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Pilot Shortage Deepens, USAF is SCREWED.

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Just now, HeloDude said:

Since when do Army RW pilots coming over to be AF RW pilots go through IFF? This post was concerning UPT-H...

I was referring to the Army helo dudes who were recruited to come through AF fixed wing qual and IFF to go out and fly in AF units.  There was a big batch in the 2004-2006 timeframe, with many going to ANG units but some headed to AD units.

I thought that's what you were referring to when you said, "the AF also didn't bring in quite a few Army RW pilots..."

If not, my bad.  I'll STFU then.

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5 hours ago, ClearedHot said:

snowflake-animated-gif-10.gif#.Wrd8smhpG

I grew up with fear, sarcasm, and ridicule as a tactic used by my IPs, the leadership, and the rest of the institution. It worked well, and I didn't complain.

The ops tempo was reasonable, I was flying 20 sorties a month, and push-it-up, fun TDYs were plentiful. I had never heard of a CBT, SAPR, Green Dot, and there was no airline opportunity.

Let me suggest that that era is gone. What this "special snowflake" is trying to say is that the Air Force doesn't have the cards to play the dickhead commander routine any longer. It's a bluff.

The snowflake is gonna bail to the airlines at his first opportunity while the commander keeps wondering why he's losing pilots.

Adapt, or die. The ball is in the Air Force's court.

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53 minutes ago, Flaco said:

I grew up with fear, sarcasm, and ridicule as a tactic used by my IPs, the leadership, and the rest of the institution. It worked well, and I didn't complain.

The ops tempo was reasonable, I was flying 20 sorties a month, and push-it-up, fun TDYs were plentiful. I had never heard of a CBT, SAPR, Green Dot, and there was no airline opportunity.

Let me suggest that that era is gone. What this "special snowflake" is trying to say is that the Air Force doesn't have the cards to play the dickhead commander routine any longer. It's a bluff.

The snowflake is gonna bail to the airlines at his first opportunity while the commander keeps wondering why he's losing pilots.

Adapt, or die. The ball is in the Air Force's court.

So... if they’re going to be lost anyway, you make an interesting case for longer commitments and less bonus money...

Yeesh.

Chuck

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1 hour ago, torqued said:

I'd love to hear a retired Colonel's argument, in his thread about the AF pilot shortage, as to why snowflakes (like me) shouldn't identify poor AF leadership or recognize a young IP's value to, and outside of, the AF.

Just kidding.

No I wouldn't.

What you identify as poor leadership is actually someone asking you as an IP to be a fucking adult, sorry that is so difficult for you.  Enjoy the airlines, I am sure you "me only" attitude will serve you quite well in the interview process.

For the record I retired to get away from caustic leadership and a broken system,  I think most of the people that served with me (some on here), know I was not into the you should be ridiculed because I was ridiculed routine, but getting offended because someone asks you to make sure you training paperwork is squared away...dear god, get the sand out of your vagina.

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17 minutes ago, ClearedHot said:

What you identify as poor leadership is actually someone asking you as an IP to be a fucking adult, sorry that is so difficult for you.  Enjoy the airlines, I am sure you "me only" attitude will serve you quite well in the interview process.

For the record I retired to get away from caustic leadership and a broken system,  I think most of the people that served with me (some on here), know I was not into the you should be ridiculed because I was ridiculed routine, but getting offended because someone asks you to make sure you training paperwork is squared away...dear god, get the sand out of your vagina.

I agree with you that asking someone to do their job as an IP is not unreasonable; that was not a good example of said 06’s shitty leadership - there are numerous other examples that everyone can identify with that constitute the very caustic leadership that drove you out: for example, said 06 lecturing the DOs that this #unity march takes precedence over all and any mission planning for the day.  Can we all agree that this is a valid criticism of today’s 06+ leadership force and one of the reasons that drive good dudes out?

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1 hour ago, ClearedHot said:

What you identify as poor leadership is actually someone asking you as an IP to be a ing adult, sorry that is so difficult for you.  Enjoy the airlines, I am sure you "me only" attitude will serve you quite well in the interview process.

For the record I retired to get away from caustic leadership and a broken system,  I think most of the people that served with me (some on here), know I was not into the you should be ridiculed because I was ridiculed routine, but getting offended because someone asks you to make sure you training paperwork is squared away...dear god, get the sand out of your ######.

If I'm reading correctly, the commander didn't ask them to do their jobs correctly. He threatened to revoke their IP status if they didn't do the job correctly, before any of them had actually screwed up.

Does your chief pilot at the airlines proactively threaten you with punitive action? 

The supply and demand curves have shifted and the Air Force is losing the competition for talent. Commanders in need to think counterintuitively. If a commander actually cares about retaining people, the only way to do that is to ask, nicely. Even then, it is likely that macro forces outside of his control will dictate that a large number of pilots still leave. But maybe, just maybe, he can appeal to the best in his pilots and keep an additional one or two of them around that would have otherwise left.

 

Edited by Flaco
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1 minute ago, dream big said:

I agree with you that asking someone to do their job as an IP is not unreasonable; that was not a good example of said 06’s shitty leadership - there are numerous other examples that everyone can identify with that constitute the very caustic leadership that drove you out: for example, said 06 lecturing the DOs that this #unity march takes precedence over all and any mission planning for the day.  Can we all agree that this is a valid criticism of today’s 06+ leadership force and one of the reasons that drive good dudes out?

Amen...Unity march, Everyone is a Warrior, punishing the entire base when one jackwagon gets a DUI, and sycophantic senior leaders with closets full of skeletons who serve only themselves...those are the reasons I got out. 

Also, for the the record I don;t think anyone needs a reason to get out.  As an O-6 I spoke with multiple folks who were on the fence and the first thing I always said was  "Thanks for your service, you are part of the 1% that raised your hand to serve and if you think getting out is the best thing for you and you family, godspeed, grateful you gave us the time you did."

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45 minutes ago, Chuck17 said:

So... if they’re going to be lost anyway, you make an interesting case for longer commitments and less bonus money...

Yeesh.

Chuck

Chuck,

The cynical side of me says the Air Force has already figured this out and has given up on retention. They will try to produce their way out of the hole. Pencil whip IP status, green up the slides. It's just going to be a much younger man's game. The machine will continue to function.

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6 minutes ago, Flaco said:

If I'm reading correctly, the commander didn't ask them to do their jobs correctly. He threatened to revoke their IP status if they didn't do the job correctly, before any of them had actually screwed up.

^This. Exactly this. It was a threat that was made before anyone screwed the pooch.

As to ClearedHot’s point, I also have no problem with setting the expectation to be an adult and do your job correctly. I would expect a leader to reiterate that fact. But, let’s not mince words or try to infer too much into what you think the OG said (especially since I stated exactly what he said)...the point of the post was purely to point out that he made an unwarranted threat before any foul play or shirking of responsibility had occurred. That’s not how you inspire trust in your subordinates or earn their respect. 

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1 hour ago, ClearedHot said:

What you identify as poor leadership is actually someone asking you as an IP to be a ing adult, sorry that is so difficult for you.  Enjoy the airlines, I am sure you "me only" attitude will serve you quite well in the interview process.

For the record I retired to get away from caustic leadership and a broken system,  I think most of the people that served with me (some on here), know I was not into the you should be ridiculed because I was ridiculed routine, but getting offended because someone asks you to make sure you training paperwork is squared away...dear god, get the sand out of your ######.

Don’t tell me what it “actually” was because you have no more information than the rest of us. I trust the guy telling the story know more about whether the dude was being a prick than you trying to put words in another O-6s mouth while simultaneously bitching about caustic leadership. You need to figure out what your position is and once you do, do not make mistake of assuming I give a shit.  I’m also not interested in what a new airline guy thinks will serve an 11 year airline guy well. The Air Force is different than when you punched. The desks practically fly themselves these days.

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16 minutes ago, torqued said:

babble

9B51485F-DBA3-4425-84DD-E2C06DF8D74F.thumb.jpeg.0e9bc24a39714dd8fef1c7ef07c16c10.jpeg

 

When people call you a douche, is it “douche,” or is it “dooooouuuuuuche”?

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1 hour ago, torqued said:

 You need to figure out what your position is and once you do, do not make mistake of assuming I give a shit. 

Did I hurt your feelings?  Poor thumb-sucking SNAP, should we call mommy?

 

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Just fill out the grade sheet? Not for the O-6....

I’m as cynical as the next dude...but I wouldn’t leave the AF bc the OG threatened to remove my certification as an IP if I didn’t do my job. Obviously, not inspiring words from the OG to a new IP...but just fill out the grade sheet. 

 

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3 hours ago, torqued said:

The Air Force is different than when you punched. The desks practically fly themselves these days.

Say, didn't CH retire, like, in 2017?  I know technology speeds the pace of change up, but, really?!

 

Are you referring to the empty desks because there's no one to man them?

 

As a true old retiree, I enjoy listening to youngsters and their wisdom.  Like Whitney said...

 

Parkland students today...

Cultural Revolutionaries a few decades ago (The real ones, not our Berkeley ersatz ones...)

Good times.

 

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3 hours ago, torqued said:

 You need to figure out what your position is and once you do, do not make mistake of assuming I give a shit.  I’m also not interested in what a new airline guy thinks will serve an 11 year airline guy well. The Air Force is different than when you punched. The desks practically fly themselves these days.

calm down tough guy. you're way over torqued. CH's one of the good ones suggest you redirect fire

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On a different note, someone mentioned the boys at Nellis wrote a letter to the AF about the current status of training/readiness.  Any validity to it?

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Like I said I didn’t agree with everything this OG did and he could definitely be caustic at times, but he set his expectations clearly ahead of time as well as the consequences too. He also rarely punished en mass it was targeted specifically at people who fucked up. He also had very high expectations of his IP corps. From one IP to another, if you habitually fucked up grade sheets, TMS reports, currency paperwork I would agree you probably shouldn’t be an IP. You are the example and if you can’t do it then it’s time to find better examples. Also if you understood that the OG needed the paperwork so he could use the Go/No-go process to gather data on things like Ops tempo effects on training, crew compositions, required waivers etc, you understand why it was important to him. He fought many battles against 18AF/AMC that the crew force never knew about. I was in your shoes too until my commander sat some of the IPs down and peeled back the curtain. This guy isn’t a saint but he enabled a lot of good at McChord, as for his actions at Dyess I got nothing.

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1 hour ago, Fuzz said:

Like I said I didn’t agree with everything this OG did and he could definitely be caustic at times, but he set his expectations clearly ahead of time as well as the consequences too. He also rarely punished en mass it was targeted specifically at people who fucked up. He also had very high expectations of his IP corps. From one IP to another, if you habitually fucked up grade sheets, TMS reports, currency paperwork I would agree you probably shouldn’t be an IP. You are the example and if you can’t do it then it’s time to find better examples. Also if you understood that the OG needed the paperwork so he could use the Go/No-go process to gather data on things like Ops tempo effects on training, crew compositions, required waivers etc, you understand why it was important to him. He fought many battles against 18AF/AMC that the crew force never knew about. I was in your shoes too until my commander sat some of the IPs down and peeled back the curtain. This guy isn’t a saint but he enabled a lot of good at McChord, as for his actions at Dyess I got nothing.

Whoa whoa whoa, you mean there’s another side to this story!? (#sarcasm) Your measured response is getting in the way of our righteous indignation...!

Chuck

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As a guy who lived through Fairchild’s ASEV failure in 2010, I can vouch that paperwork matters.  That being said, would I revoke someone’s IP qual for screwing it up (even repeatedly)?  Hell no, but said IP would get really tired of briefing the squadron at training days. 

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One you dudes is already retired and the other is about to retire. As long as they direct deposit your pension on time every month, who fucking cares what happens to the Air Force?

Just......let go already.

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17 minutes ago, joe1234 said:

One you dudes is already retired and the other is about to retire. As long as they direct deposit your pension on time every month, who ing cares what happens to the Air Force?

Just......let go already.

I'm in this for the long haul. I intend to stick around here and give my advice as to how the Air Force and its pilots should operate well into my retirement years. I'm pretty sure my best years are behind me and if I don't consistently remind you what a badass I used to be, you can't expect me to get any sort of validation in my sunset years as a gear puller where my ego isn't regularly fed a steady diet of online recognition?

Geez, can't someone just admit this is the funniest exchange ever precipitated by an animated snowflake .gif? I mean, I'm working my ass off here to make sure everyone is having a good time. FFS. 

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