That dude has served one day and the CMSgt of the AF likely over 30 years. And the butter bar still out ranks him.

Doesn’t matter if the commander told the MSgt to deliver a message to the captain. That’s the commanders fault for involving the MSgt. Enlisted don’t speak with authority from officers to officers. Superintendents are some of the worst offenders of abuse of perceived power over officers or throwing officers under the bus to fellow enlisted. Needs to be shut down in a hurry

Is it okay to ask? Mentor? Advise? Resounding yes.

This is a symptom of organizational break down and poor leadership. A simple one on one correction could be made with said enlisted. Don’t make it a public event of criticism.

May sound like a rough position but we ain’t the civil air patrol or the scouts. There is rank for a reason.


Please provide context.

Really the best practice here is to get into a public emotional shouting match with said MSgt. Ask the bystanders for real time feedback on who’s winning.

I was about to move this to the 'WTF' thread...

The whole “my boss is ... so that gives me the authority to be directive to you BS just shows how weak some of these “superintendents” are.” But seriously, what would you say you do here?


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The answer is--or at least was during my time--no, a MSgt cannot tell a captain to take out the trash.

A MSgt can ask or remind a captain to take out the trash, but if I were still a captain and a MSgt told me to take out the trash, we would have a very short one-sided sidebar.

But I have been retired going on 14 years, and things have definitely changed since I was in...

You can tell me whatever TF you want, but it doesn't mean I'm going to listen

Just a reminder, when and if you redress said proverbial MSGt, do it with respect and diplomatically: more often than not said MSgt/senior/Chief will complain to mommy and now guess whose fault it is? 

Is this Baseops or the Air Force amn/nco/snco Facebook?  

58 minutes ago, zach braff said:

Is this Baseops or the Air Force amn/nco/snco Facebook?  

Pretty soon we’ll have a thread about paternity leave or lactation rights. 

Any E worth a damn wouldn't ask (especially not tell).

Any O worth a damn wouldn't be above doing the task AND would offer (but would not be told by an E).

 

If a MSgt has a Capt taking out the garbage and he also views Airmen sitting on their ass not taking out the garbage , well from this MSgts perspective that will be the last time a Capt even looks at a garbage can  and those Airmen would regret ever having a Capt take out the garbage.  Now if it is in the Capt's room in billeting in a training environment and MSgt instructor is inspecting the room as part of the course then it is permissible. 

Most of my job was telling officers what to do😀 Never told one to take out the trash though.

The problem is that C-17s never had anybody to tell them to put down the landing gear

Agree, context needed. 10 bucks says this is a community with enlisted flyers. Used to fly with those bros, lotta good dudes, but a lotta holier than thou attitudes as well. No E flyers in my squad now and my jaw would drop if I heard anyone ask a Capt or Lt this. 

Edited December 20, 20195 yr by FT11

44 minutes ago, Breckey said:

The problem is that C-17s never had anybody to tell them to put down the landing gear

Who is getting ATIS?

1 hour ago, SurelySerious said:

Who is getting ATIS?

Dammit. Beat me to it

The problem is that C-17s never had anybody to tell them to put down the landing gear

So they added a LM checklist step in the Before Landing Checklist right after Landing Gear - "DOWN" (PM). I think the expanded says something to the effect of "ensure the checklist is run."

So yeah...

Nope. Next question.

This thread reminded me to take out the garbage in my office yesterday.

So thanks for that.