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C2 Question - SOFs and Command Post

Skitzo

By Skitzo
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Skitzo Gray Beard

Skitzo

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Open question to any and all units that have an active SOF program and those that work as a SOF or have worked as a SOF. What if/any relationship exists between the SOF and the Command Post with regard to command and control of assets? Please don't reply to this topic but PM me so I can provide a .mil email address. I'm using this as a tool to reach out, not violate OPSEC. Thanks!

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BADFNZ Gray Beard

BADFNZ

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What is your area of greatest troop concentration, and may I go there and count them?

So Skitzo's plan was to join BO then wait 10 years to drop this SOF/C2 question to pass to mother Russia? Seems legit.

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HuggyU2 Gray Beard

HuggyU2

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SOF program: should be a priority for elimination in the current fiscal environment. A complete waste of manpower.

I'm sure many of you disagree,... and maybe your experience would prove contrary to mine.

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schokie Flight Lead

schokie

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But what would you do in an emergency if the SOF wasn't there to ask you if you ran the checklist and what your plan is? Maybe we should get FE's to sit SOF.

I have sat SOF countless times and there have only been a handful of instances where I genuinely feel that my being there and interjecting into the situation saved the day. Not that I'm a shitty SOF, just that most aircrew are actually competent and able to handle an EP on their own. The rest of the time I'm just a glorified note taker for the OG.

Oh, and the alternate's changed. You didn't get the word? Sorry about that.

Edited by schokie
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Ram Gray Beard

Ram

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SOF program: should be a priority for elimination in the current fiscal environment. A complete waste of manpower.

I'm sure many of you disagree,... and maybe your experience would prove contrary to mine.

At Misawa, the SOF is the only American in a Tower full of Japanese ATC. All of the ATC radar controllers are Japanese. Without a SOF, we'd have a yearly class A just based on miscommunication alone.

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brabus Gray Beard

brabus

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Without a SOF, we'd have a yearly class A just based on miscommunication alone.

Except the Class A wouldn't be on our side, it'd be "loss of life" on the JASDF side with at least 2-3 brain aneurisms resulting in death. Causal factor: "MP requested direct inside downwind."

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Ram Gray Beard

Ram

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Except the Class A wouldn't be on our side, it'd be "loss of life" on the JASDF side with at least 2-3 brain aneurisms resulting in death. Causal factor: "MP requested direct inside downwind."

Thanks for making me spit beer on my MacBook, Klepto.

You gotta really love the Japanese ATC and their penchant for flexibility...

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ATIS Flight Lead

ATIS

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Except the Class A wouldn't be on our side, it'd be "loss of life" on the JASDF side with at least 2-3 brain aneurisms resulting in death. Causal factor: "MP requested direct inside downwind."

This got me laughing. 1996: Two A-6 Intruders, one S-3 Viking, two F-14A's, and a Hawkeye in the VFR night pattern around NAF Atsugi...the JASDF controllers just stopped talking to us. DCAG came up (BN in one of the Intruders) on AirWing Common telling everyone call their own intervals. After ~35 minutes, the controllers started to talk again and I think he cleared us to land...or order a hamburger (it was hard to tell).

Thanks for the memory

Collin

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Rmarsh Crew Dawg

Rmarsh

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While we're at it, someone explain why AWACS need SOFs.

It's worse than that. ABM's are now getting SOF qualified, thus plunging both SOFs and AWACS even deeper into the murky depths of irrelevancy.

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afnav Flight Lead

afnav

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It's worse than that. ABM's are now getting SOF qualified, thus plunging both SOFs and AWACS even deeper into the murky depths of irrelevancy.

This is scary shit.

How much airmanship do they think they can accumulate staring at a cathode ray tube in the back of an airplane with no responsibility in the safe flight of the aircraft? Hell, unless the course has changed, I don't think they even teach them weather or instrument procedures.

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Rmarsh Crew Dawg

Rmarsh

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Think I would rather have a FE than an ABM...I've known exactly zero ABMs that could/should do more than comm relay while "acting" as SOF.
This is scary shit. How much airmanship do they think they can accumulate staring at a cathode ray tube in the back of an airplane with no responsibility in the safe flight of the aircraft? Hell, unless the course has changed, I don't think they even teach them weather or instrument procedures.

Well you both hit on the original point. SOF was always a "nice to have", not a "need to have" in AWACS, now its been dumbed down to such an extent that essentially it is only a comm relay to let the ADO's know their SQ's takeoff and land times. WX divert? complex systems EP? They are calling in the Stan/Eval chief pilot or FE.

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afnav Flight Lead

afnav

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Well you both hit on the original point. SOF was always a "nice to have", not a "need to have" in AWACS, now its been dumbed down to such an extent that essentially it is only a comm relay to let the ADO's know their SQ's takeoff and land times. WX divert? complex systems EP? They are calling in the Stan/Eval chief pilot or FE.

When I was in the truck, as fast as I could get in touch with the duty IP, the situation would be over. If the plane had enough gas to hold, I was usually able to get him out of the 966th in time.

As a former SOF in two aircraft, I enjoyed my job, and I learned a lot from the various situations. I completely agree if they are still limiting it to instructors, who usually have the background and experience to do the job.

I was at Tinker when we got the first ABM group commander. He never said it, but he went with whatever I decided to do with minimal comment.

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Rmarsh Crew Dawg

Rmarsh

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When I was in the truck, as fast as I could get in touch with the duty IP, the situation would be over. If the plane had enough gas to hold, I was usually able to get him out of the 966th in time.

As a former SOF in two aircraft, I enjoyed my job, and I learned a lot from the various situations. I completely agree if they are still limiting it to instructors, who usually have the background and experience to do the job.

I was at Tinker when we got the first ABM group commander. He never said it, but he went with whatever I decided to do with minimal comment.

I'm really not trying to derail this thread into a Tinker discussion, but things are obviously very different now than when you left, both as far as SOF is concerned, and the wing in general. Let's just leave it at that.

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Skitzo Gray Beard

Skitzo

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Good to hear all the replies and thanks for those that took the bait... Jk seriously In my 10 years on this forum I got quite the chuckle. Again thanks for the private messages.

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