Aviation Continuation Pay (ACP - The Bonus)

[SFG]

15 hours ago, Homestar said:

Nothing wrong with attempting innovation in the UPT enterprise. We can’t stop calling for QOL and compensation improvements tho. 

Agreed. Context: “spending another 25-100 million $$ per year for the next decade trying a dozen different ways to produce our way out of the problem.”

I’m all for innovation, QOL improvements, and attacking this thing from multiple angles.  It’s spending wads of money to try to widen the mouth of the pipeline when a fraction of that could double the bonus and stop the bleeding instantly that makes me hurt for the guys and gals on the line doing more and more with less and less. How much longer can we sustain take rates well below the 65% that we require to maintain a healthy force, when we’re way beyond unhealthy? I bet if we retained more seasoned pilots we could increase production at a fraction of the cost of some of these other experiments. I’m not disparaging PTN or UPT 2.5 or whatever... I’m talking about stuff like contract UPT, new UPT bases, diversity outreach etc. Stuff that might be good, but is not the solution we need right this minute and is costing $$$10s of millions of dollars. We have not yet gone to Congress begging and pleading. They must think things are pretty darn good now that we’ve leveled off. 

The big lie is that we can’t compete on compensation. No, not that improvements should not be happening with or without a crisis, but QOL is where we will never compete.

[SFG]

13 minutes ago, ThreeHoler said:

Like everything else it won’t really matter or change anything because people who are already APZ have OPR(s) that no longer have a command push or strats as a result of being passed over. So, unless there is some way to fix that, the people currently APZ (new IPZ window) will not get promoted at any significantly higher rate.


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Yeah, Commanders’ attitudes will need to change along with the change in policy. I wonder what would happen if we hid year-groups from Commanders 😱

[pawnman]

1 hour ago, K_O said:

Yeah, Commanders’ attitudes will need to change along with the change in policy. I wonder what would happen if we hid year-groups from Commanders 😱

They can read dates on your OPR and training reports.

[SFG]

4 hours ago, brawnie said:

Also relatively easy fix, mask everything but the most recent 3-4 years or so.

How dare you innovate.  This would risk having us rate guys based on their performance and not based on their year group or what jobs they did or did not have in the past or whether they were going to a board or not.  Be safe out there folks... it's about to get weird!

[FLEA]

15 hours ago, K_O said:

How dare you innovate.  This would risk having us rate guys based on their performance and not based on their year group or what jobs they did or did not have in the past or whether they were going to a board or not.  Be safe out there folks... it's about to get weird!

I would actually be a big fan of expunging rank and YG on boards. Let the record speak for itself. 

 

[SurelySerious]

24 minutes ago, FLEA said:

I would actually be a big fan of expunging rank and YG on boards. Let the record speak for itself. 

 

Wait, how else would we know if “it’s their turn”?! Should also apply to TRBs in certain airframes along with “they need it for their PRF.”

[genie90]

Anyone heard rumors on the FY20 ACP?

[SFG]

17 minutes ago, genie90 said:

Anyone heard rumors on the FY20 ACP?

I’d expect late Jan or Feb. They have to have a bunch more meetings, release and clarify some new initiatives, and the CSAF needs to have his annual state of the Air Force spiel first.

[Hunter Rose]

Annual retention report is out.

Active Duty grew the pilot force by 54. At this rate, we’ll be where our manning numbers need to be in a mere 13-15 years!  What a stupendous job Aircrew Task Force!

The Generals need to cry uncle. They need to ask Congress for a bigger bonus, or if stuck with only a $35K bonus they need to offer it with a one year commitment and renewable annually. 

Edited November 25, 2019 by Hunter Rose

[SFG]

1 hour ago, Hunter Rose said:

Annual retention report is out.

Active Duty grew the pilot force by 54. At this rate, we’ll be where our manning numbers need to be in a mere 13-15 years!  What a stupendous job Aircrew Task Force!

The Generals need to cry uncle. They need to ask Congress for a bigger bonus, or if stuck with only a $35K bonus they need to offer it with a one year commitment and renewable annually. 

If that’s the case then requirements grew by 150, because we were just briefed that we’re an extra hundred short this year (~2100). Statistics. Hah! Depends on what you want to say I guess.

[FLEA]

2 hours ago, K_O said:

If that’s the case then requirements grew by 150, because we were just briefed that we’re an extra hundred short this year (~2100). Statistics. Hah! Depends on what you want to say I guess.

I would like to see more creativity. I think you could keep several people around for at least a tour or two if you combined a shorter bonus with a garunteed offer for TERA but I'm not sure the service secretaries can offer TERA. (I think they can because they can force shape). 

 

Edited November 26, 2019 by FLEA

[Bigred]

4 hours ago, Hunter Rose said:

Annual retention report is out.

Active Duty grew the pilot force by 54. At this rate, we’ll be where our manning numbers need to be in a mere 13-15 years!  What a stupendous job Aircrew Task Force!

The Generals need to cry uncle. They need to ask Congress for a bigger bonus, or if stuck with only a $35K bonus they need to offer it with a one year commitment and renewable annually. 

If Altus is indicative of the rest of the Air Force, that 54 is all of us former gold wingers who switched over. I can count at least 5 dudes I know of in the C-17 and KC-135 pipeline.

 

It helps but no where enough to really even make a dent in that ~2100

Edited November 26, 2019 by Bigred

[Majestik Møøse]

2 hours ago, Bigred said:

If Altus is indicative of the rest of the Air Force, that 54 is all of us former gold wingers who switched over. I can count at least 5 dudes I know of in the C-17 and KC-135 pipeline.

What’s the draw for you guys to do ISTs to the AF?

[Bigred]

14 hours ago, Majestik Møøse said:

What’s the draw for you guys to do ISTs to the AF?

Career timing and post military opportunities. In the Navy, if you don’t screen for squadron command the odds of flying post department head (ADO) are almost zero. 
 

For me personally, I’m a senior O-4 that flew helos in the Navy and I was looking at a non-flying desk job for at least three years. With no guarantees of flying afterwards (even though I volunteered for UPT instructor, etc), and the Air Force offering me the chance to fly heavies for at least the next four years, it was a no brainer. Even if I don’t fly till I retire I’ll have a lot better shot at the majors afterwards instead of slogging through the regionals for 5-6 years waiting on flow through. 
 

The same applies to a lot of the guys I know that have swapped over. No real aspiration for command but happy to fly our asses off for the rest of our careers. That, and the 75 day tanker deployments are quite ok when compared to 6-9 month boat deployments.

[billy pilgrim]

I didn't previously know this, but AGR 11Fs get the $35k/year bonus as well.  Some guys are paying it back to get their seniority started at a major.

[Guardian]

Good thing about guard paying back bonus, you can pay it back very slowly with no interest. At least that’s what I’ve heard.

[kona4breakfast]

2 hours ago, Guardian said:

Good thing about guard paying back bonus, you can pay it back very slowly with no interest. At least that’s what I’ve heard.

My unit didn't stop my orders in '13 when I went to school. Overpaid me 6 weeks ADOS and didn't catch it until the end of the FY. It took me until last year to pay it back 😎

[Guardian]

My unit didn't stop my orders in '13 when I went to school. Overpaid me 6 weeks ADOS and didn't catch it until the end of the FY. It took me until last year to pay it back 

That’s awesome. Half tempted to sign another bonus and hit retirement then pay it back slowly. Would help with first year pay anyways.

[SocialD]

3 hours ago, billy pilgrim said:

I didn't previously know this, but AGR 11Fs get the $35k/year bonus as well.  Some guys are paying it back to get their seniority started at a major.

To get the $35k bonus in the ANG, you need to sign a 2 year commitment.  You're also at the whim of state leadership to sign an orders curtailment, but I have yet to see a curtailment denied.  My understanding is in AFRC you can get the $35k bonus down to a 1 year commitment.  

[FLEA]

4 hours ago, billy pilgrim said:

I didn't previously know this, but AGR 11Fs get the $35k/year bonus as well.  Some guys are paying it back to get their seniority started at a major.

Anyone know where these programs are posted? I heard 18X had the same bonus on the guard side as well. I'm going to need to make some informed decisions soon....

[Guardian]

Should all be posted on MyPers. For all Guard, active, and reserves.

[GoodSplash9]

On 11/29/2019 at 10:42 AM, billy pilgrim said:

I didn't previously know this, but AGR 11Fs get the $35k/year bonus as well.  Some guys are paying it back to get their seniority started at a major.

I haven't referenced official sources, but hallway/bar talk has sounded like all AGR bonuses match AD if you haven't previously taken an active duty bonus. If you have taken an active duty bonus, it's a huge cut down to like $12 or $18K. Does that check with anyone in the know...mypers is the place to verify? So definitely some gamesmanship for AD guys to consider at the end of their initial ADSC.

Another question...is it at all possible to receive the ACP bonus tax free while deployed? I'm planning to take 3 years of blood money next year in March-April, but I'll definitely delay until later in the year when I deploy for an extra $6-8K if I can.

[ThreeHoler]

ACP is considered monthly pay in the month you get it. So at most you will get $700-1100 back depending on your pay grade. It isn’t like enlisted bonuses.


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[FLEA]

6 hours ago, ThreeHoler said:

ACP is considered monthly pay in the month you get it. So at most you will get $700-1100 back depending on your pay grade. It isn’t like enlisted bonuses.


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Yes but I had heard if you sign it overseas, every iteration it pays will be tax excluded until it runs out. Any truth to that? 

[Hunter Rose]

1 hour ago, FLEA said:

Yes but I had heard if you sign it overseas, every iteration it pays will be tax excluded until it runs out. Any truth to that? 

No. 

You have to be in a tax free location the month your bonus processes on your LES and bonus pay hits your bank account. You’d again have to be in a tax free locale when your bonus hit in year 2 to get a portion of it tax free.

As mentioned it is considered monthly pay by the finance folk, so you only get tax free (regular pay + ACP) up to the pay rate of the Chief Master Sergeant of the Air Force. 
 

No huge benefit to delaying signing. Especially if it adds to your time in. 

Edited December 1, 2019 by Hunter Rose