The WOKE Thread (Merged from WTF?)

[Blue]

Quote

 

The Pentagon's deputy inspector general for diversity and inclusion and extremism in the military.

 

Well that's.......interesting.  First time I've seen responsibilities for "Diversity and Inclusion" lumped in with "Extremism."

Does that mean all the various "Head of Diversity" positions scattered throughout the DoD are now going have additional responsibilities for rooting out "Extremism?"

Edited June 23, 2021 by Blue

[tac airlifter]

16 minutes ago, Blue said:

Well that's.......interesting.  First time I've seen responsibilities for "Diversity and Inclusion" lumped in with "Extremism."

Does that mean all the various "Head of Diversity" positions scattered throughout the DoD are now going have additional responsibilities for rooting out "Extremism?"

Good point.  That’s some scary ass commissar stuff.

[kaputt]

3 hours ago, Springer said:

https://www.military.com/daily-news/2021/06/22/military-has-watchdog-stopping-extremism-now-it-wants-teeth-and-independence.html?ESRC=eb_210623.nl

The Military Has a Watchdog for Stopping Extremism. Now, It Wants Teeth -- and Independence

 

 

Scary stuff when you really read between the lines.

I continue to stand by the fact that the real extremism threat to this country is far left extremism packaged behind nice words like diversity, inclusion, and my absolute favorite: EQUITY.

Anyone who believes in a free society should get shivers down their spine when they hear politicians, the military, private companies, etc... using the word equity. 

[SurelySerious]

Equity: all animals are equal, but some animals are more equal than others.

[Pooter]

Pushing for "equity" is a master stroke by the left because it can never be achieved. You will always have more work to do in the pursuit of perfect equity so it always gives them a racist/classist boogeyman to point at when things between groups are inevitably inequitable. 
 

I think the best strategy for republicans is to try and educate the public that equity between all groups is never possible and has never happened in the entirety of human history at any time or any place. The fact that the equity goal is vague and the goalposts are always moving is the feature, not the bug.
 

 

[Guardian]

Equity as used by the left is racism.

[timberlin]

1 hour ago, kaputt said:

Scary stuff when you really read between the lines.

I continue to stand by the fact that the real extremism threat to this country is far left extremism packaged behind nice words like diversity, inclusion, and my absolute favorite: EQUITY.

Anyone who believes in a free society should get shivers down their spine when they hear politicians, the military, private companies, etc... using the word equity. 

The problem is they don't really even care about how perfect equity would shake out in practice.  If they truly wanted equity, their end goal should be equal representation in all fields, which we know it isn't.  They obviously mean more minority/female representation in the desirable and high esteem career fields within the military (i.e. aviation), but they seem to care little about the less glamourous side. I highly doubt we'll see female applications at MEPS turned away from the personalist and medical positions they currently predominantly occupy and offered only MX or CE to even out those demographics as well.

[Majestik Møøse]

What did you guys think of Gen Milley’s comments about woke culture and critical race theory? I thought they were pretty reasonable, and i also think that Laura Ingram went off the deep end. Also, Gaetz is a doucheclown.

[Prozac]

2 hours ago, Majestik Møøse said:

What did you guys think of Gen Milley’s comments about woke culture and critical race theory? I thought they were pretty reasonable, and i also think that Laura Ingram went off the deep end. Also, Gaetz is a doucheclown.

Agree on all points. 

[Pooter]

2 hours ago, Majestik Møøse said:

What did you guys think of Gen Milley’s comments about woke culture and critical race theory? I thought they were pretty reasonable, and i also think that Laura Ingram went off the deep end. Also, Gaetz is a doucheclown.

Agreed on Ingram and gaetz. But hugely object to putting  CRT trash like that on the reading list just to be "well read."  I noticed that Marx, Lenin, etc.. aren't on there. Which is a good thing because those are bad ideas and antithetical to fundamental American principles. 
 

We should know what CRT is, but only for purposes of debunking it. Featuring critical race theory on the chiefs reading list is a de-facto endorsement, and I would bet the good general was "strongly encouraged" to include those titles by administration officials who have a vested interest in this ideology that goes much deeper than being "well-read" and "understanding the American people"

Edited June 25, 2021 by Pooter

[Prozac]

5 minutes ago, Pooter said:

Agreed on Ingram and gaetz. But hugely object to putting  CRT trash like that on the reading list just to be "well read."  I noticed that Marx, Lenin, etc.. aren't on there. Which is a good thing because those are bad ideas and antithetical to fundamental American principles. 
 

We should know what CRT is, but only for purposes of debunking it. 
 

 

Interesting point of view. Would you agree with the idea that knowing one’s adversary is essential to cultivating an effective counter to it? That’s the contextual umbrella I understood Gen Milley’s statements to be under. 

[Pooter]

3 minutes ago, Prozac said:

Interesting point of view. Would you agree with the idea that knowing one’s adversary is essential to cultivating an effective counter to it? That’s the contextual umbrella I understood Gen Milley’s statements to be under. 

To your first point - Absolutely. As for Gen Milley's context, it could be a "know ones adversary" situation or it could be more of an endorsement of those ideas on his part. 
 

I air toward the second option when you look at what else makes up most of these reading lists: bonafide military history/strategy books and organizational/leadership self help books. I don't see him putting kendi on there just to play some devils advocate.. especially on a hugely hot button issue. 
 

There's also a third option: he was pressured to include it on the list, and "know thy enemy" is just the excuse he's using to try to pass it off. Probably why he's a four star and I'm not. 

[Prozac]

Do you really believe a four star who has given his entire adult life to service of our free market, democratic way of life is somehow secretly endorsing, or has been forced to endorse Marxist socialism? I’ll be the first to agree that general officers can be out of touch and tainted by politics, but this point of view strikes me as a bit much. 

[Pooter]

36 minutes ago, Prozac said:

Do you really believe a four star who has given his entire adult life to service of our free market, democratic way of life is somehow secretly endorsing, or has been forced to endorse Marxist socialism? I’ll be the first to agree that general officers can be out of touch and tainted by politics, but this point of view strikes me as a bit much. 

I think senior generals are heavily influenced by the whims of the administration. It is also possible that he's busy, doesn't have the bandwidth to fully look into this stuff, and does not realize now nefarious the content he's quasi-endorsing truly is. 

[Majestik Møøse]

Studying it objectively in a university sociology class is ok with me. Assuming every one is allowed to discuss openly without forced bias or shaming. If biases were being presented, that would be something that needs crushing.

Regarding “critical race theory” itself, I’m willing to wait to learn more. About a year ago someone on this board observed that America only cares about a particular hot topic for about 2 months max. Seems to be true so far.

Edited June 25, 2021 by Majestik Møøse

[Pooter]

52 minutes ago, Majestik Møøse said:

Studying it objectively in a university sociology class is ok with me. Assuming every one is allowed to discuss openly without forced bias or shaming. If biases were being presented, that would be something that needs crushing.

Regarding “critical race theory” itself, I’m willing to wait to learn more. About a year ago someone on this board observed that America only cares about a particular hot topic for about 2 months max. Seems to be true so far.

They can talk about whatever useless nonsense they want in sociology classes.. perfectly fine by me. That degree already isnt worth the paper it's written on so CRT conversations certainly aren't going to change that. 
 

But with CRT itself I don't think we need to wait at all. Despite entering the mainstream very recently it's been around for decades and is basically Marxist class struggles repackaged in terms of race.
 

The gist is that any outcome differential between racial groups along any metric imaginable can be chalked up to a racist system. The part they don't want you to know is that since differentials between groups have and always will exist, "the work" needed to alleviate "systemic racism" will never be complete. And If you disagree with the assertion that all of the systems are racist, that's because you're a beneficiary of those systems which only increases your need for remediation. 
 

If the goal is to permanently cast oneself as the victim, it's basically a perfect ideology. 

Edited June 25, 2021 by Pooter

[brabus]

CRT is also EVERYWHERE in the public school system, and has been injected for a long time now. It’s a hot topic because parents are finally realizing what bullshit is being taught to their kids and they’re pissed. Go do a little research into your local school district - very good chance CRT exists on a varying scale. This is not a flavor du jour topic, or at least it shouldn’t be. 

[Prozac]

6 hours ago, Pooter said:

I think senior generals are heavily influenced by the whims of the administration. It is also possible that he's busy, doesn't have the bandwidth to fully look into this stuff, and does not realize now nefarious the content he's quasi-endorsing truly is. 

Which content, exactly, is he “quasi endorsing”? YMMV, but in my experience senior officers don’t unknowingly endorse anything, quasi or otherwise. General officers are certainly not infallible, but they’re not dumb either. It’s quite a stretch to intimate that Milley is somehow unknowingly part of some Marxist plot against America. 

[Lord Ratner]

21 hours ago, Majestik Møøse said:

What did you guys think of Gen Milley’s comments about woke culture and critical race theory? I thought they were pretty reasonable, and i also think that Laura Ingram went off the deep end. Also, Gaetz is a doucheclown.

He's a tool, like all of them, and he makes bullshit arguments like the best politicians in the world.

 

Why isn't Marx or Lenin on the reading list? First inconsistency.

 

Second, if he's comparing the reading of Marx and Lenin to Kendi (for understanding alternate views), is he acknowledging that all three are morally bankrupt? I assure you he would not claim that about Kendi lest his career be put in jeopardy.

 

Third, if you read Marx and Lenin to learn about communism, wouldn't you read Duke or Jared Taylor to learn about white supremacy? Where are those recommendations?

 

Once again liberal voters are being taken for a ride. CRT, just like anti-racism, has existing literature. You can read it. It's crazy at best, *overtly* racist at worst. But the people who wrote the books and the hacks who promote them lie on TV about the very content they created. It's wild. 

 

If you haven't read "How to be an Antiracist" or "White Fragility," maybe don't be so quick to defend them.

[Lord Ratner]

22 hours ago, Prozac said:

Do you really believe a four star who has given his entire adult life to service of our free market, democratic way of life is somehow secretly endorsing, or has been forced to endorse Marxist socialism? I’ll be the first to agree that general officers can be out of touch and tainted by politics, but this point of view strikes me as a bit much. 

Bro... Given his entire adult life? Have you seen what the AF is like once you make colonel?

 

Being busy is not a sacrifice, especially with the attendant rewards of being a general officer. I know plenty of corporate executives who work every bit as much as the O-6+ class, and more. They miss family events, work on vacation, and also very little sleep. Like the generals, they do it for the pay, power, and prestige. And they aren't bad people for it. They also aren't martyrs.

 

There are good ones and bad ones. But an undying passion for the flag gets you through boot camp, not War College.

Edited June 26, 2021 by Lord Ratner

[Prozac]

4 hours ago, Lord Ratner said:

Bro... Given his entire adult life? Have you seen what the AF is like once you make colonel?

 

Being busy is not a sacrifice, especially with the attendant rewards of being a general officer. I know plenty of corporate executives who work every bit as much as the O-6+ class, and more. They miss family events, work on vacation, and also very little sleep. Like the generals, they do it for the pay, power, and prestige. And they aren't bad people for it. They also aren't martyrs.

 

There are good ones and bad ones. But an undying passion for the flag gets you through boot camp, not War College.

Not saying the Gen is the greatest American ever. But I find it highly unlikely that someone as thoroughly vetted as he would spend a career in the US military while being some sort of secret Marxist. It seems that the standard trope from the right these days is that anyone who might lean left is a Chinese Communist, Marxist, Socialist, ANTIFA stooge that’s part of Hillary’s grand plot to hand the United States over to the Bill Gates led cabal that runs the world. I write that tongue in cheek, but Jesus the conspiracy theories are out there these days. It must be exhausting for the true believers to keep up!

[kaputt]

2 hours ago, Prozac said:

Not saying the Gen is the greatest American ever. But I find it highly unlikely that someone as thoroughly vetted as he would spend a career in the US military while being some sort of secret Marxist. It seems that the standard trope from the right these days is that anyone who might lean left is a Chinese Communist, Marxist, Socialist, ANTIFA stooge that’s part of Hillary’s grand plot to hand the United States over to the Bill Gates led cabal that runs the world. I write that tongue in cheek, but Jesus the conspiracy theories are out there these days. It must be exhausting for the true believers to keep up!

The thing is though, a lot of the “slight left leaners” these days have fallen in line with some absolute bat shit leftist stuff. Look at what figures in politics, sports, media, business, and even some in the military, say and support publicly today that not all that long ago would have been thought insane. 
 

I don’t really think it’s a conspiracy theory when it’s right out there in the open for people to see. 
 

The million dollar question is why are these people doing this? I tend to agree that many of them are not secret marxists, which to me is even scarier. That means they have at some point recently taken the bait that these ideas aren’t so bad after all. It means that the soft words of equity, inclusion, etc… and the fear of being cancelled is probably working. 

[Lord Ratner]

5 hours ago, Prozac said:

Not saying the Gen is the greatest American ever. But I find it highly unlikely that someone as thoroughly vetted as he would spend a career in the US military while being some sort of secret Marxist. It seems that the standard trope from the right these days is that anyone who might lean left is a Chinese Communist, Marxist, Socialist, ANTIFA stooge that’s part of Hillary’s grand plot to hand the United States over to the Bill Gates led cabal that runs the world. I write that tongue in cheek, but Jesus the conspiracy theories are out there these days. It must be exhausting for the true believers to keep up!

Most of the "Marxists" knew nothing about Marx, they just wanted to belong to the intellectual class, which has *always* been infatuated with Marx for the same reason Marx wrote what he did. If only people did what I think is best, we'd live in a Utopia.

 

So no, the dear general is likely not a Marxist. He's either what is historically called a "useful idiot," or a habitual yes-man. As a general, the latter is most probable.

 

But when you are espousing and promoting the theories of proud Marxists, you shouldn't be shocked if you get lumped in with them. 

[Clark Griswold]

So no, the dear general is likely not a Marxist. He's either what is historically called a "useful idiot," or a habitual yes-man. As a general, the latter is most probable.

Could be both simultaneously, they’re not mutually exclusive

What was and is really bad about CRT at the USMA and mil in general is that it is indoctrination being presented falsely or defended as by leadership as education

When you walk into a briefing, presentation, class etc and are told you are this because of this with no objective examination of said theory it’s political / cultural indoctrination


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[lloyd christmas]

It sure is interesting listening to politicians in DC talk about the increase in violent crime going on across the country.  Biden’s tired and confused presser on the issue was really hard to watch.  We are going after rogue gun dealers…. I had no idea that the ATF or FBI had never gone after rogue gun dealers before.  

It certainly isn’t hard to understand or to predict this if you’re willing to be honest about it.  When Democrat politicians create a culture of crime via a defund the police movement, demonize law enforcement officers, do away with cash bail, incentivize single parenthood, decline to prosecute criminals, create martyrs/heroes out of life long violent thugs, etc you are going to see a sharp increase in crime.  And innocent people will suffer.  And our country will continue to fall apart.

I can’t imagine pairing the message and behavior of Democrat politicians with policies that would make it harder for law abiding citizens to protect themselves.  Scary stuff.