189Herk Posted February 8, 2017 Share Posted February 8, 2017 Does anyone else feel stabbed in the back by this? Instead of fixing the problems that make people want to get out, he wants to make it harder for his pilots to get hired by the airlines? What a low blow...or am I reading this wrong? 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BashiChuni Posted February 8, 2017 Share Posted February 8, 2017 that's how i take it too..."hey we can't fix our root problems so let's flood the hiring pool with civilian pilots so our guys have less opportunity to jump ship" 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gazmo Posted February 8, 2017 Share Posted February 8, 2017 This is not going to slow anything down. Most of us have 1,500+ PIC and then some. I know a bunch of SQ mates practically beating major airlines off with a stick, getting multiple interview opportunities with multiple legacy airlines.Sent from my SM-G935V using Tapatalk Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BADFNZ Posted February 8, 2017 Share Posted February 8, 2017 (edited) 52 minutes ago, Gazmo said: This is not going to slow anything down. Most of us have 1,500+ PIC and then some. I know a bunch of SQ mates practically beating major airlines off with a stick, getting multiple interview opportunities with multiple legacy airlines. Sent from my SM-G935V using Tapatalk I think you're missing the point. The current requirement is 1500 hours TT for any airline including regionals. If you lower that requirement, you're basically opening up the hiring pool to more off the street types that didn't have the luxury of logging monthly pond crossings or 8 hour orbits over Afghanistan. Edited February 8, 2017 by BADFNZ 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
flyusaf83 Posted February 8, 2017 Share Posted February 8, 2017 5 minutes ago, BADFNZ said: I think you're missing the point. The current requirement is 1500 hours TT for any airline including regionals. If you lower that requirement, you're basically opening up the hiring pool to more off the street types that didn't have the luxury of logging monthly pond crossings or 8 hour orbits over Afghanistan. Still would have minimal effect on AF pilots IMO. It would be easier for civilians to get hired on by regionals, but legacy carriers are hiring at well above the 1,500 hour requirement anyway (closer to 2,000 - 2,500). Most military guys aren't flying for regionals after getting out, so they aren't directly competing with low-time civilians. You could argue that this will make it easier for civilians to build time at regionals since they'll be able to get hired at a regional faster. However, they will still need to be there for a long time to start logging PIC time. 3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Posted February 8, 2017 Share Posted February 8, 2017 (edited) I think leadership is attempting to ride out the hiring boom or hope for some congressional relief akin to OP above. I think when leadership look at all the administrative red tape and political capital needed to undo no value additional duties, 365s and AFIs some tied to higher civil/DoD regulations, a congress who believes there is not a problem or don't really care (insert measly bonus increase to select flyers), weighted against that picture why should they (AF leadership) fall on their sword for a fight already lost (we just cut 25K) No one is going to listen to them until we are in a terrible spot (all the talk about lack of readiness will fall on deaf ears) or need to fight a war where we come up crazy short (and powers that be don't think we are there yet). keep your apps updated, get your prep early and often, keep in contact with your bros, get your recs, then interview, get a line number and pay it back because if you are within a few to six years of your ADSC now is the time to bounce. Barring some black swan get ready to be treated like a rockstar and be ear deep in more options, higher QOL and ¥$€£ Ref: United retirement peaks at 740 in 2028 does not take into account early and medical retirements, the other big ladies are equally shouting your name out! Edited February 8, 2017 by Guest Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
xaarman Posted February 8, 2017 Share Posted February 8, 2017 (edited) I firmly believe leadership doesn't believe the ops tempo, 365s, additional duties or anything else is a problem, we just need more people. If we had enough people to do <1 deployment a year, maybe one additional duty and not everyone got 179/365s regularly, there would be no problem. That being said, trying to lower the barriers for entrance in the civilian world so you stop bleeding people... what a backwards way of thinking. Edited February 8, 2017 by xaarman Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HerkFE Posted February 8, 2017 Share Posted February 8, 2017 Why TF would the FAA give two shits about this? FAA: Why should we do this? Goldfein: All of my people are leaving for a better QOL. FAA: Your concern is noted. 10 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SocialD Posted February 8, 2017 Share Posted February 8, 2017 19 minutes ago, HerkFE said: Why TF would the FAA give two shits about this? FAA: Why should we do this? Goldfein: All of my people are leaving for a better QOL. FAA: Your concern is noted. Why don't you get your shit in order before you come begging us to unfuck your house... FIFY. If they think it's bad now, I'm sure they're really scared about what it will look like in a few years. In 2020 Delta starts retiring 500+/year, and doesn't drop below that number until after 2030. Five of those years are 700+. Thats 51% of the current seniority list in 10 years...not accounting for early outs. I'm sure UAL/AALs numbers will follow closely. 3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Vetter Posted February 8, 2017 Share Posted February 8, 2017 Here are American's retirements for the next 20 years. Nothing to see here...move along. 2017 409 2018 545 2019 656 2020 782 2021 853 2022 874 2023 960 2024 932 2025 956 2026 903 2027 771 2028 668 2029 634 2030 549 2031 568 2032 493 2033 465 2034 390 2035 324 2036 248 2037 195 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
snoopyeast Posted February 8, 2017 Share Posted February 8, 2017 (edited) I laugh quite a bit every time I hear AF "pilot shortage". There is no shortage of pilots wanting to fly planes in the AF. There's a shortage of the AF placing those pilots in jobs that allow them to be pilots, and to teach other pilots. There's plenty of bag wearers sitting at group level positions, in staff jobs, at IDE, etc staring at a computer screen. I've flown less than 200 hours a year the last 3 years as an experienced MWS instructor because the AF values keeping the self fellating bureaucratic process running more that it values flight experience. Senior Capts and junior majors are begging to be 'allowed' to get back to teaching the young pilots, only to be told that they're more valued behind a desk. No thanks, see ya, welcome aboard Delta 4962, non stop to Chicago. Edited February 8, 2017 by snoopyeast 15 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Prozac Posted February 8, 2017 Share Posted February 8, 2017 Agree with snoopy. When I was competing for a pilot slot I thought there could be no more rewarding job in the world than being an Air Force pilot. I was not alone in this opinion. 12 years later I was exhausted, fed up, and burned out. If Big Blue can't figure out how to make this job rewarding enough to keep people around, I have little sympathy. 3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HossHarris Posted February 8, 2017 Share Posted February 8, 2017 The Air Force could make a blow job terrible. 20 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hopefulflyer389 Posted February 8, 2017 Share Posted February 8, 2017 (edited) 1 hour ago, HossHarris said: The Air Force could make a blow job terrible. Worth framing.. Edited February 8, 2017 by Hopefulflyer389 7 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
zmoney Posted February 8, 2017 Share Posted February 8, 2017 Reading the article, I got the sense that the CSAF wants to reduce my ability to find civilian airline employment. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gazmo Posted February 8, 2017 Share Posted February 8, 2017 Every single dude in my ANG unit who has applied to a major airline in the past 2 years has been hired. I'm talking 12+ people. United, Delta, JB, FedEx, SWA... you name them, they've been hired. This is with American pretty much not even hiring many OTS yet (they're starting to ramp up now). Just had two dudes get vid interview invites from AA a few weeks ago. Even if they lower the ATP to 750, the majors would much rather hire at the 3,000+ hour level. The average hours for someone getting hired at a major is somewhere near 4,000.Sent from my SM-G935V using Tapatalk Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ARAMP1 Posted February 8, 2017 Share Posted February 8, 2017 6 hours ago, snoopyeast said: I laugh quite a bit every time I hear AF "pilot shortage". There is no shortage of pilots wanting to fly planes in the AF. There's a shortage of the AF placing those pilots in jobs that allow them to be pilots, and to teach other pilots. So true. Plus the gross mis-management of personnel. I doubt AFPC could find their own ass with both hands. Hell, I was offered the VSP to leave and the bonus to stay in within 8 months of each other. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BashiChuni Posted February 8, 2017 Share Posted February 8, 2017 30 minutes ago, ARAMP1 said: Hell, I was offered the VSP to leave and the bonus to stay in within 8 months of each other. now that is hilarious Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Homestar Posted February 8, 2017 Share Posted February 8, 2017 7 hours ago, snoopyeast said: I laugh quite a bit every time I hear AF "pilot shortage". There is no shortage of pilots wanting to fly planes in the AF. There's a shortage of the AF placing those pilots in jobs that allow them to be pilots, and to teach other pilots. There's plenty of bag wearers sitting at group level positions, in staff jobs, at IDE, etc staring at a computer screen. I've flown less than 200 hours a year the last 3 years as an experienced MWS instructor because the AF values keeping the self fellating bureaucratic process running more that it values flight experience. Senior Capts and junior majors are begging to be 'allowed' to get back to teaching the young pilots, only to be told that they're more valued behind a desk. No thanks, see ya, welcome aboard Delta 4962, non stop to Chicago. All true. But changing the entire enterprise simply isn't feasible anymore, if it ever was. Regardless, I doubt the AF would change to a "pilots fly" model even if they could. It's where the generals come from, for better or worse. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Snooter Posted February 8, 2017 Share Posted February 8, 2017 6 hours ago, HossHarris said: The Air Force could make a blow job terrible. I'm pretty sure there's an AFMAN for that... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ThreeHoler Posted February 9, 2017 Share Posted February 9, 2017 Rumint says Fingers has pissed off ALPA.Sent from my iPhone using Baseops Network Forums Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pawnman Posted February 9, 2017 Share Posted February 9, 2017 11 hours ago, HossHarris said: The Air Force could make a blow job terrible. Relevant Terminal Lance. 3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ViperStud Posted February 9, 2017 Share Posted February 9, 2017 I'm kinda looking forward to seeing video of Goldfein suggesting this to congress. They laughed at the requested bonus hike and told the AF to get its shit out of the street. Now he wants to change a rule born from the Colgan mishap in a sad attempt to make it harder for mil pilots to have options? Meet the new boss, same as the old boss. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
08Dawg Posted February 9, 2017 Share Posted February 9, 2017 I get the sense all this would really do is knock the mins to be a regional FO back down to the 250-500 range and make it easier for all the poor kids coming out of ATP with $100K+ in debt to get a job. And since nobody I know has done anything but go straight to the right seat at Delta, American or United....nothing to see here, move along. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HAWDINGL Posted February 9, 2017 Share Posted February 9, 2017 Does anyone else feel stabbed in the back by this? Instead of fixing the problems that make people want to get out, he wants to make it harder for his pilots to get hired by the airlines? What a low blow...or am I reading this wrong?I tried googling this and couldn't find anything. Anyone have a source on this?Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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