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AF AMN/NCO page must be tracking this thread revival because this is perfectly on cue

Why do that when you can just crucify the inexperienced crews when they inevitably put more jets in the ground

In a sane and rational world with a bit of strategic vision versus how do I do this as cheap as possible not even considering risk, that program / location would / could be an answer. If they don’t wanna own new aircraft then buy the time, rent the planes and sim time. It is affordable, it’s not that difficult and they need the time, training and experience. Rant Generator - Off

In the video they keep saying that Navy can do whatever they want but that Navy shouldn’t. This is legally incorrect. Underpinning any ADSO, ADSC, MSO, etc, is contract law. Navy in actuality cannot do whatever they want. Unfortunately, when 1 party (Navy) breaches the terms of the contract, alters the contract without the other party’s (the pilot) assent, they act in a lawless manner and will need to be sued to bring them back in line.

CPs in MC-130s are PM only for assaults and always have been until AC upgrade or AC prep. That model hasn’t been an issue for the community. The bigger issue is the lack of an actual Phase 3 trainer (T-1 sim only or T-6 only students). The AF is really fucking these guys and girls over. I’ve had several students over the last 6 months that seriously struggled to land the aircraft (in the sim) normally on a 13,000x150ft wide runway in day VFR conditions. A lot of these students are behind in overall SA, comms, basic aircraft handling, and GK.

Best deal around back then, really enjoyed my training at Corpus.

If only there was a program in South Texas that explicitly trained low level navigation, basic herbivore formation, drop zone and crew coordination, and instrument flying in a multi-engine turboprop. Man that'd be perfect.

We did it fine before without issues. And the C-130 is a tactical airlifter, it sucks st strat. We fly 2 tac locals a week to get good at it because we really exist for the front line resupply efforts to get as close as possible to the action within reason. if you are going to make us an airland only C-17, then why do we exist? Just get rid of us. Save some money. Landing a C-130 isn’t hard. Landing a C-130 with half the pilot training time, a nine month wait on the flight line at the school house, then a multi month wait at your first unit as a new Lt is hard. And now you’ll barely do it as a copilot, get upgraded to AC and then have to do it for real with limited reps and a copilot that’s never done it.

Honestly, this is how it's done in the C-17 community. Co-pilot non ACs can only PM assaults. Not say it's right but I can see AMC A3 looking at us and seeing that the 130 flow can become like that.

Ha. Figures. Herk was designed specifically for blown-lift aerodynamics - its' express design-goal was to enable a core mission. You telling me pilots cannot even accomplish, understand, and operate this basic mission which hasn't changed since ~23 Aug 1954!? Hahahaha. AF training policies are so broken and the bobs don't listen. However, the Ops-Mx slides will green up by this policy. #notwinning But seriously: energy management and constant angle theory are things that have consequences when mismanaged in landings. Maybe student pilots should be taught them...and the basic design and handling characteristics of their plane. Or perhaps I'm overthinking this...B2B anyone!? (≠born to bounce)

Well… damn it… glad regular air land is going and I hope the risk mitigation measures work for the tactical ops… This is solvable inside of the budget of the AF, from above in the thread, heavy bound students are looking at 9 month waits till FTU, use that time and just buy the training they need. I rattled off a hypothetical set of training programs, I roughly estimate at $175k a student, round it up to $250k to be conservative. I’m not sure how many heavy crew tracked students AETC produces a year but just say it is 750. That’s 131 to 187 million lo to high for all multi engine flight training, even on the high end of that it comes to 0.09% of a 188 billion AF budget, the Bobs could easily find that money. Simplified post T-6 training suggested: Multi engine fundamentals + some time & experience building in an economical twin. 40 hours. Lease 50. Figure wet leased with instructor at $1200 an hour. Figure $60k per student for all training and flying. STOL, Tac Air Land introduction in a Twin Otter. Lease 30 aircraft. 20 hours, figure $135k for all training and flying. Transport aircraft training. 737 MAX simulator, lease 8, 25 hours, figure $35k for all training. That’s $230k per student, bit of leeway. In the grand scheme of the AF, actually very affordable and from my experience flying and instructing, would train your heavy pilots without the financial burden of acquiring and owning new aircraft. Commit to this program for 10 years to get industry interested in bidding.

If you can’t do something useful do something visible.

Lots of rumors on coming changes but right now just no assault landings for copilots unless they are with an instructor due to a rash of hard landings. There was some discussion on if that was the right way forward but the AMC A3 2 star directed that this is the way and released a fleet wide FCIF. We absolutely can fly cargo around with pilots that aren’t as good and are given significantly less time to train. We are just going to bend more metal in peace time, and in wartime the new expectation needs to be the MAF won’t be anywhere near the front line if we want to preserve the fleet. People gotta figure out their cargo another way.

No skin off my nose if they call themselves warfighters. If some new Lt or E-2 is proud of their training completion and wants to be called an operator, great. I don't think anyone is going to confuse them for Recon Marines because they use the term "warfighter." Reminds me of the silly Airman's Creed, but if it makes somebody proud to serve, awesome.

New jet, new day. Space Force leaders stop wearing “spings”, compare Space Force to the Marine Corps as warfighters: discuss. https://www.airandspaceforces.com/small-uniform-tweak-change-space-force-culture/

Gotcha All copilots or inexperienced copilots? Are they adjusting the hours upwards to be considered experienced? No correlation of course to UPT 6.9 or F’dUPT of course… Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

Can you say what aspects? I'm curious on how this compares to other MWSs

C-130J community is starting to limit what copilots are allowed to do.

I figured the loss in contractor jobs (MX, sims, academics, etc…) would draw their ire. Sub standard… any leadership acknowledgment (formal or informal) if this? Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

As long as the mission isn’t moving why would congress care? The money saved is in the base, if anything more students is more housing and more money in the economy. The sub quality pilot training product is becoming apparent on the flightline.

One step closer to my longed-for perp walks... https://www.wral.com/story/attorney-general-bondi-orders-prosecutors-to-start-grand-jury-probe-into-obama-officials-over-russia-investigation/22107863/

Quoted for hilarity.

Sts

This forum needs a TDS button.