Chuck17 Posted June 12, 2014 Share Posted June 12, 2014 (edited) It's not a no-brainier, a DWI isn't a DUI, therefore he was cited and released. Should someone accused of a DWI receive the same punishment of a DUI, if found guilty? Sorry, where I come from DWI means Driving While Intoxicated, which is also now called DUI. DWI in OK means Driving While Impaired. I didn't recognize the difference. My bad. Chuck Edited June 12, 2014 by Chuck17 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GlassEmpty Posted June 12, 2014 Author Share Posted June 12, 2014 The actual law is below for those who care to read. But looking at the scenario this brings up good questions. As Azimuth says, since it isn't the same, how should the individual be dealt with within a squadron. If it was through the gate, and the DWI sticks, do you treat it the same? What if the DWI gets thrown out for said "Hamming"? LOR for poor decision making or even an Art. 15? Just curious on how anyone would play the punishment game or if they even would... https://www.ncdd.com/dui-laws-in-your-state/usa/oklahoma DWI (Driving While Intoxicated) – 47 O.S. § 761 (This is a lesser offense than DUI) Any person who operates a motor vehicle his ability to operate the motor vehicle is impaired by the consumption of alcohol or any other substance. The penalty is a fine of $100.00-$500.00 and/or 0-6 months in county jail. A first time conviction also carries a 30 day license revocation. Elements of Driving with Impaired Ability: It must be proven beyond a reasonable doubt that the defendant was Driving A motor vehicle Upon public roads, highways, streets, turnpikes, other public places or upon any private road, street, alley or lane which provides access to one or more single or multi-family dwellings With impaired ability Due to alcohol or an intoxicating substance. For persons twenty-one years of age or older evidence that there was, at the time of the test, an alcohol concentration in excess of five hundredths (0.05) but less than eight- hundredths (0.08) is relevant evidence that the person's ability to operate a motor vehicle was impaired by alcohol. 47 O.S. § 756. Thus, if alcohol test, must be .06 or .07 BAC. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Azimuth Posted June 12, 2014 Share Posted June 12, 2014 Commander dropped the charges against said individual due to the two components of the DWI law in Oklahoma. He wasn't pulled over for "driving while impaired." Lesson learned. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
FUSEPLUG Posted June 12, 2014 Share Posted June 12, 2014 (edited) So we wore blues for no reason at all then?! What a crock... ETA: In all seriousness, I'm glad to hear it was worked out. The stigma will be there for a while, but hopefully his/her career will be fine in the long-run. Edited June 12, 2014 by FUSEPLUG Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bender Posted June 13, 2014 Share Posted June 13, 2014 Commander dropped the charges against said individual due to the two components of the DWI law in Oklahoma. He wasn't pulled over for "driving while impaired." Lesson learned. Are the two components a) being pulled over, and b) driving while impaired? ...or is 1 component, being pulled over for driving while impaired? If so, what's the other one? Bendy Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Azimuth Posted June 13, 2014 Share Posted June 13, 2014 The cops have to pull you over for a primary offense (i.e. wreckless driving) and you have a .05 - .07 BAC for it be a DWI. Being stopped at the gate for random vehicle checks does not meet the criteria for the DWI law here. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Skitzo Posted June 13, 2014 Share Posted June 13, 2014 The cops have to pull you over for a primary offense (i.e. wreckless driving) and you have a .05 - .07 BAC for it be a DWI. Being stopped at the gate for random vehicle checks does not meet the criteria for the DWI law here. Wow sounds like said individual probably had a 24oz supersize me beer along with dinner and got more than he bargained for. This is why I have one drink outside my house... Even if I get absolutely wasted at a bar and I call a cab to drive me home and said cab driver hits a pedestrian or another vehicle along the way it will still be my fault... If I were responsible enough to call a cab and so irresponsible to have more than the legal amount it would still be an ARI. I'm still waiting to hear this exact scenario play out. Mark my words if it hasn't happened it will. Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GlassEmpty Posted June 13, 2014 Author Share Posted June 13, 2014 So... he blew a .07? ...but got out of the DWI because he was stopped at a checkpoint rather than being pulled over? Rog... Sounds like this guy is shitting horse shoes and dodged a bullet. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jaded Posted June 13, 2014 Share Posted June 13, 2014 The assumed guilty before innocent perception in the military is one of the reasons I will not be staying past my initial commitment. 5 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Learjetter Posted June 13, 2014 Share Posted June 13, 2014 I've had to "talk down" a couple of commanders who wanted to offer Art15 immediately to persons merely accused of DWI/DUI. Lots of people think arrest=guilt...seen it wreck a few careers too, unfortunately. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Clayton Bigsby Posted June 13, 2014 Share Posted June 13, 2014 So .07 BAC is illegal now? Am I reading that right? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
StoleIt Posted June 13, 2014 Share Posted June 13, 2014 I've had to "talk down" a couple of commanders who wanted to offer Art15 immediately to persons merely accused of DWI/DUI. Lots of people think arrest=guilt...seen it wreck a few careers too, unfortunately. I know someone who had that happen. Arrested for DWI (blew like 0.03 or something pretty low), thrown out for lack of evidence (blood draw at the police station was all zero's), but big blue took the case and ran with it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GlassEmpty Posted June 13, 2014 Author Share Posted June 13, 2014 So .07 BAC is illegal now? Am I reading that right? State of Oklahoma... If you're .05-.07 and pulled over in suspicion you can receive a DWI with DUI penalties. Basically lesser fines but still a slam. Its a state thing. But you can't get hit at a checkpoint unless you show reason to be pulled over like speeding or failing to yield, swerving etc. Hope that makes it about as clear as mud. Another reason to avoid OK. Posted from the NEW Baseops.net App! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Herk Driver Posted June 13, 2014 Share Posted June 13, 2014 I know someone who had that happen. Arrested for DWI (blew like 0.03 or something pretty low), thrown out for lack of evidence (blood draw at the police station was all zero's), but big blue took the case and ran with it. What was the end result? I ask because if that is the case and the CC "offered" an Art 15, one should not be afraid to turn down the 15 and go to CM. Obviously, each case is different and one has to weigh their odds and potential punishment, but the buckshot blood test is fairly substantial exculpatory evidence and would probably sway most juries. If this was other than NJP, well then that is a different story. Posted from the NEW Baseops.net App! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
17D_guy Posted June 14, 2014 Share Posted June 14, 2014 What was the end result? I ask because if that is the case and the CC "offered" an Art 15, one should not be afraid to turn down the 15 and go to CM. Obviously, each case is different and one has to weigh their odds and potential punishment, but the buckshot blood test is fairly substantial exculpatory evidence and would probably sway most juries. If this was other than NJP, well then that is a different story. Posted from the NEW Baseops.net App! The one guy I know is now a Mr. Same scenario as StoleIt's bud. Civilian case dropped, but it was reflected in his OPR... somehow. Too bad, he was a good dude. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
addict Posted June 14, 2014 Share Posted June 14, 2014 Lesson learned? I learned that an airman's immediate supervisor will post details on bo.net. IG yourself. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pawnman Posted June 14, 2014 Share Posted June 14, 2014 What was the end result? I ask because if that is the case and the CC "offered" an Art 15, one should not be afraid to turn down the 15 and go to CM. Obviously, each case is different and one has to weigh their odds and potential punishment, but the buckshot blood test is fairly substantial exculpatory evidence and would probably sway most juries. If this was other than NJP, well then that is a different story. Posted from the NEW Baseops.net App! From what I've seen, I'm not sure I'd trust the court martial system either. A dozen shoes all screaming about making an example out of you. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Herk Driver Posted June 14, 2014 Share Posted June 14, 2014 From what I have seen and I have watched a few of these, a jury is usually the way to go. Posted from the NEW Baseops.net App! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Azimuth Posted June 14, 2014 Share Posted June 14, 2014 From what I have seen and I have watched a few of these, a jury is usually the way to go. Posted from the NEW Baseops.net App! Without any Enlisted juror. Lesson learned? I learned that an airman's immediate supervisor will post details on bo.net. IG yourself. Well I wouldn't want you to armchair QB without the true facts. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Herk Driver Posted June 14, 2014 Share Posted June 14, 2014 Without any Enlisted juror. Well I wouldn't want you to armchair QB without the true facts. I would agree with no E jurors as a general rule. Posted from the NEW Baseops.net App! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
magnetfreezer Posted June 14, 2014 Share Posted June 14, 2014 From what I've seen, I'm not sure I'd trust the court martial system either. A dozen shoes all screaming about making an example out of you. With the amount of CGO/FGO volunteers usually required for court martial duty, doesn't statistics dictate a higher OG representation at most bases due to the much higher number of O's? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GlassEmpty Posted June 14, 2014 Author Share Posted June 14, 2014 Lesson learned? I learned that an airman's immediate supervisor will post details on bo.net. IG yourself. Shack. Posted from the NEW Baseops.net App! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
deaddebate Posted June 14, 2014 Share Posted June 14, 2014 Without any Enlisted juror.I would agree with no E jurors as a general rule.This is one of the greater points of rumor and opinion, especially among folks who've never had any involvement in a CM. I certainly understand an O wanting all O's. But what if an E is on trial. Is all O's still the best way to go? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
M2 Posted June 14, 2014 Share Posted June 14, 2014 This is one of the greater points of rumor and opinion, especially among folks who've never had any involvement in a CM. I certainly understand an O wanting all O's. But what if an E is on trial. Is all O's still the best way to go? Having been an E (NCO) at one point in my career, I can tell you that the belief is that an E will be tougher on another E than an O will. I believe it to be pretty much true. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Herk Driver Posted June 14, 2014 Share Posted June 14, 2014 This is one of the greater points of rumor and opinion, especially among folks who've never had any involvement in a CM. I certainly understand an O wanting all O's. But what if an E is on trial. Is all O's still the best way to go? Jury members must be higher ranking (at least by date of rank). This is an E issue as they can ask for all O's, IIRC. And M2 called it...the line of thinking is that NCOs will be tougher on their own than any officers will. Posted from the NEW Baseops.net App! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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