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Uh.  No.  But it doesn’t have the free managers special at the embassy or free Hilton breakfast, so pocket extra money there, buy breakfast at trump with your own money.  We both know the rules.  Thanks for playing tho


No sweat. I’m sure the American public will deduce though your brilliant writing that by “pocket the extra cash” you obviously meant that because the “cheap motel down the road” has free waffles in the lobby so they can pocket the $2.99 in per diem they would have spent on an egg mcmuffin. That was crystal clear. Not sure how I missed it the first time.

Your article was (mostly) spot on. That particular point was very poorly made. Don’t get all sensitive about it. It wasn’t a personal shot at you. I’m just telling you how it read.

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On 9/9/2019 at 9:14 PM, torqued said:

I stayed at the Turnberry last year.  I've been stopping in Prestwick to/from deployments since 2002. We just tell the FBO when and how many people, and they make the arrangements. Last year we arrived right after a snow/ice storm that shut most of the major freeways for days. All of the hotels in Ayre (our usual location) and Glasgow were booked. The Turnberry, an hour drive away,  had enthusiastically agreed to give us the government rate. The hotel itself was absolutely incredible and the staff thanked us profusely for our service. The bartender let us sample some of the local Scotch whiskeys. It was too cold for golf, but we toured the course which was an old WWII pilot training base, and some of the old runways/taxiways still exist on the course. The hotel called in a bagpiper to play us out the door as we departed for the sandbox at 5am. It was one of the best deployment sendoffs ever. There was nothing to it other than it was the only place with rooms available at the government rate, and the FBO was proud to have found a place that they thought we would enjoy. The media and politicians are idiots.

The issue in question isn't really about the President or the resort (though, of course, that's all anyone cares about). My wild guess as to the hustle going on is that the airport is paying for the rooms/hospitality at Turnberry in the hopes of attracting big-ticket fuel purchases. If the fuel cost an extra $.50 a gallon over what DoD would have paid at a different airport, a good deal for the aircrew turns into a $25,000 hit to the taxpayers. It's kind of similar to the Fat Leonard scandal the Navy just put a bunch of folks in prison for (but likely a lot harder to prove any wrongdoing on the Air Force's part, because we can just say "operational necessity").

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19 minutes ago, Stoker said:

The issue in question isn't really about the President or the resort (though, of course, that's all anyone cares about). My wild guess as to the hustle going on is that the airport is paying for the rooms/hospitality at Turnberry in the hopes of attracting big-ticket fuel purchases. If the fuel cost an extra $.50 a gallon over what DoD would have paid at a different airport, a good deal for the aircrew turns into a $25,000 hit to the taxpayers. It's kind of similar to the Fat Leonard scandal the Navy just put a bunch of folks in prison for (but likely a lot harder to prove any wrongdoing on the Air Force's part, because we can just say "operational necessity").

They have a government contract fuel rate, and when I went through there a year ago there was no mention of Turnberry.  This is simply people in the media who have to idea how the system works trying to make a hit piece on Trump.

Edited by Wendell
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On 9/11/2019 at 6:09 PM, Danny Noonin said:

What do you mean by some “preferred to pocket the extra money”?

 

Are you implying that you think you can get a room at less than the government rate and legally claim the full rate (not actual cost) and pocket the difference? Because that’s what it looks like you’re implying.

 

 

There was a period of time in the 80s where you were paid the full per diem no matter what you spent.  One example I remember was New Orleans, 87ish I think. Per Diem was $75 a day. Stayed at the west bank sheraton and with the military discount and sharing a room it was $12 a night. Big bucks for a SSgt back then.

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10 hours ago, Stoker said:

The issue in question isn't really about the President or the resort (though, of course, that's all anyone cares about). My wild guess as to the hustle going on is that the airport is paying for the rooms/hospitality at Turnberry in the hopes of attracting big-ticket fuel purchases. If the fuel cost an extra $.50 a gallon over what DoD would have paid at a different airport, a good deal for the aircrew turns into a $25,000 hit to the taxpayers. It's kind of similar to the Fat Leonard scandal the Navy just put a bunch of folks in prison for (but likely a lot harder to prove any wrongdoing on the Air Force's part, because we can just say "operational necessity").

That is a wild guess, and wildly inaccurate. As I've said, I've been visiting Prestwick Aviation for 17 years and those folks are on the up and up. Contract fuel prices are set. Lodging and perdiem rates are set. The Turnberry was only offered when it was the only accommodation available. Do you know of an alternative airport that meets all the requirements of transiting military aircraft, crew, and pax with fuel prices 50 cents less? I challenge you to find it. There's quite a bit more to RON planning than the price of fuel. If you've ever been deployed and are looking to save $25K of taxpayer money in Scotland, you're looking in the wrong place.

If an FBO/hotel provides a great experience while conducting business within the government rules and government rates, how is that a hustle? That's just good business. This is no Fat Leonard, just another instance of politicians throwing shit against the White House walls hoping something sticks.

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The conspiracy theories are strong with this one.  You don't have to have worked for the military/government, more specifically with contracts, to know they don't give a shit about saving the tax payers money.  Have you ever tried to do construction to a current building to adjust for a new requirement?  We recently had to do that and the easiest/cheapest (by far) option was to simply raise the roof.  Nope, sorry that is considered X type construction and apparently the money we were given was for Y type construction.  So instead of simply raising the roof, they're knocking down a massive wall, breaking up the concrete floor, digging down a few feet, pouring a new floor, then rebuilding the massive wall.  Apparently, when this building was built a few years back we knew that this future requirement was likely coming down the pike and knew this building wouldn't work, but we were told you can't build based on future expectations...

 

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On 9/13/2019 at 10:11 AM, SocialD said:

The conspiracy theories are strong with this one.  You don't have to have worked for the military/government, more specifically with contracts, to know they don't give a shit about saving the tax payers money.  Have you ever tried to do construction to a current building to adjust for a new requirement?  We recently had to do that and the easiest/cheapest (by far) option was to simply raise the roof.  Nope, sorry that is considered X type construction and apparently the money we were given was for Y type construction.  So instead of simply raising the roof, they're knocking down a massive wall, breaking up the concrete floor, digging down a few feet, pouring a new floor, then rebuilding the massive wall.  Apparently, when this building was built a few years back we knew that this future requirement was likely coming down the pike and knew this building wouldn't work, but we were told you can't build based on future expectations...

 

Reminds me of how they build aircraft carriers. Contracts are written so long ago that by the time the carriers get built, a lot of shit is outdated. 

One ludicrous example, the old school cork push pin boards. All the ready rooms were written to have them. Fast forward to today, and dry-erase boards are what we need and works so much better. 

Cant just have the cork boards replaced during construction. Gotta finish the build then write an entirely new contract for the dry-erase boards. Ends up costing several grand per board for a $100 dry erase board. 

 

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On 9/12/2019 at 5:18 PM, Stoker said:

 It's kind of similar to the Fat Leonard scandal the Navy just put a bunch of folks in prison for...

Fat Leonard scandal?  WTF?  One paragraph executive summary please.

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6 hours ago, Stitch said:

Fat Leonard scandal?  WTF?  One paragraph executive summary please.

Cliff notes -

When a contractor literally throws hookers through your door and wines and dines you at Michelin 5 star restaurants for financial favor on contracts, etc, it usually doesn't end well.

Lots of O-6 and Flag level dudes in the Navy got axed for it. Some even went to prison.

Edited by Bigred

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