ClearedHot

You are correct, current CSAR/AFSOC "choppers" don't have a forward firing gun. HOWEVER, they do have side firing guns in addition to the tailgun that allow some ability to suppress targets in front of the aircraft. As I understand it, for a variety of reasons side guns will not work on the Osprey, One of the most obvious is the two gianormous rotors that you would have to shoot through.

After investing $20 billion over 25 years and losing 30 lives in the development of the controversial V-22 tilt-rotor aircraft, known as the Osprey, the U.S. military might like to think that its long-awaited combat debut would go relatively smoothly. But even as 10 Marine V-22s have just arrived in Iraq, the Air Force - which is buying V-22s for special operations missions - has decided the gun on the marine's version isn't good enough for an aircraft expressly designed to ferry troops into hot landing zones. The Marines now flying the $120 million aircraft have insisted that the small gun slung from the aircraft's opened rear ramp is adequate for war. That's a claim disputed by retired Marine general James Jones, who ordered a beefed-up, forward-firing gun for the V-22 when he was serving as the Corps' top officer from 1999 to 2003. The requirement evaporated after Jones stepped down as commandant, but the Air Force, which is buying 50 V-22s for the Special Ops command, seems to agree with Jones. "It is critical that the CV-22 possess a self-defense capability that will provide maximum protection from threats in the vicinity of the landing zone," the Special Op Command says in a recent message to contractors seeking an improved gun. Its list of requirements shows that the gun now on the V-22s in Iraq falls far short of what it wants, including "maximum coverage of all quadrants" - in other words, the ability to fire in the direction that the V-22 is going, not merely where it has been, as is the case with the current gun. The special-ops V-22 is slated to enter service in 2009. This dispute is just the latest chapter in a troubled program begun in 1981 to provide a troop transport for all four military services; the Army dropped out two years later for cost reasons, and then-Defense Secretary Dick Cheney, also citing cost, failed to kill it over objections from Congress - and the Marines. The V-22, built by Bell Helicopter and the Boeing Co., was deemed ideal for carrying troops because it can take off and land like a helicopter, then tilt its engines and rotors forward to fly like a turboprop airplane. After three fatal crashes, numerous delays and compromises that some inside the military believe endanger those on board, the 10 V-22s are finally based at al Asad air base in western Iraq (the Marines have clamped down on all information about their operations, but expect a formal Iraqi unveiling of the V-22s soon). At least one contractor agrees with the Air Force that the interim gun aboard the V-22 is wanting. BAE Systems has been investing in the development of a remotely-aimed gun that could be slung from the V-22's belly and installed starting in about a year, BAE officials say. The gun, which could range in size from 7.62 mm (the size of the current gun) to .50-cal. (the size Jones wanted) would protrude from the V-22's belly, just forward of the swiveling gun. A V-22 crew member located in the passenger compartment would fire the gun, based on the video images displayed, with a hand-held controller. A Pentagon official says this design, while perhaps adequate for special-ops V-22s, wouldn't replace the need for a final weapon for the Marine V-22 that would be integrated into the aircraft's internal electronic and computer systems. The Pentagon is seeking $82 million to develop a permanent gun, on top of the $45 million it already spent trying to meet Jones' requirement for one. V-22 pilots like Marine Lieutenant Colonel Anthony "Buddy" Bianca know their aircraft is heading off to war with inadequate firepower. "It says right there in the ORD" -- the Operational Requirements Document specifying what the aircraft must be able to do -- that "the aircraft is supposed to have 360 degrees field of fire with a defensive weapon," says Bianca, who has spent 1,300 hours flying the V-22 over the past eight years. "I don't care if its a turret, you stick it out of a window or you patch it on with bubblegum, but we've got to find a way to do that." Bianca, 40, told TIME that the current rear gun is "not the answer," and that Marines are planning on installing a better gun eventually. He pauses when asked if he thinks the V-22 should be sent to Iraq with the small, ramp-mounted gun as its only weapon. "That question," he says, "is not mine to say." But as has always been the case in war, the more junior the officer, the less concerned he is about the weapon he is bringing to the fight. The gun doesn't faze Captain Justin "Moon" McKinney from Albany, Georgia, who has spent nearly 200 hours flying the V-22 over the past year. McKinney, 30, and his fellow "Thunder Chickens" of Marine Medium Tiltrotor Squadron 263 from Jacksonville, N.C., are now in Iraq. "I think the weapon," he said as he readied for the deployment, "is very sufficient." Bianca recalls why Jones' original scheme for a bigger gun was scrapped. "It was primarily cost, to be honest with you," he said. "I was in the room when (the contractors) were basically told that `this was our price-tag limits to develop this weapon' and they came back with a price tag and were told, `Well guys, you just designed yourself out of a weapons system.'" The gun's ultimate cost - $1.5 million a copy - ended up being too expensive in the Pentagon's eyes. That price - barely more than 1% of the V-22's current cost - ultimately doomed it, and sent the aircraft to Iraq sporting a weapon some Marines deride as a "peashooter."

Going through some old pictures from UPT (yes we had cameras back then), and I was reminded of a dude in my class who was on the verge of washing out for air sickness. On one flight he horked into his mask then mucked it back down so as to avoid being washed out...total dedication. Anyone else have some good puke stories? Just to set the right tone, please enjoy this clip from a Swedish game show...

Thank the contractors and lawyers...

FWIW...when I was in the building, the man was absolutely committed to the new tanker and CSARX. His new exec, a 60 dude, will give him an earful everyday if he does not honor his word.

Great, glad you are here to contribute.

That is what is so disturbing about Johann's "Farce" comment. He must have him skull buried in the sand.

It is.

Navy again delays Blue Angels crash report By Zachary M. Peterson - Staff writer Posted : Friday Sep 7, 2007 12:52:44 EDT The Navy’s investigation into April’s crash of a Blue Angels F/A-18C Hornet that killed one pilot was completed in June, but the Chief of Naval Air Training in Corpus Christi, Texas, has now twice delayed the public release of the mishap inquiry. Lt. Cmdr. Kevin Davis, 32, of Pittsfield, Mass, was killed April 21 when his jet crashed into a wooded residential area near Marine Corps Air Station Beaufort, S.C. He crashed as he attempted to reform in formation with his five squadron-mates at the end of an air show. Witnesses said metal and plastic wreckage — some of it on fire — hit homes in the neighborhood about 35 miles northwest of Hilton Head. William Winn, the county's emergency management director, said at the time that several homes were damaged. Eight people on the ground suffered injuries that were not life-threatening. The Navy originally said the public release of the Judge Advocate General Manual investigation report would be in August. However, in August, the Navy said the report would be out by Sept. 1. Now, Lt. Sean Robertson, a spokesman for the Chief of Naval Air Training, says there is no “fixed date” for the release of the report. “We want to be right as opposed to quick,” he said. The 709-page report, including all enclosures, has to be hand-redacted, proofed and sent to the printer, according to Robertson.

Please don't take this the wrong way, but are there any psychological issues influencing your life right now. I am in no way trying to imply that you are unstable, but we all have stress in our lives and sometimes events can lead to things like insomnia. I mention it because it appears your are trying to treat the symptom rather than the issue. Is this a particularly hard (STS) semester in school or is there something going on in your family that has diverted your attention? I dealt with insomnia when my mom suffered an aneurysm. It coincided with a very stressful job as an exec in the puzzle palace. I too thought about Ambien, in fact I asked the flight doc who did not want to give me any (separate issue, my buddy was an exec and having the same issue and the other doc gave him a crap load of Ambien which prompted me to ask). Regardless, as my Mom got better things returned to normal. I mention this because you will find yourself under a lot of stress in UPT and learning now to identify your stress, the issue that is causing it, and a few mechanisms for dealing with it, will help your overall performance. I wish you luck.

Ladies please pardon Beaver's hostility, he is upset because Fighting Falcon pilots have to squat to pee, while real men....err "Herk Dudes" stand to pee.

Not a crime that he got promoted... the crime is that he got promoted MULTIPLE YEARS EARLY, in front of other dudes that did not plant a Viper in the dirt in grand style. Props for putting any LGPOS in the dirt.

Yes...and now promoted early.

An AMAZING factoid reference that picture...the pilot pictured was just promoted BPZ!

Ya think?

I am reasonably certain the brown one was at some point shortly before the crash, hit by a gray one.

Just like the "Gunship Flares" comment when there were no pictures of Gunships dropping flares, he posts pictures of Talons and Slick 130's crashed, but no pictures of a crashed gunship... Thanks for proving my point for me. Ignorance is bliss. BTW - When you drop hints to this thread in another thread, calling it a pissing match, remember, YOU called "fight's on".

Yup...they all look the same.

I don't know of any other pictures of the AC-130H dropping flares, especially one with the ALQ-172. I guess when you are looking at the same picture of the LGPOS, all airplanes begin to look the same.

I actually flew this very plane last Wed. We even had the audacity to report initial for 13R at Tyndall with a line of Raptors and Eagles waiting in the EOR.

Most of the F-16 Pilots I know are referred to as "Douches", "Raging Arseholes", and "Wannabe Gunship Pilots", but never Fighting Falcon Drivers... It is possible to be a major select at 26...if the guy in in the Guard or Reserve...not probable, but possible.

A very close friend is a very good freelance photographer here in the US. He gave me the same speech about shutter speed and motion on the rotor. When I have a chance I will set the program to slow the shutter speed and hopefully do a better job next time.

A very close friend is a very good freelance photographer here in the US. He gave me the same speech about shutter speed and motion on the rotor. When I have a chance I will set the program to slow the shutter speed and hopefully do a better job next time.

I have enough trouble remembering that pushing the yoke forward makes the houses get bigger...