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Promotion and PRF Information

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zach braff    34
48 minutes ago, zmoney said:

Until I see it from a .mil website, I remain skeptical. 

Check a few posts ago - was direct from AFPC's .mil site.  It's on the main portal now as well. http://www.af.mil/News/Article-Display/Article/1309770/air-force-announces-100-percent-promotion-opportunity-to-major/

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Duck    852

It says there is more info on mypers, yet the "link" is not really a link and mypers is silent on the issue last I checked. Great job rolling this pile of $hit out AF.

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zmoney    29
14 minutes ago, zach braff said:

Check a few posts ago - was direct from AFPC's .mil site.  It's on the main portal now as well. http://www.af.mil/News/Article-Display/Article/1309770/air-force-announces-100-percent-promotion-opportunity-to-major/

15 minutes ago, BFM this said:

It was a .mil website.

...?

Sure is. I saw a similar post on FB that wasn't on .mil and I confused the two. My mistake. 

 

 

Edited by zmoney

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SurelySerious    416
1 hour ago, zmoney said:

I could be wrong, but I think "100% Promotion Opportunity" is how we promote 1st Lieutenants and Captains. In other words, the board meets only to review the records of those who might not be "Fully Qualified"--meaning those who have received a DNP or have a UIF. When everyone meets the board, they're only promoting those who are "Best Qualified."

Bottom line, unless I'm wrong, this means that unless you receive a DNP or have a UIF (or some other unfavorable report), you won't even meet the board--you're promoted.

My commentary wasn't on the process itself, but rather that the AF is portraying this as some great thing they're doing for people, when it's a self-induced reaction to the circumstances, and that people who otherwise don't want to get promoted could be voluntold. 

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zmoney    29
Just now, SurelySerious said:

My commentary wasn't on the process itself, but rather that the AF is portraying this as some great thing they're doing for people, when it's a self-induced reaction to the circumstances, and that people who otherwise don't want to get promoted could be voluntold. 

I'll drink to that.  :jd:

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dream big    131

Yes! How many man hours do we waste taking a line flying IP and making him do exec work, all because he "needs it for major/ school select?"  How many man hours does he then waste editing OPRs and PRFs for 0-4? I may be optimistic, but hopefully this news coupled with eliminating school selects means we at least delay the fray of queen that a mid level captain faces allowing them to focus on the mission/ their primary job.

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matmacwc    1,093
21 minutes ago, dream big said:

Yes! How many man hours do we waste taking a line flying IP and making him do exec work, all because he "needs it for major/ school select?"  How many man hours does he then waste editing OPRs and PRFs for 0-4? I may be optimistic, but hopefully this news coupled with eliminating school selects means we at least delay the fray of queen that a mid level captain faces allowing them to focus on the mission/ their primary job.

There will be paperwork for everybody, how else do they justify the school selects or rack and stack.

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Homestar    360

I've never had to do anything more than a ribbon chart for a rack and stack.  A lot fewer man-hours involved in that.  And now that Wg/CCs control the process of who attends ACSC in-res it makes sense to simply turn the O-4 board into a rubber stamp for promotion.

O-4 wasn't really competitive anyway.  I want to say my year group to O-4 was 95% promotion rate.  It will be interesting to see how this will affect O-5 promotions 4 years from now.

 

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Hermey    1

"smartly reducing administrative burdens on squadron commanders."

Maybe for next year. PRFs were due to the group weeks ago in my corner of the AF....countless Sq man-hours already wasted. I'm sure most Sq's have started...maybe this was announced just in time for some?

Hope it sticks around! PRFs are a waste of time. 

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raimius    50
1 hour ago, Duck said:

It says there is more info on mypers, yet the "link" is not really a link and mypers is silent on the issue last I checked. Great job rolling this pile of $hit out AF.

Standard

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Breckey    295

In 2013 I had to have a PRF for Captain that was never used, now in 2017 I had to get a PRF for Major together...that won't be used. 

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schokie    57

What are they odds they backtrack on this next year just in time for PRFs to be late?

While this is a kick in the balls for folks that have been passed over for O-4 in the past, it's the right thing to do. Of the 5% not being promoted in the past, 2.5% have been good dudes getting hosed by the system. The other 2.5% with negative indicators will continue to be ID'd. But the real win is cutting out the insane amount of queep driven from the group and wing level. Maybe the O-6's will have time to actually leave the office and lead now that they're not stuck wasting time on Major PRFs. 

Second order effect will be the lack of Christmas party planning and masters degrees since no one will be worried about making Major. Young wingman actually have time to study now. 

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Duck    852

They will find some other BS to fill your time. Can't have anyone working less than a 60 hour week. We want the taxpayers to get their money's worth.

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olevelo    4
What are they odds they backtrack on this next year just in time for PRFs to be late?
While this is a kick in the balls for folks that have been passed over for O-4 in the past, it's the right thing to do. Of the 5% not being promoted in the past, 2.5% have been good dudes getting hosed by the system. The other 2.5% with negative indicators will continue to be ID'd. But the real win is cutting out the insane amount of queep driven from the group and wing level. Maybe the O-6's will have time to actually leave the office and lead now that they're not stuck wasting time on Major PRFs. 
Second order effect will be the lack of Christmas party planning and masters degrees since no one will be worried about making Major. Young wingman actually have time to study now. 

There's nothing in the statements that indicate this will continue next year, much less in the future. For any of the "positives" to come out of this for both the upcoming captains as well as the leadership chain, this can't be announced year to year.

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panchbarnes    164

cough *stop loss* cough

CH did warn people a while back...

 

Edited to add:

Snide remarks aside, it's a pretty insulting move to the people who busted their ass to progress to the next level.  Congratulations, for the majority of you folks, it doesn't matter how hard you worked to get that strat, you are no better than the person in the next cubicle over.  The few HPOs know who they are and won't be affected.  What matters is the AF will have plenty of "selects" to send to the various lower tier NAF/MAJCOM/Joint staff billets to appease the screaming commanders, who've had to hire extra contractors, and approve UFRs as stop gap solutions.  At the end, these "selects" will likely not advance to O-5 and be happy to retire as O-4s.  Air Force solves the manning problems it created and everyone is happy.

This is just another example how you and I are just a number in the big blues' eyes.  One solution fits all, which is natural for a large bureaucracy.  It'd be interesting to see the number of people who decline the promotion opportunity and just leave the service.

All I gotta say is the people, civilian or military, who were been involved with Force Management policies since the Debbie James days, needs to be fired immediately.  But we all know that will never happen.  Accountability is not one of our Core Values and is only a theory taught at Maxwell.

Or maybe, they are doing this in anticipation of major event(s) happening throughout the world in the near future...but what do I know?

CH was right all along...

/Rambling off

 

Edited by panchbarnes
rambling
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drewpey    101
1 hour ago, panchbarnes said:

cough *stop loss* cough

CH did warn people a while back...

 

Edited to add:

Snide remarks aside, it's a pretty insulting move to the people who busted their ass to progress to the next level.  Congratulations, for the majority of you folks, it doesn't matter how hard you worked to get that strat, you are no better than the person in the next cubicle over.  The few HPOs know who they are and won't be affected.  What matters is the AF will have plenty of "selects" to send to the various lower tier NAF/MAJCOM/Joint staff billets to appease the screaming commanders, who've had to hire extra contractors, and approve UFRs as stop gap solutions.  At the end, these "selects" will likely not advance to O-5 and be happy to retire as O-4s.  Air Force solves the manning problems it created and everyone is happy.

This is just another example how you and I are just a number in the big blues' eyes.  One solution fits all, which is natural for a large bureaucracy.  It'd be interesting to see the number of people who decline the promotion opportunity and just leave the service.

All I gotta say is the people, civilian or military, who were been involved with Force Management policies since the Debbie James days, needs to be fired immediately.  But we all know that will never happen.  Accountability is not one of our Core Values and is only a theory taught at Maxwell.

Or maybe, they are doing this in anticipation of major event(s) happening throughout the world in the near future...but what do I know?

CH was right all along...

/Rambling off

 

Is this something to be angry about?  It was already a 90% promote rate, and if you are looking to get a strat you aren't concerned about pinning on, but rather getting a school slot.  This doesn't change that.

Higher promotion rates are better for everyone.  It gives people more flexibility in their careers without getting completely hosed because they didn't follow the expected career path.  Sure old crusties get their panties in a wad because "major used to mean something"...but the more off-ramps the USAF removes on the highway to LtCol the more likely the "flying-only" career path is for guys who just want to fly.  The checking of boxes for career progression (SOS, Masters, Flt/CC, ADO) is the epitome of kabuki theater, and the easier they make it to get promoted the less box-checking we have to deal with.

I for one welcome more FGOs into the court martial duty pool.

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BFM this    310
12 hours ago, dream big said:

 How many man hours does he then waste editing OPRs and PRFs for 0-4?

How many man hours do we waste on that one non-value added requirement: no white space.  It's easily 95% of the effort that goes into those things.  Plain English; articulate in two to three complete English sentences, why we should promote this officer.  Done.  Still room in the block?  Yes; did you complete the thought and make the case?  Then fuck it: done.

I just saved the USAF 100,000 officer man-hours in the next year.  Airmen's time.  Oh, wait, we talk about Airmen's time, but it's calculated as valueless, so never mind.

Edited by BFM this
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flyusaf83    98
2 hours ago, BFM this said:

How many man hours do we waste on that one non-value added requirement: no white space.  It's easily 95% of the effort that goes into those things.  Plain English; articulate in two to three complete English sentences, why we should promote this officer.  Done.  Still room in the block?  Yes; did you complete the thought and make the case?  Then it: done.

I just saved the USAF 100,000 officer man-hours in the next year.  Airmen's time.  Oh, wait, we talk about Airmen's time, but it's calculated as valueless, so never mind.

I think it should be easier than that. No fluff in OPRs. Just strats. Give all of your people a positional strat, rank strat, and CGO/FGO strat.  Do it annually to replace OPRs. I have never understood why only the top 15-20 percent get strats when we promote 90-95 percent to Major and 60ish percent to Lt Col.  

#80/100 Captains should be good enough for Maj. And it lets that individual know that while he/she will make Major, he/she has to make improvements to make Lt Col.  This is a much better thing that to lump together the bottom 80-85 percent who don't get strats.

And then no time-wasting bullets.

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dream big    131
6 hours ago, drewpey said:

Is this something to be angry about?  It was already a 90% promote rate, and if you are looking to get a strat you aren't concerned about pinning on, but rather getting a school slot.  This doesn't change that.

Higher promotion rates are better for everyone.  It gives people more flexibility in their careers without getting completely hosed because they didn't follow the expected career path.  Sure old crusties get their panties in a wad because "major used to mean something"...but the more off-ramps the USAF removes on the highway to LtCol the more likely the "flying-only" career path is for guys who just want to fly.  The checking of boxes for career progression (SOS, Masters, Flt/CC, ADO) is the epitome of kabuki theater, and the easier they make it to get promoted the less box-checking we have to deal with.

I for one welcome more FGOs into the court martial duty pool.

There are people mad about this along with eliminating school selects from the board: they seem to be the CGOC/nonner types who are mad they can't get ahead by out volunteering those actually deploying and doing the mission.  Heck, if for anything, I love these changes as it is a slap in the face for every careerist CGO.

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Pork Barrel    1
9 hours ago, panchbarnes said:

cough *stop loss* cough

CH did warn people a while back...

 

Edited to add:

Snide remarks aside, it's a pretty insulting move to the people who busted their ass to progress to the next level.  Congratulations, for the majority of you folks, it doesn't matter how hard you worked to get that strat, you are no better than the person in the next cubicle over.  The few HPOs know who they are and won't be affected.  What matters is the AF will have plenty of "selects" to send to the various lower tier NAF/MAJCOM/Joint staff billets to appease the screaming commanders, who've had to hire extra contractors, and approve UFRs as stop gap solutions.  At the end, these "selects" will likely not advance to O-5 and be happy to retire as O-4s.  Air Force solves the manning problems it created and everyone is happy.

This is just another example how you and I are just a number in the big blues' eyes.  One solution fits all, which is natural for a large bureaucracy.  It'd be interesting to see the number of people who decline the promotion opportunity and just leave the service.

All I gotta say is the people, civilian or military, who were been involved with Force Management policies since the Debbie James days, needs to be fired immediately.  But we all know that will never happen.  Accountability is not one of our Core Values and is only a theory taught at Maxwell.

Or maybe, they are doing this in anticipation of major event(s) happening throughout the world in the near future...but what do I know?

CH was right all along...

/Rambling off

 

Maybe it exemplifies the lack of trust between personnel and the Air Force but I don't see how this carries over to O-5. Auto promote to O-4 and cull them instead at O-5 with APZ or Continuation (because at 14 or so they'll put in the extra six) or save the force some money with those under the old retirement system when they remove themselves. Paranoia? Absolutely.

The lesson learned should be DON'T LIE TO YOUR PEOPLE. It is never worth it. On the one hand we have auto promotion, separate school selects, and no non-value-added masters, and yet I nor anyone one else believes the Air Force because of at least a decade of broken promises and bounced checks to us and people we know. That doesn't disappear and takes a generation to filter out.

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Duck    852

The only people I see this really screws are guys who are on their second look for this board. If they promote all the APZers it really fvcks them when they were making plans to separate/go to the Guard/provide for their family, etc. Hopefully they still take letters to the board in consideration.

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NKAWTG    32

This is a completely pragmatic move, and totally unlike the air force I grew up with.  When they removed the school selects, and let the wings duke it out, the majority of work the promotion boards did is OBE.  It really wasn't worth the time to decide the 5-7% of the year group that gets passed over.  We've gone from the implied masters requirement among all the checkboxes to the ability to fog a mirror.  Times are a changing.

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