35 minutes ago, FourFans said:

"Iranian media" is almost as credible a source as the War Thunder forums...though the forums have more accurate tech data...

Do you genuinely believe the the air-to-ground curb stomping Iran is receiving is on par with the failed all-out invasion a next door neighbor by Russia? Tell me again how you aren't disgruntedemployee's troll account.

From a geopolitical stance yes.

We've shown we can't defend our bases abroad against drones or balastic missiles. A curbstomping doesn't cost us multiple strategic aircraft. It doesn't cost us billion dollar radar arrays. It doesn't cost us American lives. It has Displayed our weaknesses to China. We've shown the degree to which we've ostracised ourselves from our allies with most of Europe refusing over flights. We've shown that we lack any long term planning capabilities or forethought by rushing into this without having a plan for keeping the strait open. We've put iran in a stronger position as they have gone from a theoretical to actual control of the straits. Rising oil prices are increasing the funds in both Iran and Russia's pocket to continue their fight. Iranian leadership may be dead but clearly they're working decentralized ops well. There's no scenario in which we walk away from this in the near term with any meaningful victory. Blowing stuff up doesn't equal winning on the global stage.

Oh and no one trusts on the world stage trusts us to negotiate anymore seeing as it was never serious and used as a pretext to prepare strikes. We had a solid deal that this admin tore up the first time. We've messaged to the world "get nukes ASAP or you're next."

For the photos. A few more have come out plus some vids of a herk and Blackhawk allegedly conducting sar over Iran. I don't trust everything but there's some decent amount of reports coming out and unfortunately our propaganda arm is just as unreliable.

SAR ops vids:

https://x.com/sentdefender/status/2040044384951922868?s=20

https://x.com/Osinttechnical/status/2040059365189722249?s=20b

Edited 4 hours ago4 hr by No One

Now confirmed by the US or is that also fake news? Or is it OK to change the story now that daddy has said? Regardless of my support for this snafu I hope the crew got out.

U.S. Fighter Jet Shot Down Over Iran, U.S. Officials and Iran Say

Edited 5 hours ago5 hr by No One

Wow, this thread took off since I last checked it.

I think one thing most of us can agree on is that the American people should be skeptical anytime any Administration promises a swift, clean military operation. The enemy gets a vote, and it almost always ends up more messy than promised.

We’ve lost access to the Strait of Hormuz, several American lives, and billions of dollars of hardware. We have no choice but to double down now. <s>

https://www.thedailybeast.com/iran-shoots-down-us-f-15-fighter-in-humiliation-for-trump/

2 minutes ago, Sua Sponte said:

https://www.thedailybeast.com/iran-shoots-down-us-f-15-fighter-in-humiliation-for-trump/

At this time Foxnews.com still has their headline story being tiger Woods and it's no where on the Iran page. It's not humiliating until maga gets informed.

If we're lucky Hegseth finally gets canned over this and an actual military professional steps in.

Again?

WSJ confirmed a shoot down but didn’t list their source. Godspeed to the crew if true.

17 minutes ago, frog said:

WSJ confirmed a shoot down but didn’t list their source. Godspeed to the crew if true.

I guess we have an answer on the bounty. Reportedly around 60K.

Mail Online

Iran puts BOUNTY on American pilots after US fighter jet...

Iranian state media is incentivizing civilians to capture American pilots with a 'reward' after the regime claimed it shot down a US fighter jet.

RUMMIT: Pilot was rescued, WSO was captured.

5 hours ago, No One said:

Add another F-15E to the tab? I'm sure China is loving the data and arms testing like we got with Russia in Ukraine. This is quite literally our version of a "3 day special military operation." No word on the crew or other sourcing but it looks legit.

13,000 DMPI's hit in 30+ days of combat ops flying many hundreds of sorties per day with two aircraft damage (that we know of), and ONE shot down. China and Russia are likely shocked at the data.

23 minutes ago, ClearedHot said:

13,000 DMPI's hit in 30+ days of combat ops flying many hundreds of sorties per day with two aircraft damage (that we know of), and ONE shot down. China and Russia are likely shocked at the data.

Don’t be talking with any sense now…

People here want this to fail and all our troops to fail and highlight that only.

Edited 2 hours ago2 hr by jonlbs

This is war...people seem to forget that whether one thinks we're in this for the right reasons or not. People (dorks on Reddit mostly) are calling this an abject failure and how the US isn't the air superiority king it used to be. We've reigned supreme in the air for nearly a half century and people have become accustomed to/expected that to continue. No one wants to see dudes/dudettes get shot down, but it's gonna happen, even with air supremacy. As @ClearedHot pointed out, pretty good mission success rate so far. Further, we haven't faced an adversary with this capability for over 20 years (maybe even going back to DS). This isn't Ahmad taking plink shots with his AK over in the 'Stan.

26 minutes ago, ClearedHot said:

13,000 DMPI's hit in 30+ days of combat ops flying many hundreds of sorties per day with two aircraft damage (that we know of), and ONE shot down. China and Russia are likely shocked at the data.

And yet the straits are closed by Iran doubling the price of oil, the regime is still in power, they still have ballistic missile and long range drone capabilities, and now have a POW for political purposes.

Remind me how many targets did we strike in Afghanistan? Vietnam? What was the result? Strikes do not equal victory. What are our objectives here? Have they been achieved? No one knows because leadership hasn't said and I'm not sure they even know.

It's not that I want this to fail but we have no business being here in the first place. We have no objectives. No means to pull out. No way to achieve meaningful objectives without a long protracted costly and likely bloody conflict. We've been at war in the middle East for decades. Can we stop wasting money, time, and lives over there and focus on home? How are we making America great again when we're slashing funding for infrastructure, Healthcare, etc. to bomb mud huts? When we're irreversibly damaging our soft power by being unreliable negotiators. Trying to bully our European allies to get involved in this. Showing we can't protect our middle Eastern allies who've given us land for bases.

All against Iran. Imagine a near peer like China. We'd be screwed both in the soft and hard power spheres. They're already starting to dominate us in soft power.

2 hours ago, M2 said:

Again?

Y'all are ridiculous. First "it didn't happen" because the multiple reliable osint sources aren't reliable. Then after it's been confirmed by both sides it's "again?" as if it's a joke before knowing the status of the crew. I hope the MIA, potential american POW, has no idea that y'all think this is hilarious.

Edited 2 hours ago2 hr by No One

24 minutes ago, B52gator said:

This is war...people seem to forget that whether one thinks we're in this for the right reasons or not. People (dorks on Reddit mostly) are calling this an abject failure and how the US isn't the air superiority king it used to be. We've reigned supreme in the air for nearly a half century and people have become accustomed to/expected that to continue. No one wants to see dudes/dudettes get shot down, but it's gonna happen, even with air supremacy. As @ClearedHot pointed out, pretty good mission success rate so far. Further, we haven't faced an adversary with this capability for over 20 years (maybe even going back to DS). This isn't Ahmad taking plink shots with his AK over in the 'Stan.

That’s a valid tactical position. However, how do you evaluate if the costs are worth the objectives if the objectives are fluid and ill defined?

I felt the same way when I was young and GWOT was kicking off. Now, twenty-five year later, I’d be pissed if my child was captured or killed in an operation that was not well coordinated or communicated at the political level.

I’m a conservative, and I hope we absolutely smoke them and everyone comes home safe now that we are in this fight. However, so far, we are worse off politically and strategically, and we are losing lives and money. We are going to get sucked into a ground war if we are serious about the objectives that have been floated because they can’t be achieved solely through the air without nuclear weapons. We know that our ground force in Iraq and Afghanistan were way too small to achieve the desired political objectives. So, where does that leave us?

This administration is going to run into the same conundrum that previous administrations have encountered. We have the firepower to eliminate Iran to the point that it will no longer exist as a country, but we aren’t willing to do it because of the humanitarian cost. If we aren’t willing to bear those costs, then maybe we shouldn’t have turned down this road to start with.

Edited 2 hours ago2 hr by frog

39 minutes ago, B52gator said:

This is war...people seem to forget that whether one thinks we're in this for the right reasons or not. People (dorks on Reddit mostly) are calling this an abject failure and how the US isn't the air superiority king it used to be. We've reigned supreme in the air for nearly a half century and people have become accustomed to/expected that to continue. No one wants to see dudes/dudettes get shot down, but it's gonna happen, even with air supremacy. As @ClearedHot pointed out, pretty good mission success rate so far. Further, we haven't faced an adversary with this capability for over 20 years (maybe even going back to DS). This isn't Ahmad taking plink shots with his AK over in the 'Stan.

Yes, this conflict has been a tactical success so far. The Joint Force has shown that rhetoric matches reality. However, tactical success must convey strategic meaning, as Colin Gray would write. I'm not sure we can have strategic success if the objectives keep changing and the Administration cannot convey the necessity of this conflict to the body politic.

12 minutes ago, No One said:

Y'all are ridiculous. First "it didn't happen" because the multiple reliable osint sources aren't reliable. Then after it's been confirmed by both sides it's "again?" as if it's a joke before knowing the status of the crew. I hope the MIA, potential american POW, has no idea that y'all think this is hilarious.

Take a breath, kid. Suggesting that a fighter pilot wouldn't find a way to make a joke out of anything is a dead giveaway that you aren't anywhere close to the pointy end of the spear.

What exactly do you think these lunatics were going to do with a nuke? They've done everything they can slaughter their great foes, Israel and America. Despite bringing on immeasurable pain and suffering to their people and themselves each time, nothing stops them from their great jihad.

This is fundamentally a domestic problem. We've had it so good for so long that it seems a whole lot of Americans, even ones in the military, forgot how world peace is secured. I suspect it's gotten bad enough that there will be no off ramps to the great war, but at least someone is willing to move pieces around on the board to give us a better shot at winning. It's mind-blowing to me that "someone" is a borderline delusional reality TV star, but here we are.

3 minutes ago, frog said:

I felt the same way when I was young and GWOT was kicking off. Now, twenty-five year later, I’d be pissed if my child was captured or killed in an operation that was not well coordinated or communicated at the political level.

Couldn't the same have been said for OIF? I'm sure there were plenty of parents who were former military that had kids of their own fighting in Iraq over "WMD". I'm sure it's sentiment that will continue to be repeated. Not being dismissive of your point, it has some validity, I don't think this has been handled well politically...but that's just like my opinion man. But I do agree that I hope we use everything we can to smoke 'em win decisively (whatever that means), and get everybody home.

Some of the guys on this site are getting hysterical…..I remember when we attacked Gaddafi and the usual weak sisters were decrying how Libya would obliterate us and start WW III. Fox News just announced that they weren’t reporting on the rescue efforts/results for security reasons, Not MAGA reasons like some of the TDS afflicted posters stated.

Edited 2 hours ago2 hr by Vito

8 minutes ago, Vito said:

Some of the guys on this site are getting hysterical…..I remember when we attacked Gaddafi and the usual weak sisters were decrying how Libya would obliterate us and start WW III. Fox News just announced that they weren’t reporting on the rescue efforts/results for security reasons, Not MAGA reasons like some of the TDS afflicted posters stated.

They just can't help themselves...funny and sad at the same time...must be a joy to live with.

34 minutes ago, Lord Ratner said:

What exactly do you think these lunatics were going to do with a nuke? They've done everything they can slaughter their great foes, Israel and America. Despite bringing on immeasurable pain and suffering to their people and themselves each time, nothing stops them from their great jihad.

Just popping in for the friendly weekly reminder that at no point leading up to this stupid boondoggle did our own intel community assess Iran was developing a nuke. 2025 DNI report saying as much is linked a few pages back. But please don’t let inconvenient facts like that interfere with fear mongering about it.

There’s some pretty bad faith comments in here to the point that it’s honestly gotten tiresome. This might sound strange to some of you but it’s perfectly possible to disagree with the policy and strategy underpinning a war without being a “scaredy cat” or “against the troops” or “rooting for failure.”

50 minutes ago, Vito said:

Some of the guys on this site are getting hysterical…..I remember when we attacked Gaddafi and the usual weak sisters were decrying how Libya would obliterate us and start WW III. Fox News just announced that they weren’t reporting on the rescue efforts/results for security reasons, Not MAGA reasons like some of the TDS afflicted posters stated.

1. Haven't seen proof of that on fox's articles. Not to mention we still have someone MIA so those "reasons" should still apply.

2. Y'all love to blame TDS. Believe it or not many of us disapprove of these actions for multiple reasons not just because Trump's admin pulled the trigger. We take sides based on policy and beliefs not based on what our leadership tell us to parrot. Had this been a democratic pres, Israel alone, etc. I still would be disapproving for all the reasons I've stated. I'm tired of being in the middle East. I'm tired of spending my tax dollars on excessive amounts of ordinance rather than projects at home. I'm tired of seeing generation after generation sent off to do dumb shit. And we don't have a lame "let's go Brandon" chant among other derangements if you want to get started down the TDS path.

3. But what about the nukes? If Iran wanted to they've shown they have the capability to launch a dirty bomb and make Israel uninhabitable. They haven't. If Iran wanted to they could develop a nuke (1940s tech), they haven't. They've continually come to the negotiating table and used the "what if" as a card. Then abide by the treaties to keep their program in check. Treaties that Trump removed us from for no reason.

1 hour ago, Lord Ratner said:

Take a breath, kid. Suggesting that a fighter pilot wouldn't find a way to make a joke out of anything is a dead giveaway that you aren't anywhere close to the pointy end of the spear.

What exactly do you think these lunatics were going to do with a nuke? They've done everything they can slaughter their great foes, Israel and America. Despite bringing on immeasurable pain and suffering to their people and themselves each time, nothing stops them from their great jihad.

This is fundamentally a domestic problem. We've had it so good for so long that it seems a whole lot of Americans, even ones in the military, forgot how world peace is secured. I suspect it's gotten bad enough that there will be no off ramps to the great war, but at least someone is willing to move pieces around on the board to give us a better shot at winning. It's mind-blowing to me that "someone" is a borderline delusional reality TV star, but here we are.

Herk driver. We're a bit too round and blunt to be the tip of the spear but I've gone into plenty of sketchy spots fighter guys won't ever go. In my personal opinion i's fine to joke after the fact but while the crew, now just the wso is mia I'm not going to joke about it.

Iran has saber rattled occasionally every few months but never actually threatened global stability. Not even regional. They around with Israel through non state actors. Not our problem. But we poked our noses in and now it's become a regional issue and a global economic issue with no strategic goals.

A-10 crashed as well, pilot rescued.

“But what about the nukes? If Iran wanted to they've shown they have the capability to launch a dirty bomb and make Israel uninhabitable. They haven't. If Iran wanted to they could develop a nuke (1940s tech), they haven't”

AMAZING, defending the Iranian regime and giving them the benefit of doubt…But if Iran nuked somebody, it would be exactly like all the libs after 9/11, All they did was second guess why we didn’t do anything before about Al Qiada.