Aviation Continuation Pay (ACP - The Bonus)

[StoleIt]

8 hours ago, TnkrToad said:

So....I take it they’re not letting heavy MWS folks go to OSA on their second or third flying assignments now?

The number of hours required for prior MWS folks to upgrade to AC in OSA is minimal (at least it was in the C-21, way back when I flew it); how is it possible to have no ACs? Only way I can figure is if nobody’s getting released to OSA assignments.

If the option of going to OSA for a few years to at least briefly get away from the airlift/tanker grind disappears, retention will get even tougher in the heavy MWS communities.

TT

 

Noper, there is push to make OSA a bit younger now. Pretty sure they are tired of 3rd assignment punching when their PCS/ADSC ends right around the 2 year time on station mark. Downside, this discriminates against the shorter 1st assignment guys where it's basically impossible to make IP on your first gig. KC10s and C5s have a leg up over C-17/C-130/KC-135 IMO. Less bases = less PCS = upgrade sooner.

89th has an hour requirement...Hickam/Ramstein/Scott doesn't have the dog & pony show associated with the OSA application.

No AC's because of the 2 year track to upgrade. I finished upgrade recently, should Palace Chase in March, dude "behind" me has same arrival date to the unit but will be Palace Front in Dec and isn't gonna upgrade. We are all former IP's or EP's but upgrade is slow. Not sure how the other C-40/C-37 units do it but there is a major slow down with the TFA.

From what I know of the C-21 guys, it's a way different upgrade timeline. Definitely apples to oranges.

Edited October 2, 2019 by StoleIt

[jrobe]

Day #2 of the new FY....waiting on AFPC to show me they care.

 

whats the bonus plan this year?

[SFG]

29 minutes ago, jrobe said:

Day #2 of the new FY....waiting on AFPC to show me they care.

whats the bonus plan this year?

I’d expect nothing soon.

Do expect to hear the 40% fixed-wing take rate downplayed and more about how the AF has made significant progress on the pilot shortage which “has leveled off” and that the problem is still one that can be fixed by 2-line PRFs, new developmental categories, a new OPR system, “better leadership” and less AFIs... and also that pilots just want to fly more (read: more TDYs, more deployments, more flag pole on top of your ‘real’ job)... before you see anything about the same bonus as last year and the year before being offered again, which it will be.

Meanwhile, great pilots and officers are being passed over for promotion. At least give them a consolation prize. At a minimum an extra 12 grand a year to stay in on top of the 26k after-tax bonus being offered to the highest tiers now. We’ve got to stop the bleeding AND rebuild.

 

It’s time to get serious. Now is not the time to do another study, brainstorm, send out surveys, talk about what people deserve or the way things used to be. Just fix it. It’s a new world. This ship is breaking apart around us while we’re enroute to several other global conflicts. More than that, if and when someone makes us bleed the other sharks will smell it and start coming out of the woodwork. Double the bonus and make it tax-free, then let’s get back to business.

[jrobe]

Dear AFPC start here

https://www.google.com/amp/s/m.wikihow.com/Act-Like-You-Care%3famp=1

...just act like you are trying...even if you really don’t 

also.....fire all the GS 9-14s who say “ we’ve seen pilot shortages before...it’ll correct itself”.....same folks who allow this to happen in the first place

 

[SFG]

No changes.

https://www.armed-services.senate.gov/imo/media/doc/Barrett_APQs_09-12-19.pdf

[Homestar]

On 10/1/2019 at 11:34 PM, StoleIt said:

89th has an hour requirement...

89th dropped the hour requirement for the last hiring board. 

[Gazmo]

Here is how we stop the bleeding:

Another major conflict with country of your choice, economic recession, oil prices $100-150 a barrel again. Airlines trim flight schedules, park airplanes, stop hiring/furlough. Throw in a little Stop Loss for the cherry on top Done... just enough to cause another decade (or more) of disfunction and paranioa to keep pilots around.

Not age 67. Not the fear of "one pilot cockpits". The above and knowing who we are and what we do, this scenerio is not very far-fetched.

Discuss....

[hindsight2020]

51 minutes ago, Gazmo said:

Here is how we stop the bleeding:

Another major conflict with country of your choice, economic recession, oil prices $100-150 a barrel again. Airlines trim flight schedules, park airplanes, stop hiring/furlough. Throw in a little Stop Loss for the cherry on top Done... just enough to cause another decade (or more) of disfunction and paranioa to keep pilots around.

Not age 67. Not the fear of "one pilot cockpits". The above and knowing who we are and what we do, this scenerio is not very far-fetched.

Discuss....

you're not saying anything new, nor far fetched. Those of us who weren't born into the decade of "everyone gets a regional job!" have been saying it since the lost decade. Air Force plays run the clock offense, always has, always will. And will continue to do so, until the next trigger for airline hiring slow down. It's an incredibly cynical play, but historically has always been THE play.

The only difference between the upcoming recession and the 9/11 confluence is the number or mando retirements plus the capacity right sizing the airlines did under post BK contract. That will yield few if no furloughs, as they throttle the demanded capacity with organic retirements and displacements as required. That doesn't help the newly-hired of course, which brings me to the next point.

Sub-10 year airline Reservists flock back to their units, as they always do. Being the plug in your BSE during a period of no new-hires is no picnic, even if you're gaining longevity pay.

At any rate, most of the sub-10 year guys come hide at the squadrons when the airline reminds them of the other side of "livin' da dreeeeam". This fills up the full time positions immediately, troughing pot gets thin, and the angle for active duty separatees to use the ARC as a leverage position temporarily disappears. Rinse and repeat, just like daily wind trends. I've seen this movie before. Caveat Emptor.

My only dog in this fight? Whatever one decides to do, just don't sh!t where you eat. Most do an honest job on that front, but we got a small cohort of boomeranging blue falcons that ruin it for everyone on both sides of the airline/mil continuum. 

As to AD? I don't think it will ever get any better. I treat is as a known quantity, and something ultimately to be tolerated in small and/or non-consecutive quantities. To each their own.

 

[Gazmo]

Hehehe...

[pcola]

I’m looking to get 6 months of my 5 year ACP ADSC waived to retire. It’s my only ADSC. Anyone have any insight into this? I skimmed the PC thread but didn’t find anything relevant. I’m thinking it shouldn’t be a big deal to repay the unearned portion of the bonus to have the ADSC forgiven but I know the AF has a habit of making these things more difficult than they should be.


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[RASH]

I’m looking to get 6 months of my 5 year ACP ADSC waived to retire. It’s my only ADSC. Anyone have any insight into this? I skimmed the PC thread but didn’t find anything relevant. I’m thinking it shouldn’t be a big deal to repay the unearned portion of the bonus to have the ADSC forgiven but I know the AF has a habit of making these things more difficult than they should be.


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10 years ago no waiver was required. Apply for retirement, enter your requested date. If approved, expect your last check or two to be zero to recoup the bonus.


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[pcola]

Hmm, that would be great but I suspect it’s no longer the case. Reviewing the AFPC retirement webinar slides led me to believe that any ADSC will prevent retirement eligibility and a waiver is required. I submitted the retirement eligibility review last week. Haven’t gotten the response yet. Will let you know if it says anything different but I’m expecting to see that a waiver is required. Will go from there. Just thought I’d ping the board here for any experience that may help me overcome the buffoonery I’ve come to expect from any AFPC action.

 

 

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[SFG]

1 hour ago, pcola said:

Hmm, that would be great but I suspect it’s no longer the case. Reviewing the AFPC retirement webinar slides led me to believe that any [ADSC] will prevent retirement eligibility and a waiver is required. I submitted the retirement eligibility review last week.

Let us know what happens!

[ThreeHoler]

I’m looking to get 6 months of my 5 year ACP ADSC waived to retire. It’s my only ADSC. Anyone have any insight into this? I skimmed the PC thread but didn’t find anything relevant. I’m thinking it shouldn’t be a big deal to repay the unearned portion of the bonus to have the ADSC forgiven but I know the AF has a habit of making these things more difficult than they should be.


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I had a friend who was twice passed over to O-5 with no continuation offered. He had a bonus (5 years) that took him to 21 years. He was forced to retire and they would not let him stay past 20. This was a few years ago but you should be able to get the 6 month waiver.


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[pcola]

I found the information I needed. It’s a SECAF waiver required. Must be in line with needs of the AF. I’m going to apply and see what happens


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[Majestik Møøse]

Regarding Tricare for life, I’ve heard from more than a few pilot and non-pilot retirees that it was a huge reason for staying in, or in one case, returning to active duty to get healthcare covered for a child with an extremely rare disease.

What are you airline guys paying for health insurance? Based on what I can figure, it’s around $1k/month with a max out of pocket of $6-12k depending on the plan.

[Chida]

Moose: Tricare For Life is a medicare supplement which kicks in when you get Medicare at age 65.

Tricare Prime or Select prior to age 65: it is a benefit but it’s not huge. The premium for health insurance from my employer is $100 per mo.


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[nunya]

1 hour ago, Majestik Møøse said:

What are you airline guys paying for health insurance? Based on what I can figure, it’s around $1k/month with a max out of pocket of $6-12k depending on the plan.

Not 1k/mo for me.  $140 a month premiums.  It’s the deductible and MOOP that get you.  Up to $13k worst case compared to a few hundred with Tricare, IIRC.  A couple bad years would be a serious drain on the savings plan.

[LJ Driver]

From my perspective I think Tricare in retirement is a huge benefit.  I haven’t started at my next job yet but looking at their health options they are all about $3-4K min a year for a very healthy family’s plan. Add in some health issues or surgery it could rapidly go up to $10K+.  Tricare Select has max out of pocket total of $3000 per year, per family, with no premiums, and $300 per year deductible limit for a family. One of the few things that got my attention during TAP was the offer to Airmen separating to buy some kind of Tricare for up to a year after separating:  at about $1200 per month... Go to Tricare.mil for the source data, I’m convinced it will save retired people thousands over a lifetime. 

Edited October 18, 2019 by LJ Driver

[matmacwc]

Private insurance nearly broke me, it was equivalent to BC/BS, when I got seriously ill as an ART.  Get the TRICARE for life, worry less.  Oh yeah, you should also have $1M on your cranium in life insurance, unless you can self insure that.  And only use term.

Edited October 18, 2019 by matmacwc

[JimNtexas]

I started Medicare + TFL two years ago.  Before that I had private sector employer’s insurance + Tricare standard.

The difference is amazing.  I feel like I may have won the golden ticket of health insurance.   I have none of the problems with Tricare and private insurance finger pointing, never a copay, and no pharmacy problems.

I did find that Tricare had a better drug formulary than my company insurance.

[Harvey]

SWA has an insurance option with $0 monthly premiums and a $2,500 yearly out of pocket max. The only catch is preventive care (physicals, immunizations) are not covered.
After finding out that cash prices for preventative care can be really cheap, I dropped TRS, which has been working out great so far.

Lots of good reasons to get an AD retirement, Tricare shouldn’t be one of them. 

[N730]

Damn, I'm waiting for my OTS and UPT dates and can't wait to get on Tricare.

Most airlines have MUCH better coverage than 95% of civilan employers, so I understand the argument, but for most other civilian jobs the coverage isn't even close.

My civilian job's is at a very large and "good" company. The insurance is $250/mo and has a $1500 deductible before anything is covered. So I would basically have to spend a $4500 out of pocket before I get any benefit. The premium would raise to almost $600 and the deductible would double if I added my wife. I routinely hear about how we have such good coverage at this company and it will say that it is way better than what was available at my previous job. But it's still garbage.

[di1630]

Any info on take rates? FY19 should be in the books.


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[SFG]

6 hours ago, di1630 said:

Any info on take rates? FY19 should be in the books.


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Yes, many moons ago.  40% for fixed wing pilots.  Which the AF is apparently cool with. 40 is the new 65.