Aviation Continuation Pay (ACP - The Bonus)

[C-21.Pilot]

Incorrect. There is a block that lists whether you took the ACP or not. I think you can see it if you go in to the vMPF or ADP versions of your SURF.

Huh? I didn't take it, and it is nowhere on vMPF, my SURF, records.....where is this block?

The ONLY thing on my records is my ADSC (GI Bill transfer). If you go thru your records, and this is processed, then your ADSC will reflect it.

[Homestar]

Would not show up in your record explicitly, but anyone you tell would know, and potentially someone like an exec would know, and it could end up travelling with you if you remain in your community. It also could end up being known through those sorts of unofficial channels by a person in a position (sts) to rate on you or otherwise recommend you for something like a promotion. Lots of hypotheticals, but nothing that you could probably legally point back to if you think that you were treated unfairly.

I think you overestimate how much anyone cares.

[Rusty Pipes]

The board members don't see ADSCs.

And when the AADs were masked they didn't see them either... but the Sq CC's knew and were ranking the guys with AAD's above anyone who didn't have one so it didn't matter if the board saw it or not, results were pre-determined.

[ThreeHoler]

Huh? I didn't take it, and it is nowhere on vMPF, my SURF, records.....where is this block?

The ONLY thing on my records is my ADSC (GI Bill transfer). If you go thru your records, and this is processed, then your ADSC will reflect it.

It is listed under "Rated Info" on your ADP career brief and your AMS expanded SURF ("Rated Information"). See attached.

[Champ Kind]

It is listed under "Rated Info" on your ADP career brief and your AMS expanded SURF ("Rated Information"). See attached.

Boom.

[General Chang]

And when the AADs were masked they didn't see them either... but the Sq CC's knew and were ranking the guys with AAD's above anyone who didn't have one so it didn't matter if the board saw it or not, results were pre-determined.

Man, you are cynical! I'm sorry, but stop messing with people's minds. It's just not right.

No CC worth his salt would hold this against someone. I'm not saying they're not out there, but for the sake of the young guys reading these blogs, either you are the most unfortunate son-of-a-gun to see all of these horrible things during your AF career (reference, um, nearly everything you post), or most CCs out there aren't nearly as evil as you think they are. For heaven's sake, Rusty...

[HeloDude]

Man, you are cynical! I'm sorry, but stop messing with people's minds. It's just not right.

No CC worth his salt would hold this against someone. I'm not saying they're not out there, but for the sake of the young guys reading these blogs, either you are the most unfortunate son-of-a-gun to see all of these horrible things during your AF career (reference, um, nearly everything you post), or most CCs out there aren't nearly as evil as you think they are. For heaven's sake, Rusty...

Apparently you aren't familiar with what happened in the 90's with regards to this issue...

[Liquid]

And when the AADs were masked they didn't see them either... but the Sq CC's knew and were ranking the guys with AAD's above anyone who didn't have one so it didn't matter if the board saw it or not, results were pre-determined.

I saw this happen. For all of those who were told it wasn't important and that AAD would be masked at the board (as well as the "don't do correspondence when you are a select" Practice Bleeding Memo) the message was "don't believe the shitbags when they tell you something doesn't matter." I really hope CSAF pulls this one off correctly by masking AAD at the board, and prohibiting it as a discriminator for anything that doesn't specifically require it. But you might as well get an AAD, it is cheap and easy, like Vetter.

[Rusty Pipes]

Man, you are cynical! I'm sorry, but stop messing with people's minds. It's just not right.

No CC worth his salt would hold this against someone. I'm not saying they're not out there, but for the sake of the young guys reading these blogs, either you are the most unfortunate son-of-a-gun to see all of these horrible things during your AF career (reference, um, nearly everything you post), or most CCs out there aren't nearly as evil as you think they are. For heaven's sake, Rusty...

Chang... we are most definitely not in the same Air Force. This has noting to do with good vs bad Commanders, it has to do with a mindset at the O-6 level and above that isn't going to change anytime soon. I am extremely cynical when it comes to sweeping changes even made from the CSAF that involve a complete mindset change of every Commander below him. Years ago as a young OG Exec I sat in a rack and stack meeting as a fly on the wall for an upcoming O-4 board back when the AAD was masked. The very specific guidance was that the AAD was to be masked and not considered or even seen by the Wing CC... when the rack and stack was complete and pushed up from the 4 flying Sq CCs and the OG/CC there was not a single individual without an AAD ranked above anyone who had one (and it was an openly discussed discriminator). My immediate "lesson learned/mentorship" passed to every co-pilot I flew with was no matter what anyone said about AADs or SOS in correspondence from that point out not being required (including the Sq CC) was just get it done because it was being used as a discriminator even if they said it wasn't.

I've had several terrible Commanders and I've had several fantastic Commanders. One of the best Commanders I ever had was my last OG/CC who told me countless times sitting in his office shooting the shit at the end of the day how much of an incredible waste of time and effort it was for us to be getting useless AADs and doing PME in correspondence and said it was certainly taking away from us being better pilots... but his rack and stack was the same as the OG/CC above because if it wasn't his folks couldn't compete with the rest of their AF peers. That is the stage that has been set over the past 10 yrs and it probably won't be changing anytime soon. You call it cynical, I call it reality. He thought it was bullshit, but guess what... he knew everyone who had their AAD complete, their PME complete (and when they completed them) and yes, whether they signed the bonus or not. I know this because I was the one who had to get all of that info for him and put it on a nice little excel sheet by year group.

I heard the horror stories of the 90s from all the old guys when I first came in, I saw the lines around the corner at the MPF for the first VSP, I saw the 157 get booted at 15 yrs with non-continuation (several were good friends of mine), I saw the complete disaster of the last VSP/RIF where we kicked out some fantastic pilots just to be "fair" to other AFSCs because we are all equal and like everyone else I am sitting back and watching the current fiasco of Force Shaping where the rules are actually changing several times a day to the point where even the folks at AFPC who are running the thing don't know what is going on... forgive me for not having great trust in the system right now just because some Troll (read Chang) is coming on here telling the passengers on the Titanic to just go back to their rooms and don't worry about the little chunks of ice on the deck! This has nothing to do with good Commanders and bad Commanders... I have plenty of good friends who are sitting Sq CCs right now and they are pulling their hair out over this mess. As Liquid said, I really hope the CSAF can pull this off correctly... but even if the Boss told every co-pilot in my Sq to their face that getting an AAD wasn't required; they'd all know they need to get it done anyway because we've all seen this movie before and the ending doesn't change. We have an actual leader as a Chief right now... hopefully some of the other GOs and O-6s start to follow his example. Most of the guys out there just want to be inspired... its been a while!

Edited January 29, 2014 by Rusty Pipes

[Karl Hungus]

I really hope CSAF pulls this one off correctly by masking AAD at the board, and prohibiting it as a discriminator for anything that doesn't specifically require it.

So WTF is taking him so long? It's not like this concern is new, people have been talking about this stupidity for the past decade.

[Homestar]

... it is cheap and easy, like Vetter.

Just as an aside, Vetter may be "cheap and easy" but on BODN all "cheap and easy" references should more properly be directed at BQZip's mom.

[Liquid]

Just as an aside, Vetter may be "cheap and easy" but on BODN all "cheap and easy" references should more properly be directed at BQZip's mom.

Rookie mistake...won't happen again.

[C-21.Pilot]

Rookie mistake...won't happen again.

2Lt? A1C? You just outed yourself….

[sqwatch]

Chang... we are most definitely not in the same Air Force. This has noting to do with good vs bad Commanders, it has to do with a mindset at the O-6 level and above that isn't going to change anytime soon. I am extremely cynical when it comes to sweeping changes even made from the CSAF that involve a complete mindset change of every Commander below him. Years ago as a young OG Exec I sat in a rack and stack meeting as a fly on the wall for an upcoming O-4 board back when the AAD was masked. The very specific guidance was that the AAD was to be masked and not considered or even seen by the Wing CC... when the rack and stack was complete and pushed up from the 4 flying Sq CCs and the OG/CC there was not a single individual without an AAD ranked above anyone who had one (and it was an openly discussed discriminator). My immediate "lesson learned/mentorship" passed to every co-pilot I flew with was no matter what anyone said about AADs or SOS in correspondence from that point out not being required (including the Sq CC) was just get it done because it was being used as a discriminator even if they said it wasn't.

I've had several terrible Commanders and I've had several fantastic Commanders. One of the best Commanders I ever had was my last OG/CC who told me countless times sitting in his office shooting the shit at the end of the day how much of an incredible waste of time and effort it was for us to be getting useless AADs and doing PME in correspondence and said it was certainly taking away from us being better pilots... but his rack and stack was the same as the OG/CC above because if it wasn't his folks couldn't compete with the rest of their AF peers. That is the stage that has been set over the past 10 yrs and it probably won't be changing anytime soon. You call it cynical, I call it reality. He thought it was bullshit, but guess what... he knew everyone who had their AAD complete, their PME complete (and when they completed them) and yes, whether they signed the bonus or not. I know this because I was the one who had to get all of that info for him and put it on a nice little excel sheet by year group.

I heard the horror stories of the 90s from all the old guys when I first came in, I saw the lines around the corner at the MPF for the first VSP, I saw the 157 get booted at 15 yrs with non-continuation (several were good friends of mine), I saw the complete disaster of the last VSP/RIF where we kicked out some fantastic pilots just to be "fair" to other AFSCs because we are all equal and like everyone else I am sitting back and watching the current fiasco of Force Shaping where the rules are actually changing several times a day to the point where even the folks at AFPC who are running the thing don't know what is going on... forgive me for not having great trust in the system right now just because some Troll (read Chang) is coming on here telling the passengers on the Titanic to just go back to their rooms and don't worry about the little chunks of ice on the deck! This has nothing to do with good Commanders and bad Commanders... I have plenty of good friends who are sitting Sq CCs right now and they are pulling their hair out over this mess. As Liquid said, I really hope the CSAF can pull this off correctly... but even if the Boss told every co-pilot in my Sq to their face that getting an AAD wasn't required; they'd all know they need to get it done anyway because we've all seen this movie before and the ending doesn't change. We have an actual leader as a Chief right now... hopefully some of the other GOs and O-6s start to follow his example. Most of the guys out there just want to be inspired... its been a while!

Too many words. Did not read.

[Skitzo]

Think Liquid meant in regards to the message board...

Edit: Holy shit 1000th post. Kind of like when your car hits 100k miles... over 11 years?

Edited January 30, 2014 by Skitzo

[Flare]

Any rumors on this year's bonus yet? I became a free agent last night; every day it delays now costs me money! (hypothetically, of course....)

[Butters]

I would guess same as last year.

Edited February 20, 2014 by Butters

[HeloDude]

Any rumors on this year's bonus yet? I became a free agent last night; every day it delays now costs me money! (hypothetically, of course....)

It was passed in the budget and appropriated...so the money is there if the AF once again decides to use it. I'm in the same boat man but I have a feeling it's going to get delayed longer than usual because of the VSP/RIF BS. But you're right, for an 11F (assuming it would at least be the same as last year), the longer it takes, the more you lose since you would get it to 20. Damn bastard.

[di1630]

Anyone else get hit on taxes because the ACP put them over the limit for ROTH IRA contributions? I am not tax savvy so wondering if anyone has a good idea for avoiding the penalty.

[Striper_WSO]

Anyone else get hit on taxes because the ACP put them over the limit for ROTH IRA contributions? I am not tax savvy so wondering if anyone has a good idea for avoiding the penalty.

I think you are saying that you are over the $191K income limit (married filing jointly) for contributing to a Roth IRA. You should be able to recategorize your contributions into a traditional IRA. This may involve withdrawing the funds from your Roth to put into a traditional IRA. Call your brokerage and ask if this is available. You will lose the tax-deferred growth of these contributions obviously. There is no income limit for contributing to a traditional IRA. There are deduction limits on a traditional IRA though.

But, Congrats! You are into the neighborhood of (relatively) high earners…and the Roth wasn't intended for these folks.

Edited March 3, 2014 by Striper_WSO

[HossHarris]

And theb convert that traditional to a Roth and bobs your uncle

[jumangio]

Just heard "unofficially" that we can expect the bonus to not be available to AMC pilots this year (this tidbit was briefed at ACSC today, then backed up by a person I know at A1). Let the AF egress floodgates open!

[Rusty Pipes]

Just heard "unofficially" that we can expect the bonus to not be available to AMC pilots this year (this tidbit was briefed at ACSC today, then backed up by a person I know at A1). Let the AF egress floodgates open!

Ha... they don't need to offer a Bonus when there is Stop Loss!!! Seriously though, was the year group (11Ms) that would be eligible for ACP next year part of the VSP/RIF eligible group?

[jumangio]

Ha... they don't need to offer a Bonus when there is Stop Loss!!! Seriously though, was the year group (11Ms) that would be eligible for ACP next year part of the VSP/RIF eligible group?

The 11M group that could sign this year was/is eligible.

[Rusty Pipes]

The 11M group that could sign this year was/is eligible.

Well I guess that all the guys who are going to School and planned on staying in won't get paid to do so. Those who want to get out can try to VSP. That leaves those who are not School types, but want to stay for one reason or another and just won't get paid for it. I'm sure they will get a handful of guys who will get out because they can't get the bonus, but it solves the problem of paying people who had every intention of staying in the first place... will suck for the 11M sitting next to the 11F in Polifka with $18K less in his bank account though.