ClearedHot

It was briefed at ACSC...so it has to be true...in WWII, the U. S. Army Air Corps lost more aircraft and personal to training accidents than they did to combat.

At no point in your rambling, incoherent response was there anything that could even be considered a rational thought. Everyone in this room is now dumber for having listened to it. I award you no points, and may God have mercy on your soul! #1. Flight 19 was a flight of FIVE, not four TBM Avengers, not F4U Corsairs. #2. A SINGLE TBM Avenger, not four....errr, five, was found during the Challenger recovery. The wreckage was raised in 1990, but positive identification could not be made. The only thing freaky is your nonsensical post.

Good read Brick. Oddly enough I met Harmer two weeks ago, he is the new 33 FW WG/CC, I guess the report served him well.

Things like "Ball Collapse"...

Completely disagree...Specifically... "But you guys are kidding yourselves if you think all this hate has nothing to do with the fact that the guys now populating the place have been homesteading on the Florida panhandle for their entire careers." Do you know this to be a fact, or are you pulling it out of your arse as an assumption? Not all Gunship guys camp at Hurlburt their entire career, I've PCSed 8 times, how about you? These are the most dedicated dudes I've ever met. I know a few dudes who just left on their 17th rotation. The way this move will most likely happen....deploy for 90-120, return and immediately pack your bags, forced sale of you house for a loss in a shit housing market, arrive at new location with over-priced homes and almost no choice, unpack, 60 days later leave your family in said shit hole and deploy for another 90-120. Asking for a little stability and a little less suck in their home life is not a lot to ask. I volunteered to do this job and I've always gone where the man has told me to, so please don't insult my intelligence with made up facts that you know jack shit zero about. Bottomline, If I have to eat a rotten egg, I will, just don't expect me to smile while I am doing it. Oh yeah...Clovis is a shit hole.

My next gun...

You could not be more wrong...it matters to me where I am stationed and more importantly where my family lives when I spent 5 months a year down range. You are guessing wrong dude. I've been doing this a LONG time, and I've never met a single person like that in the gunship community. Oh yeah, Clovis is a shit hole.

They "call" Clovis home and live there by choice. The USAF folks going there have NO CHOICE. Clovis is a shit hole.

Well the mudslinging has begun. A few AFSOC dudes who will soon be PCSing to Cannon put together a video with pictures from a recent visit. If you look at the comments on the Youtube page, the debate is already getting ugly. I heard second-hand that this video made it to a recent mayoral debate, their answer...and this is takes the cake..."If they don't like it here, let them volunteer to go to Iraq". Hey Clovis... Boycott Clovis New Mexico EDITED by Baseops -- Clip Inserted Below:

In the 45 year history of the KC-135, has anyone ever bailed out of one?

Britain: Harry's Afghan deployment over LONDON - Britain's defense chief decided Friday to immediately pull Prince Harry out of Afghanistan after news of his deployment was leaked on the U.S. Web site the Drudge Report. Air Chief Marshal Jock Stirrup, chief of the Defense Staff, said he decided to withdraw the prince after senior commanders assessed the risks, the Defense Ministry said in a statement. Harry, third in line to the British throne, has been serving on the front line with an army unit in Afghanistan's southern Helmand province since mid-December. He was originally due to return to Britain within weeks, but "the situation has now clearly changed," the statement said. The decision was based on concerns that worldwide media coverage of Harry in Afghanistan could put him and his comrades at increased risk. The ministry asked the media not to speculate on Harry's location — or how and when he would return — until he was back in Britain. British officials had hoped to keep Prince Harry's deployment secret until he had safely returned, but they released video of him serving in Helmand Province after the leak appeared on the Drudge Report. The ministry deplored the leak by "elements of the foreign media." "However, this was a circumstance that we have always been aware of and one for which we have had contingency plans in place," the statement said. Prime Minister Gordon Brown said the prince had demonstrated that he was an exemplary young officer. "The whole of Britain will be proud of the outstanding service he is giving," he said. Harry, 23, is the first royal to serve in a combat zone since his uncle Prince Andrew flew helicopters during Britain's war with Argentina over the Falkland Islands in 1982. Tours to Afghanistan usually last six months; Harry has served 10 weeks. Harry conceded in an interview filmed last week that when he returns to Britain he could be a "top target" for Islamic terrorists. "Once this ... comes out, every single person that supports them will be trying to slot me," he said. The deployment plan had been disclosed to reporters, with no specific date, but was not reported previously because of an agreement between the Ministry of Defense and all major news organizations operating in Britain, including The Associated Press. The news blackout was intended to reduce the risk to the prince and his regiment. Harry was supposed to go to Iraq with the Blues and Royals regiment in May last year but the assignment was canceled because of security fears. Iraqi insurgents made threats on Internet chat rooms, saying he would not make it home alive. Harry trained at Sandhurst military academy and joined the Blues and Royals as a cornet, the cavalry regiment's equivalent of a second lieutenant. After being held back from his Iraq assignment, the prince threatened to quit the army if he was not given the chance to see combat. Harry said his older brother, William, who also graduated from Sandhurst and is training as a military pilot, is jealous of his deployment. As Britain's likely future king, Prince William is unlikely ever to see combat. Helmand province is where most of the 7,800 British soldiers in Afghanistan are based. It has seen some of the country's fiercest combat in recent years, with NATO-led forces fighting the Taliban and al-Qaida militants. Harry's work in Afghanistan has involved calling in airstrikes on Taliban positions as well as going out on foot patrols. He spent part of his deployment at a base 500 yards from Taliban positions, the military said. Since Harry's arrival, his battle group has been responsible for around 30 enemy deaths, a Ministry of Defense official said, speaking on condition of anonymity because he was not authorized to release the information. Video showed the prince in camouflage fatigues walking across arid and dusty terrain, calling in air support, firing a machine gun and patrolling the streets of Garmsir, the southernmost part of the province. He has since left Garmsir, and his current whereabouts are being kept secre

David A. Fulghum/Aerospace Daily & Defense Report One of the pilots of the B-2 stealth bomber that crashed Feb. 23 reported a fire at takeoff from Andersen Air Force Base, Guam, which was followed quickly by loss of control of the bomber, according to a senior Air Combat Command (ACC) official. The stealth bomber rolled uncontrollably to the right and fell between the taxiway and the ramp at 10:45 a.m. Guam time just after passing the control tower. It was attempting a takeoff toward the seaward end of the runway. The two pilots ejected with one being hospitalized. A dark plume of smoke arose from the crash site and civilians outside the base reported a second explosion about 30 minutes after the initial impact. The aircraft can lose one or even two of its four General Electric F118-GE-100 17,300-pound thrust engines and still take off, so it’s unlikely that engine failure was to blame, says a retired U.S. Air Force pilot who has flown the B-2. Moreover, early suggestions that the aircraft struck birds or stalled in a steep takeoff climb also have been dismissed as unlikely. Also, the weather was reported as clear. The bomber Spirit of Kansas, tail no. 890127, was the second in a four-aircraft flight that was ending its deployment and taking off for return to home base at Whiteman Air Force Base, Mo. They were being replaced by six B-52s as a forward-based, heavy-bomber force in the Pacific. The loss cuts the number of combat-coded B-2s to 15 from 16 out of the total force of 21. The force has a minimum aircraft requirement of 19 airframes. The other three B-2s later returned to Whiteman, where the wing commander has declared a “safety pause” for the fleet, ACC officials say. During the pause, procedures are being reviewed with the pilots and training is at a standdown. However, if the stealthy bomber is needed for an operational mission it is cleared to fly. The aircraft that crashed rolled off Northrop Grumman’s line in 1989 and had accumulated 5,176 flying hours at the time of the crash. Early testing indicated that the aircraft would remain structurally intact for about 40,000 flying hours. Analyses also posited that the rudder attachment points would be the first structural failure item. This is the first B-2 crash, but another of the Air Force’s heavy bomber fleet, the B-1, has suffered a number of seemingly similar in-flight emergencies. A pelican-sized bird ripping through fuel and hydraulic lines downed the first, a fuel-fed fire on takeoff destroyed another, a fire in the instrument panel over Kentucky struck another and a fourth was abandoned by its crew about 100 miles short of Diego Garcia in the Indian Ocean while returning from a bombing mission in Afghanistan.

Whoa...STS

Navy missile hits spy satellite By ROBERT BURNS, AP Military Writer 7 minutes ago WASHINGTON - A missile launched from a Navy ship struck a dying U.S. spy satellite passing 130 miles over the Pacific on Wednesday, the Pentagon said. It was not clear whether the operation succeeded in its main goal of destroying a tank aboard the satellite that carried a toxic fuel that U.S. officials said could pose a hazard to humans if it landed in a populated area. "Confirmation that the fuel tank has been fragmented should be available within 24 hours," the Pentagon said in a written statement. The USS Lake Erie, armed with an SM-3 missile designed to knock down incoming missiles — not orbiting satellites — launched the attack at 10:26 p.m. EST, according to the Pentagon. It hit the satellite as the spacecraft traveled at more than 17,000 mph. THIS IS A BREAKING NEWS UPDATE. Check back soon for further information. AP's earlier story is below. WASHINGTON (AP) — A missile launched from a Navy ship successfully struck a dying U.S. spy satellite passing 130 miles over the Pacific on Wednesday, a defense official said. Full details were not immediately available. It happened just after 10:30 p.m. EST. Two officials said the missile was launched successfully. One official, who is close to the process, said it hit the target. He said details on the results were not immediately known. The goal in this first-of-its-kind mission for the Navy was not just to hit the satellite but to obliterate a tank aboard the spacecraft carrying 1,000 pounds of a toxic fuel called hydrazine. U.S. officials have said the fuel would pose a potential health hazard to humans if it landed in a populated area. Although the odds of that were small even if the Pentagon had chosen not to try to shoot down the satellite, it was determined that it was worth trying to eliminate even that small chance. Officials said it might take a day or longer to know for sure if the toxic fuel was blown up.

The article I posted saying both pilots were ok was indeed an old report. It was given to me by my squadron Intel officer as the story was breaking, I will kill him tomorrow. I take the hit as I guess I should always trust, but verify. This is a tragic day for the Gorillas and the Nomad family.

Word just now flowing on CNN. No details on which base (Eglin or Tyndall).

Military Flybys are worth ten times the cost. As has been pointed out, great advertising, but more importantly, they remind Americans that we need a strong military.

Military Jet Flyovers Thrilling But Very Expensive '08 Super Bowl flyby cost $36K for 4-second event By Orlando Sentinel ORLANDO, Fla. — A flyby at a sports event can inspire a crowd like nothing else. But is it the best use of military time and money? The noise inside University of Phoenix Stadium in Glendale grew deafening as Jordin Sparks finished the national anthem before the start of this year's Super Bowl. It was time for that newly minted American sports tradition that puts an exclamation point on the pregame ceremonies: a military flyover. Only this time, no one at the game noticed. The stadium's roof was closed. No one could see the U.S. Navy's Blue Angels overhead. And it was so loud inside that no one could even hear the jets. But the almost 100 million watching on TV did get to see them for about four seconds. A spokesman estimated the cost of sending the six F/A-18A Hornets from their training home in El Centro, Calif., to Arizona and back at $36,000. Flybys fairly easy to get Flyovers, once unexpected moments at major sporting events, are now almost the norm, expected parts of pregame festivities. But an Orlando Sentinel investigation has found that you don't have to reach a very high bar to get one. At a time when the United States is fighting a war, flybys provide feel-good moments for fans, for sports leagues and even for athletes themselves — a spectacle that gives any sporting event added prestige and excitement. But are flyovers worth it, or are they a high-priced folly? "For the publicity aspect of it, I'd say it's definitely well worth it when you consider the cost to advertise during the Super Bowl," Blue Angels press officer Capt. Tyson Dunkelberger said. "The more people see our blue jets and recognize the Navy, the better it is for us." The U.S. Air Force Thunderbirds will perform a similar fly-by today before the Daytona 500. An Air Force spokeswoman said eight F-16 Fighting Falcon jets will fly from Nellis Air Force Base outside Las Vegas to Daytona Beach and back at a cost of $80,000. For the flyover itself, six jets will be in the air for 40 minutes, at an approximate fuel cost of $6,000. "We have this mission to bring the story of the Air Force to people who may not have an Air Force base near them," Thunderbirds press officer Capt. Elizabeth Kreft said. "We're going to reach an untold number of homes with the Air Force message, and that's why we were given permission to do it." Military officials say the fly-bys boost recruiting efforts and give Americans an opportunity to see their aircraft in action. Officials also insist that flyovers don't cost taxpayers any additional money, because each flyover counts as a training flight and comes out of already existing training budgets and schedules. "Baloney," said Winslow Wheeler, an analyst with the Center for Defense Information in Washington, D.C. "It's atrocious training. They're flying from Point A to Point B. They're doing a couple of sort of low-altitude passes over the events and they go home. That's what pilots call 'converting gas to noise.' " The Orlando Sentinel investigation shows the Air Force, the Army, the Marine Corps and the Navy receive about 850 requests for flyovers or parachute jumps at sporting events each year, and the vast majority of those requests are deemed eligible for aerial support — even if they're opening ceremonies for local Little League games or international tennis matches or minor-league baseball games. Once an event is deemed eligible, usually it's up to individual teams or leagues to find available squadrons to perform the flyby. Department of Defense Form 2535, the three-page application that must be filled out for every flyby request, makes no mention of sporting events. Its instructions state that "requests for flyovers will be considered only for aviation-oriented events . . . or for patriotic observances (one day only) held in conjunction with Armed Forces Day, Memorial Day, Independence Day, POW/MIA Recognition Day or Veterans Day."

Marines Protest Cost $93,000 For Police OT By Carolyn Jones Berkeley spent $93,000 on police overtime to control the Marines protest outside City Hall Tuesday, a city official said. About 140 Berkeley police officers worked at the protest, which drew more than 2,000 demonstrators from around the country, said Mary Kay Clunies-Ross, public information officer. There were four arrests, all misdemeanors. The protest was over the City Council's Jan. 29 statement that the Marines, who have a recruitment center downtown, are "unwelcome intruders." After 3 1/2 hours of public comment and debate, the council voted early Wednesday to back down from the statement. To prevent similar controversies in the future, City Councilman Gordon Wozniak has proposed that every item submitted by the Peace and Justice Commission - where the Marines statement originated - undergo two readings by the council. Usually commission items need one reading. Peace and Justice commissioners were not happy with the idea. "It's like he's trying to legislate himself to read what's on his own agenda," said the commission's former president, Steven Freedkin. Meanwhile, protests continue at the recruiting center on Shattuck Square. About 50 people from Code Pink and World Can't Wait blocked the center entrance for several hours Friday and then marched to UC Berkeley, a block away. There were no arrests.

Russia Doubts Motive In U.S. Satellite Shot By Associated Press MOSCOW — Russia said Saturday that U.S. military plans to shoot down a damaged spy satellite may be a veiled test of America's missile defense system. The Pentagon failed to provide "enough arguments" to back its plan to smash the satellite with a missile in the next several days, Russia's Defense Ministry said in a statement. "There is an impression that the United States is trying to use the accident with its satellite to test its national anti-missile defense system's capability to destroy other countries' satellites," the ministry said. The Bush administration says the operation is not a test of a program to kill other nations' orbiting communications and intelligence capabilities. U.S. diplomats around the world have been instructed to inform governments that it is meant to protect people from 1,000 pounds of toxic fuel on the bus-sized satellite hurtling toward the Earth. The diplomats were told to distinguish the upcoming attempt from last year's test by China of a missile specifically designed to take out satellites, a test that was criticized by the United States and other countries. Known by its military designation US 193, the satellite was launched in December 2006. It lost power, and its central computer failed almost immediately afterward, leaving it uncontrollable. It carried a sophisticated and secret imaging sensor. Left alone, the satellite would likely hit the Earth during the first week of March. About half of the 5,000-pound spacecraft probably would survive its blazing descent through the atmosphere and would scatter debris over several hundred miles. Military and administration officials said the satellite is carrying fuel called hydrazine that could injure or kill people who are near it when it hits the ground.

Not really... Using the PAC3 reduces your engagement options to friendly land masses that might not be the optimal points to engage the satellite in order to bring it down over the water. Engaging it with a Standard-3 means they can hit it while the orbit is over the ocean and any variations in orbit caused by the impact/explosion can be better mitigated. I believe they are going to engage at a reasonable altitude (150 Miles), just outside the atmosphere and the smaller pieces will decelerate and reenter much quicker over the ocean. Just my thoughts as I am not a Rocket Surgeon.

Please choke yourself. You are comparing pulling your socks up to meet he standard of some Nazi who has never been outside the wire or in any real danger to some thug with his arse hanging out. I believe as your name implies, you have tumbled your gyros and lost all SA.

FWIW, I was said three stars exec and he is not one to take backtalk lightly. I've seen him mad (usually at me), and you don't want to be on the receive end when he is pissed. I would bet $ Mr. Thug is out of the USAF by then end of the month.

You posted the wrong picture... Look at the "I won the rodeo" belt buckle in the other picture.