Vertigo Posted October 20, 2012 Share Posted October 20, 2012 32-28 = 4 watt savings per tube 4 watts * 8 hours = 48 watt-hours = 0.048 kWh per tube per day 0.048 kWh/(tube-day) * $0.112/kWh = $0.005376 / (tube-day) $0.005376 / (tube-day) * 40,000 tubes = $215.04 / day $105,000 / ($215.04 / day) = Pay off in 488 days Assuming the tubes last as long as the replacements and the new tubes cost the same or less to replace, this isn't the worst ROI I've ever seen. Doesn't factor in the money we spent to purchase the 32 watt bulbs that are still perfectly useable but are being disposed of. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HU&W Posted October 20, 2012 Share Posted October 20, 2012 Doesn't factor in the money we spent to purchase the 32 watt bulbs that are still perfectly useable but are being disposed of. Standard practice is to ignore sunk costs in most government ROI calculations. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Groundbounder Posted October 20, 2012 Share Posted October 20, 2012 (edited) Standard practice is to ignore sunk costs in most government ROI calculations. Did I miss the installation and disposal costs in that calculation? Typical Gvt response to all of this "green" crap! Edit for clarity. Don't know if it is more clear though. Edited October 20, 2012 by Groundbounder Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pawnman Posted October 20, 2012 Share Posted October 20, 2012 Did I miss the installation and disposal costs in that calculation? Typical Gvt response to all of this "green" crap! Edit for clarity. Don't know if it is more clear though. What I'm curious about is, we did all this to be "green"...how are we handling the mercury in the 32 watt bulbs, I wonder? Is it more green to save yourself 4 watts by starting from scratch? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Texan Posted October 20, 2012 Share Posted October 20, 2012 (edited) Being a CE electrician in the prior E days... got to deal with this a lot. For the ROI aspect, you're just thinking bulbs. They're all powered by one or two ballasts per fixture. Each one of those is at least $40. If your building was around for a while, the old ballasts may have just been for 32W only. Can you power a 28W bulb in a 32W ballast? It's been done. But your ballast life will decrease. Sometimes saw a 32W T8 bulb in a 40W T12 fixture. It works just fine for about 6 months. Went into plenty of buildings that were new and by a year's time, about 10% of bulbs/ballasts/fixtures had shit the bed. Then (along with those big ass street light bulbs) we were supposed to turn all the old ones into DRMO/HAZMO/Recycling because of the mercury. Fun fact: If the bulbs were already broken, they're not hazardous. I've had all the powdery shit from the inside of them on me plenty of times. They're not hazardous as long as you don't eat a fluorescent bulb for lunch. Summary: IF you live to see the ROI, the building will have been remodeled again or demo'd. EDIT: SkyKing, run this ROI calculation: 25 175w Metal Halide lamps powered on 277v replaced by 25 LED 175w equivalents at a cost of $800 per fixture. The Metal Halides used about .75amps while the LED used .2amps. Then, 90hrs it took 2 of us to run around and re-do the pedestals to make them able to support the new fixtures at a cost of $50/man hour. This job was to "improve" the lighting shining on static displays at a heritage park. Edited October 20, 2012 by The Texan Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GearDownNoGreen Posted October 20, 2012 Share Posted October 20, 2012 Being a CE electrician in the prior E days... got to deal with this a lot. For the ROI aspect, you're just thinking bulbs. They're all powered by one or two ballasts per fixture. Each one of those is at least $40. If your building was around for a while, the old ballasts may have just been for 32W only. Can you power a 28W bulb in a 32W ballast? It's been done. But your ballast life will decrease. Sometimes saw a 32W T8 bulb in a 40W T12 fixture. It works just fine for about 6 months. Went into plenty of buildings that were new and by a year's time, about 10% of bulbs/ballasts/fixtures had shit the bed. 4 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sky_king Posted October 20, 2012 Share Posted October 20, 2012 (edited) EDIT: SkyKing, run this ROI calculation: 25 175w Metal Halide lamps powered on 277v replaced by 25 LED 175w equivalents at a cost of $800 per fixture. The Metal Halides used about .75amps while the LED used .2amps. Then, 90hrs it took 2 of us to run around and re-do the pedestals to make them able to support the new fixtures at a cost of $50/man hour. This job was to "improve" the lighting shining on static displays at a heritage park. Horrible pay off date. However, if the goal was to improve lighting and that was worth the $29,000, the pay off date means nothing. It's all about the goals. edit: I guess you can't copy directly from excel into here... Doesn't factor in the money we spent to purchase the 32 watt bulbs that are still perfectly useable but are being disposed of. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sunk_costs I'm to lazy to explain sunk costs. Edited October 20, 2012 by sky_king Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Vertigo Posted October 21, 2012 Share Posted October 21, 2012 Sounds familiar. An Iraq war veteran was made redundant just 72 HOURS before qualifying for a full Army pension. Sergeant Lee Nolan will lose out on at least £100,000 after he became one of 20,000 soldiers who are being axed in savage military cuts. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Darth Posted October 22, 2012 Share Posted October 22, 2012 The state of college football today? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rancormac Posted October 22, 2012 Share Posted October 22, 2012 NAU Homecoming court gender bending crown swap http://www.azcentral.com/video/1916673957001 sadly that's my alma mater Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
17D_guy Posted October 24, 2012 Share Posted October 24, 2012 Deployed soldier begins sex change http://www.armytimes.com/news/2012/10/PRIME-military-deployed-to-war-zone-soldier-begins-sex-change-101512w/ I always felt like I my left arm shouldn't be attached. I should get a doctor to take care of that for me... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
slackline Posted October 24, 2012 Share Posted October 24, 2012 (edited) I hope this embeds. My dad sent this to me from an airline buddy of his. Pretty funny, and even as a helo pilot (some can be known to be arrogant, but not me...) I can see a lot of truth in there unfortunately. Funny stuff though. http://www.xtranormal.com/watch/13404616/meet-the-new-fo Edit: embed didn't work. Tapatalk sucks... Edited October 24, 2012 by slackline Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AZwildcat Posted October 24, 2012 Share Posted October 24, 2012 sadly that's my alma mater True story Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
billy pilgrim Posted October 25, 2012 Share Posted October 25, 2012 True story Ha - what a tool, good stuff. I bet "Ace" had a 3.9 MPA -> send him straight to ENJJPT! Ugh - sadly too many guys like this have left their "legacy" on the active duty Air Force leaving us with the current culture... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
spaceman Posted October 25, 2012 Share Posted October 25, 2012 NAU Homecoming court gender bending crown swap http://www.azcentral...o/1916673957001 sadly that's my alma mater What! They have homecoming queens/kings/ambiguously gendered monarchs in college? That shit was already beyond gay in high school Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Royal Posted October 25, 2012 Share Posted October 25, 2012 Terminator-like bionic arm becomes reality for amputees: http://news.yahoo.com/video/uk-bionic-hand-hit-mass-183945007.html Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
snoopyeast Posted October 25, 2012 Share Posted October 25, 2012 Single mom challenges dismissal from Air Force http://www.cnn.com/2012/10/24/us/us-air-force-mom/index.html?hpt=hp_c1 Someone didn't read the fine print on their contract. As usual, the comments are gold. " This woman signed up for a contract to commit illegal acts, including mass murder, violation of Kellogg-Briand Treaty and the Geneva Convention, the Nuclear Non=Proliferation Treaty, and violations of many other laws. She certainly did not sign up to serve her country, only to serve the international corporations that tell its government what to do." "Well it's election season, and she's a female and things aren't going to way she wanted. Therefore it must be sexism and cause for feminist outrage. (Lol, baloney!)" Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Finger Four Posted October 25, 2012 Share Posted October 25, 2012 (edited) A guy who calls himself "Tank" insults paraplegic vet and his wife at a bar, and the bar kicks the vet out. Edited October 25, 2012 by Finger Four Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Vertigo Posted October 25, 2012 Share Posted October 25, 2012 A guy who calls himself "Tank" insults paraplegic vet and his wife at a bar, and the bar kicks the vet out. Three sides to every story. Seems the only one who did, or is doing right, is the owner. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
17D_guy Posted October 25, 2012 Share Posted October 25, 2012 Single mom challenges dismissal from Air Force Cry cry cry cry cry cry cry cry This one was a gem - Abortion was never an option, she said, because of her Catholic faith and her personal beliefs. Pick and choose much do we? Should have stayed a technical virgin. As Rainman would say, "Burger King." 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sky_king Posted October 25, 2012 Share Posted October 25, 2012 A guy who calls himself "Tank" insults paraplegic vet and his wife at a bar, and the bar kicks the vet out. “Don’t use your wheelchair as a crutch." Nice quote from the article. I'm not sure the guy thought about this comment before he said it, because I'm sure the vet would rather have a crutch than a wheelchair. Either way. I'd like the know the 4th version of the story. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
338skybolt Posted October 25, 2012 Share Posted October 25, 2012 LG has some elevator fun with it's new monitors: Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Danny Noonin Posted October 25, 2012 Share Posted October 25, 2012 Pick and choose much do we? Should have stayed a technical virgin. Did I read your post correctly? Did you just equate premarital sex with abortion on the Catholic morality-o-meter? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
17D_guy Posted October 25, 2012 Share Posted October 25, 2012 Did I read your post correctly? Did you just equate premarital sex with abortion on the Catholic morality-o-meter? We could spin that wheel and I'd be at a loss to figure out which sins require what in prostration/penance/payment. More about the "I'm a faithful Catholic" in one area and holding it up as a reason she couldn't "fix" the problem. But.. if she'd been that devout in the first place there wouldn't have been this situation. Is she married now? I didn't see it in the article, but I was skimming. Where's the faith? Don't throw your faith out there as a reason you can't do something, when you've already done something your faith is against. That being said, I'm glad she didn't boot the kiddo. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ThreeHoler Posted October 26, 2012 Share Posted October 26, 2012 We could spin that wheel and I'd be at a loss to figure out which sins require what in prostration/penance/payment. More about the "I'm a faithful Catholic" in one area and holding it up as a reason she couldn't "fix" the problem. But.. if she'd been that devout in the first place there wouldn't have been this situation. Is she married now? I didn't see it in the article, but I was skimming. Where's the faith? Don't throw your faith out there as a reason you can't do something, when you've already done something your faith is against. That being said, I'm glad she didn't boot the kiddo. All she had to do was pop the kid out and let her parents "adopt" it. Just like all the dumbass Academy dudes who get their girlfriends preggo...you can't have dependents. Simple as that. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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