16 minutes ago, pawnman said:

So in the end, the Israeli data shows exactly what the Kentucky data shows...if you already had covid, you are still better off getting vaccinated that relying on natural immunity. 

Because the KY study only focused on people who had already recovered from covid once, in both vaccinated and unvaccinated populations.

Cool, you latched onto the .53x increase, while not addressing:

- the massive amounts higher probability of being reinfected with COVID/being symptomatic if you’re vaccinated vs. natural immunity

- Vaccination status has little effect on viral loads

And since you breezed my post in about 30” based on your reply time, you left out an important chunk of the study conclusion, which to highlight is ”natural immunity confers longer lasting and stronger protection against infection, symptomatic disease and hospitalization for the Delta variant of Coronavirus compared to Pfizer vaccine,” as well as failed to address how the vaccinated were the bigger problem in MA than the unvaccinated. 
 

This is not a pandemic of the unvaccinated (blanket statement) as the media is cramming down your throat, but you can argue those at high risk who aren’t vaccinated are causing issues. So, it’s a “pandemic of those people,” not one of low-risk, unvaccinated people. And if you already had COVID, you’re better off by a large margin than those who have been vaccinated and have not had COVID yet.
 

 

Edited September 4, 20214 yr by brabus

2 minutes ago, brabus said:

Cool, you latched onto the .53x increase, while not addressing:

- the massive amounts higher probability of being reinfected with COVID/being symptomatic if you’re vaccinated vs. natural immunity

- Vaccination status has little effect on viral loads

And since you breezed my post in about 30” based on your reply time, you left out an important chunk of the study conclusion, which to highlight is ”natural immunity confers longer lasting and stronger protection against infection, symptomatic disease and hospitalization for the Delta variant of Coronavirus compared to Pfizer vaccine,” as well as failed to address how the vaccinated were the bigger problem in MA than the unvaccinated. 
 

 

 

One thing that pointed toward a higher chance of infection/reinfection for the vaccinated, at least in this country, was the fact that the vaccinated, as a whole, have become complacent and have gone back to "normal life"; ie: going on vacations, hitting up bars, and participating in large crowd events while the unvaccinated still maintained some semblance of "social distancing" and mask wear.

In the end, the argument can still remain that the vaccine doesn't work as advertised.

13 hours ago, BashiChuni said:

COVID is over fuck can we move on with our lives 

Yeah, this.

@pawnman, you're probably the most prolific poster in this thread.

Why don't you step back and tell us a little about yourself, and why this is such an important topic to you.

3 hours ago, Blue said:

Yeah, this.

@pawnman, you're probably the most prolific poster in this thread.

Why don't you step back and tell us a little about yourself, and why this is such an important topic to you.

That's fine. I got what I wanted. Y'all are either getting vaccinated or getting out.

What is it that you wanted?

Just now, Guardian said:

What is it that you wanted?

I want an end to the pandemic. Which means people taking the most basic of steps... like wearing a mask and getting vaccinated. 

But since "muh freedoms" seem to be more important than common decency and basic scientific literacy, I'll take the SECDEF ramming it down the throats of people who refuse to listen to reason. 

How dare people in the military support freedom!

12 minutes ago, HeloDude said:

How dare people in the military support freedom!

Almost as strange as expecting them to care about their fellow Americans or follow orders. 

Wild stuff. 

29 minutes ago, pawnman said:

I want an end to the pandemic. Which means people taking the most basic of steps... like wearing a mask and getting vaccinated. 

But since "muh freedoms" seem to be more important than common decency and basic scientific literacy, I'll take the SECDEF ramming it down the throats of people who refuse to listen to reason. 

Wearing a mask doesn’t work. Nothing works to stop the virus it’s gonna spread bro everyone is gonna get it. Get over yourself and get off your high horse it’s obnoxious. 
 

glad to see you hold your freedoms in such high regard! Common decency is to let Americans move on with their FUCKING LIVES without you, the CDC, and fauci dictating to us. Scared of the virus? Stay home. Stay safe. Mask up. It’s only two weeks. 

“Follow the science”

Take it up with SECDEF.

They've already kicked one person for refusing the vaccine and mask.  I'm pretty sure there's about to be a bunch more.

I'll be cheering each and every one.

Why would you cheer each and everyone? You know that masks and vaccines wont stop the pandemic right?

4 minutes ago, pawnman said:

I'll be cheering each and every one.

Take a look in the mirror.  Your self-righteous rage is creepy.

Care about your fellow Americans and follows orders!  Come on now…they did this without a problem in the 1940’s!

https://www.archives.gov/education/lessons/japanese-relocation#background

1 hour ago, pawnman said:

Take it up with SECDEF.

They've already kicked one person for refusing the vaccine and mask.  I'm pretty sure there's about to be a bunch more.

I'll be cheering each and every one.

 

We're required to wear masks? 

2 hours ago, BashiChuni said:

Wearing a mask doesn’t work. Nothing works to stop the virus it’s gonna spread bro everyone is gonna get it. Get over yourself and get off your high horse it’s obnoxious. 
 

glad to see you hold your freedoms in such high regard! Common decency is to let Americans move on with their ING LIVES without you, the CDC, and fauci dictating to us. Scared of the virus? Stay home. Stay safe. Mask up. It’s only two weeks. 

Legit question, I’m not trying to flame, I just don’t go online much, but when you say “Nothing works to stop the virus,” do you include vaccines in that statement? Because my understanding is that if 100% of the population were vaccinated, we’d have a lot fewer people being hospitalized right now—so few that it wouldn’t be any different than a regular season’s flu, thereby reducing the pandemic to just another regular illness. Am I wrong in thinking that way? 

Yes

35 minutes ago, Guardian said:

Yes

You're talking crazy.  If everyone where vaccinated, the case load would absolutely be reduced by a large amount.

It would not be reduced to zero.  But it would be a lot less.

 

Based on the single data point of 1918, I figure we've got another year of this.  So hold on to your butts everyone.

 

Just now, BashiChuni said:

Vaccines prevent severe illnesses and hospitalization. They don’t stop transmission 

3 minutes ago, BashiChuni said:

Vaccines prevent severe illnesses and hospitalization. They don’t stop transmission 

Vaccines reduce the likelihood of catching a disease, and if you do, improve your chances.  If individuals are less likely to catch a disease, then they're less likely to spread it when viewed as a member of an aggregate pool.  Vaccines as a public health tool aren't really about you, they're about the whole community.

The part you highlighted talks about case and vaccination rates.  If a state has a current high case rate, it makes sense they would also have a high current vaccination rate.  People see others getting sick, then go get the shot.  I don't know which article you're referencing, but CNN has multiples talking about this.

I didn’t think vaccines stopped you from catching it or being infected. Just the severity of symptoms or dealing with the infection.

Yeah states with the most vaccinations should have the most cases, since all the vaccinated folks are going to concerts without masks etc. The datapoint I want is hospitalizations versus vaccination rates. 

https://www.nytimes.com/interactive/2021/us/covid-cases.html

Pretty good visualizations and whatnot on there.

I’m a cheap bastard and can’t get past that paywall.