Jump to content
Baseops Forums
Sign in to follow this  
HU&W

AFI 36-2903 and dress/uniform regs and issues

Recommended Posts

Congratulations to whoever killed the Friday T-Shirt. The world is safe for democracy once again.

New AFI 36-2903 dated 18 July 2011 forbids colored shirts!

8.7. Undergarments. Undergarments are mandatory; during flight operations they must be cotton or fire retardant material due to added protection. Undergarments made of 100% nylon or polyester are not authorized during flight. Wear only desert sand (tan) undershirts (effective 1 November 2011, black or brown undershirts will no longer be authorized for wear with the FDU or DFDU). Effective immediately, wear of any other color undershirt and/or undershirts is prohibited when wearing the FDU/DFDU (wear of designated unit standardized undershirts with the FDU/DFDU is no longer authorized). For all other undershirt guidance reference paragraph 6.5. Thermal undergarments, (i.e., dickies, turtlenecks, and mock necks) are black, desert tan, white, or cream colored and are authorized for wear with the FDU/DFDU as weather conditions warrant.

Good thing I can still wear a "dicky"

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Great, the fucking assclown shoes win another one. I hope leadership will just say fuck it and let us do what's been done forever, as well as has zero negative impact on the mission, "professional image" or any other BS excuses the shoes came up with to pass this bullshit. Here's to hoping anyways.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Thermal undergarments, (i.e., dickies, turtlenecks, and mock necks) are black, desert tan, white, or cream colored and are authorized for wear with the FDU/DFDU as weather conditions warrant.

Wait...so no more black Tshirts, but all of the cold weather shit can still be black? WTFO?? This makes no sense at all.

Seriously...WTF were they thinking? WHY SWITCH THE T-SHIRT COLOR?? It just doesn't make any sense. I don't get it. Really. WTF? Can airmen no longer afford black T-Shirts? What was the logic behind this change....other than change for change's sake? :banghead:

While I'm on this rant...and I am sure this has already been covered...but why change the boots?? I can understand the economy of scale in going to the same boot for everyone. Buuuuttttt....no, they couldn't get it right. We still can't wear the green boots with the tan flight suits. So no savings there. WTF? Who is running the show at HQ?? Please stop the madness.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Seriously...WTF were they thinking? WHY SWITCH THE T-SHIRT COLOR?? It just doesn't make any sense. I don't get it. Really. WTF? Can airmen no longer afford black T-Shirts? What was the logic behind this change....other than change for change's sake?

black t-shirts were too readily available at stores other than those that are AAFES run. Now unless you really want to go out of your way, your choices are limited. Duh.

While I'm on this rant...and I am sure this has already been covered...but why change the boots?? I can understand the economy of scale in going to the same boot for everyone. Buuuuttttt....no, they couldn't get it right. We still can't wear the green boots with the tan flight suits. So no savings there. WTF? Who is running the show at HQ?? Please stop the madness.

Well, my original thought was that it was easier to not have to supply black and green shoes to Serviced Members, but your point pretty much defeated that thought... so now I'm down to the only other thought of "Shoes were too butthurt that since the BDUs were going away, they couldn't wear black boots, but flyers still could, so they needed to take it away".

So I don't see anything in the regs that prohibits utilizing that second hat in the other leg, nor do I see it saying it cannot have a velcro'd spot on it for a morale patch since it's just a second hat for decoration anyway....

maybe something like this:

117d8g8.jpg

Edited by AEWingsMN

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

What? Everyone knows the copilots duties are the gear, flaps, and the fat chick at the bar.

Ahem,

AFI-69.69 CO-PILOT UNION BI-LAWS

1.4 CP DUTIES. The CP is a valuable and integral part of any crew aircraft has many responsibilities. These include: finding sweet hotels when TDY in close proximity to speakeasies and houses of ill repute, AC ego maintenance, operating the landing gear, operating the flaps (some airframes), bailing other aircrew members out of jail, entertaining the crew with witty banter, quelling any navigator uprising and ensuring LMs stay out of the ACs box lunch. Under no circumstances will the CP, have to play wingman for a navigator (on crews with two navigators, they will wingman for themselves, preferably at a different bar from the rest of the crew) or take the fat chick (this is a loadmaster duty described in detail in TO XXX-1). EXCEPTION: Crews with radio or boom operators make delegate him to take the fat chick.

Edited by B*D*A
  • Upvote 5

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Found a Waco Museum T-Shirt in perfect shade of desert tan. Emblems on front and back are both easily hidden when in compliance and proudly displayed when sporting the flight suit arms around the waist tie-off or Zipper to the belly look.

Have 10 hours in a 1931 QCF-2 from Creve Couer, MO to the Bartlesville, OK, gig and back. Damn thing's prop was worth more than my Pitts!

So, I have a bunch of new black rag stock. Goes w/ all my cut up airline shirts. No lint, work well in the garage and hangar.

Pro Super- as an ex FCC and Pro Supe- Copilots and FCCs are interchangeable.

Edited by moosepileit

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Sadly, this is 99.69% likely to be the reason for the change. The AAFES lobby has probably had this in the works for years. I'm tempted to set up a "sand colored t-shirt stand" in front of the Bx and sell them for less just to piss off the AAFES mafia.

Sand appears to be a color option: http://www.cheapestees.com/gillig100tsh.html

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

We still can't wear the green boots with the tan flight suits.

Apparently I don't know what the hell I am talking about, or at least I'm only about 4 years behind this policy. Thanks to FOU for correcting me.

072013Z SEP 07

FROM: HQ AFPC RANDOLPH AFB TX//DPSOOC//

TO: 8106

SUBJECT: AIRMAN BATTLE UNIFORM (ABU) WEAR POLICY

1. THIS MESSAGE IS A FOLLOW ON TO 072005Z FEB 07 ABU WEAR POLICY MESSAGE. POLICY CONTAINED IN THIS MESSAGE IS EFFECTIVE IMMEDIATELY. ADDITIONAL INFORMATION/FAQS ABOUT THE ABU ARE LOCATED ON THE AF PORTAL UNIFORM WEBSITE, HTTPS://WWW.MY.AF.MIL .

2. THE ABU WAS AUTHORIZED FOR WEAR BY ALL AF PERSONNEL AS OF NOV 06. THE ABU REPLACES BOTH THE TEMPERATE AND HOT WEATHER BDU AND THE DCU. THE ABU WILL BE ISSUED AT BASIC MILITARY TRAINING IN THE INITIAL ISSUE CLOTHING BAG AS OF OCT 07. CLOTHING ALLOWANCE INCREASES GO INTO EFFECT OCT 07. MANDATORY WEAR DATE FOR THE ABU IS NOV 2011. PHASE- OUT DATE FOR THE BDU/DCU WILL BE SAME. WEAR OF THE ABU OR BDU CANNOT BE MANDATED NOR PROHIBITED DURING THIS TRANSITION PERIOD.

3. ALL PERSONNEL ARE REMINDED THAT WE ARE IN A MULTI-YEAR TRANSITION FROM THE BDU/DCU TO THE ABU. FLEXIBILITY ON THE PART OF ALL PERSONNEL WILL ALLOW CONTINUED FOCUS ON OUTFITTING WARFIGHTERS, WHILE OTHER DISTRIBUTION PLAN DYNAMICS ARE PUT IN PLACE. THESE INCLUDE INITIAL ISSUE OF THE ABU TO BASIC MILITARY TRAINEES AND LIMITED AVAILABILITY IN AAFES OUTLETS.

4. BASIC ABU UNIFORM CONFIGURATION:

A. ABU COAT (SHIRT)

B. ABU TROUSER

C. ABU PATROL CAP

D. DESERT SAND COLORED T-SHIRT

E. DESERT SAND COLORED RIGGER BELT

F. SAGE GREEN BOOT SOCKS

G. SAGE GREEN SUEDE BOOTS (DESERT TAN SUEDE BOOTS AUTHORIZED)

5. T-SHIRTS ARE CREW NECK. THE AUTHORIZED COLOR IS DESERT SAND (LIGHT TAN). THE FABRIC CAN BE 100% COTTON, POLY/COTTON BLEND, 100% POLYESTER OR SYNTHETIC, OR MOISTURE WICKING BLENDS AT THE OPTION OF THE MEMBER. ANY MISSION OR DUTY SPECIFIC SAFETY REQUIREMENTS (SUCH AS 100% COTTON OR NATURAL FIBERS) TAKE PRIORITY. THE ABU T-SHIRT IS AUTHORIZED FOR WEAR WITH THE OD GREEN AND DESERT FLIGHT SUITS. THERE IS NO CHANGE TO THE AUTHORIZED BDU T-SHIRT COLORS OF BLACK OR BROWN. TURTLENECKS (DESERT SAND COLORED) ARE AUTHORIZED IN COLD WEATHER.

6. ABU SAGE GREEN BOOTS ARE AUTHORIZED FOR WEAR WITH ALL UTILITY UNIFORMS - ABU, BDU, DCU, OLIVE DRAB (OD) GREEN FLIGHT SUIT AND DESERT TAN FLIGHT SUIT. DESERT TAN BOOTS ARE ALSO AUTHORIZED FOR WEAR WITH THE ABU,UNTIL THE MANDATORY WEAR DATE OF NOV 2011. SOCK COLOR FOR THE ABU BOOT IS SAGE GREEN, OR ANY COLOR AUTHORIZED WITH NON-ABU UTILITY UNIFORM. CERTIFIED SAFE-TO-FLY BOOTS WILL BE AVAILABLE IN OCT 07.

7. ABU PATROL CAPS ARE THE AUTHORIZED HEADGEAR FOR WEAR WITH THE ABU OUTSIDE OF THE AOR. ORGANIZATIONAL CAPS ARE NO LONGER AUTHORIZED.

8. ABU RANK AND BADGES, NAME AND US AIR FORCE TAPES CAN BE PURCHASED AT MILITARY CLOTHING SALES STORES. NAME AND "U.S. AIR FORCE" TAPES CAN BE ORDERED AND PURCHASED. THREAD COLOR FOR SEWING ON RANK AND INSIGNIA SHOULD BE IN THE SAME SHADE RANGE AS THE ABU FABRICS. RANK PLACEMENT ON ABU IDENTICAL TO BDU/DCU. SUBDUED METAL RANK ONLY AUTHORIZED FOR OFFICERS ON ABU, INCLUDING HATS AND APECS OUTERGARMENTS. SEWN ON CLOTH RANK AUTHORIZED FOR ALL.

9. ENLISTED RANK SHOULD BE POSITIONED AS PER AFI 36-2903. IF CREASE ON SLEEVE IS NOT CONSISTENT WITH CORRECT RANK PLACEMENT, IRONING OF THE SLEEVES TO "MOVE" THE CREASE IS AUTHORIZED. ABU SLEEVES MAY BE ROLLED UP AS PER TABLE 2.2 OF AFI 36-2903, THE SAME AS THE BDU/DCU SLEEVES.

10. TROUSERS WILL BE BLOUSED AS PER TABLE 2.2, LINE 2 OF AFI 36-2903, IN THE SAME MANNER AS THE BDU. IF TUCKED IN, TROUSERS WILL PRESENT A BLOUSED APPEARANCE.

11. AERONAUTICAL, CHAPLAIN, AND OCCUPATIONAL BADGES AND REQUIRED DUTY SHIELDS ARE AUTHORIZED. OCCUPATIONAL BADGES ARE OPTIONAL. OTHER BADGES ARE NOT AUTHORIZED. AFI 36-2903, TABLE 5.2, NOTE 5, APPLIES TO THE ABU: A MAXIMUM OF THREE BADGES CAN BE WORN, WITH A MAXIMUM OF TWO ABOVE THE US AIR FORCE TAPE ON THE LEFT SIDE. A THIRD BADGE MAY BE WORN IF AUTHORIZED FOR PLACEMENT ON THE LEFT BREAST POCKET. THERE IS NO BADGE, PATCH OR INSIGNIA AUTHORIZED FOR WEAR ON THE RIGHT POCKET.

12. NO PATCHES ARE AUTHORIZED ON THE ABU. COMMAND INSIGNIA IS NOT AUTHORIZED ON THE ABU.

13. SHADE VARIATIONS BETWEEN THE ABU COAT AND TROUSERS DO EXIST IN SOME INVENTORIES, THESE ARE AUTHORIZED FOR WEAR. SHADE VARIATIONS ARE EXPECTED TO BE SOLVED WITHIN A YEAR.

14. OPTIONAL ACCESSORIES SUCH AS BACKPACKS, BRIEFCASES, HYDRATION SYSTEMS, AND GYM BAGS: CONTINUE TO USE BLACK, OD, OR AF SAGE GREEN. ABU PATTERN ITEMS AUTHORIZED AS THEY BECOME AVAILABLE. WHEN QUESTIONS ARISE, LOCAL COMMAND INTERPRETATION TAKES PRECEDENT.

15. TRAVEL IN ABU FOLLOWS THE SAME GUIDELINES LISTED IN AFI 36-2903 FOR TRAVEL IN DCUS. ABU WEAR FOR COMMERCIAL TRAVEL IS ONLY AUTHORIZED WHEN TRAVEL IS CONTINUOUS FROM HOME TO AOR, OR FROM AOR TO HOME. SISTER SERVICE POLICIES ARE NOT APPLICABLE TO THE AIR FORCE.

16. ALL-PURPOSE ENVIRONMENTAL CLOTHING SYSTEM (APECS) JACKETS REPLACE THE BDU DCU GORE-TEX ® JACKETS. PHASE OUT DATES FOR THESE ITEMS IS NOV 2011. MIXING AND MATCHING OF PATTERNS IS NOT AUTHORIZED, SEE PARAGRAPH 19 FOR EXCEPTIONS. GORE-TEX® JACKET RANK INSIGNIA (BDU RANK FOBS) ARE AUTHORIZED UNTIL ABU RANK IS WIDELY AVAILABLE. OFFICERS CAN WEAR SUBDUED PIN-ON RANK ON THE APECS. FLEECE LINERS ARE AUTHORIZED AS LINERS ONLY (NOT FOR OUTERWEAR), AND CAN BE BLACK OR SAGE GREEN.

17. GLOVES CAN BE BLACK OR SAGE GREEN. MATERIAL CAN BE LEATHER, SUEDE OR KNIT. WATCH CAPS CAN BE BLACK OR SAGE GREEN. BLACK SCARVES ARE AUTHORIZED WITH THE APECS, AND MUST BE TUCKED IN. BLACK EARMUFFS AUTHORIZED. WHEN CONDITIONS DICTATE, THERMAL UNDERWEAR CAN BE WORN AND BE EXPOSED AT THE NECK OF THE ABU. WHITE, CREAM OR DESERT SAND COLORED THERMAL UNDERWEAR IS AUTHORIZED.

18. DO NOT STARCH OR HOT PRESS THE ABU. THE ABU IS A COTTON/NYLON BLEND FABRIC, REPEATED HOT PRESSING OR HEAVY IRONING WILL ACCELERATE THE OVERALL WEAR OF THE FABRIC. THE ABU SHOULD BE WASHED IN DETERGENT THAT DOES NOT CONTAIN OPTICAL BRIGHTENERS, OR THE NEAR INFRARED PROTECTION MAY BE DIMINISHED. A PARTIAL LISTING OF DETERGENTS THAT DO NOT CONTAIN OPTICAL BRIGHTENERS IS AVAILABLE ON THE AF PORTAL UNIFORM WEBSITE. CARE INSTRUCTIONS ARE ON THE LABEL OF THE ABU.

19. THE ABUS PURCHASED BY AF PERSONNEL THROUGH AAFES MILITARY CLOTHING SALES STORES, OR ISSUED THROUGH IEE OR CONTRACT EQUIVALENT, ARE CERTIFIED AS FULLY COMPLIANT WITH ALL SPECIFICATIONS. NO OTHER SUPPIERS ARE APPROVED FOR ORGANIZATIONAL/UNIT PURCHASES, OR ANY APPROPRIATED OR GWOT FUNDS EXPENDITURES. IF PERSONNEL CHOOSE TO USE PERSONAL FUNDS TO PURCHASE FROM NON-AAFES SUPPLIERS, THE AIR FORCE IS NOT RESPONSIBLE IF THE UNIFORM IS NOT FULLY COMPLIANT.

20. MIXING AND MATCHING CAMOUFLAGE PATTERNS, SPECIFICALLY ABU, DCU, OR BDU CAMOUFLAGE PATTERNS IS AUTHORIZED IN THE AOR. THIS APPLIES TO OUTERGARMENTS AND TACTICAL ITEMS ONLY (UTILITY UNIFORM COAT AND TROUSERS MUST MATCH). DEPLOYING PERSONNEL MAY WEAR BDU OR DCU GORE-TEX ® JACKETS WHILE IN CONUS WITH ABUS WHILE PERFORMING CST TRAINING ONLY.

21. COMMANDERS WILL CONTINUE TO ENSURE COMPLIANCE WITH UNIFORM SAFETY REGULATIONS. DURING THE TRANSITION TO THE ABU, ANY CONCERNS REGARDING SAFETY, SECURITY, OR MEDICAL COMPLIANCE SHOULD BE ADDRESSED THROUGH ORGANIZATIONAL CHAIN OF COMMAND TO ENSURE APPROPRIATE COORDINATION.

22. REQUESTS FOR EXCEPTION TO POLICY FOR ABU-RELATED UNIFORM POLICIES SHOULD BE ROUTED THROUGH YOUR MAJCOM A1 TO AF/A1DO. QUESTIONS REGARDING ABU WEAR POLICY SHOULD BE DIRECTED TO THE AFPC CALL CENTER, AT DSN 665-5000; COMMERCIAL (210) 565-5000; OR TOLL FREE, 1-800-616-3775, SELECT OPTIONS 1, 1, 2.

//SIGNED//

EARL V. MCCALLUM, JR., COLONEL, USAF

CHIEF, SUSTAINMENT DIVISION

UNCLAS

------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

My first friday in a flying unit tomorrow, just got the "no-go" on the friday shirt I *just* bought. I feel fvcking robbed.

I shall let my contempt for this injustice simmer.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

This gem was just dropped on us. If your 'stache is out of regs, prostitution will run rampant. It's good to see our focus and priorities are in line with why we're out here:

"Before I get into the immediate 1-meter Targets listed below, I’d like to describe a theory intended to illustrate WHY you’ll be seeing increased attention being given to uniform/grooming standards here at ASAB. This theory, developed by a couple of political scientists named Wilson and Keating, was given tons of air-time by Mayor Rudy Giuliani when he began a crusade against crime in NYC. When the Mayor began his campaign he was met with all kinds of resistance from dissidents expressing reasons why the plan wouldn’t work…. After-all, NYC was considered the crime-capital of the US at the time. Using the philosophical perspectives behind the “broken windows theory”, Rudy G. was able to reverse-engineer MANY of the inner-city woes back to a common reference point or “starting line”. That turning point began as broken windows or graffiti started appearing in a neighborhood… relatively inconsequential things when paired against gang-violence, drug offenses and murder. To span that gap, the theory suggested that broken windows and graffiti told the people living in the neighborhood that small things like appearance, pride, and enforcing low-end standards didn’t matter. Before too long, more broken windows and graffiti would spread-out from these original epicenters and eventually turn parts of the city into war-zones…and establish new thresholds for what the local population considered normal or allowable. It was like an “Apathy Bomb” that had fallout raining on everyone. Prostitution, panhandling, drug-deals, and robbery became the norms in most run-down places because the root cause (apathy) was the flavor of the month/year/decade etc. The first step Rudy needed to take was to hit the root cause…the outward displays of broken rules and the other physical manifestations of apathy. Within a few years, this enforcement of a new baseline would revive NYC, instill pride, and earn it the reputation as one of the safest cities in America. In NYC today…the broken windows are fixed immediately & the law-breakers are targeted with vigor.

So, why does that matter here? Because there are quite a few broken windows that we’re going to start fixing – beginning with Uniform & Grooming standards. If you’re a broken window, there’ll be a few people doing maintenance on you. That way the threshold will be clear.

Target 1. Grooming standards apply in the PTU. That means males will be clean-shaven in public…unless on a shaving waiver. Shaving waivers will be carried by those on waiver…in every uniform. It needs to be current or you are out of our uniform standards. In addition… If you look like you’re on day two of a shaving hiatus…expect to be addressed. Yes, I realize that some will get beard growth faster than others…but I don’t expect to be confronted by Grizzly Adams out on the street or in the DFAC.

BOTTOM LINE HERE: YOUR military image should be personal, like the reflection in your mirror. When you step into public view it becomes the military image of ASAB…and I’m not down with an inappropriate image being reflected against the rest of us.

Target 2. Mustaches. If you wear one, it will be worn properly. Tom Selleck’s, Pancho Villa’s and Robin Old’s mustaches do not meet the AF standard. Period. For ease in reference, I’ve included a picture for those of you who may be visual learners. If you’re approached by me or someone else scoping-out your ‘stache…it may be because you’re pretty close to the vertical line. It’s not personal…just 100% professional. If anything, I hope everyone takes a look in a mirror at least once during the day for a vector-check on ALL standards. NOTE: Some folks may actually think that purposefully wearing a mustache “out of regs” is cool. Think again, since your example is far from cool & the people in your leadership chain might start questioning your commitment to other standards.

Mustache wear STANDARD: AFI 36-2903 Excerpt: para 3.1.2.2. Mustaches. Male Airmen may have mustaches; however they will be conservative (moderate, being within reasonable limits; not excessive or extreme) and will not extend downward beyond the lip line of the upper lip or extend sideways beyond a vertical line drawn upward from both corners of the mouth. See ATTACHMENT, to reference points B, C, and D.

BOTTOM LINE HERE: Everyone who converses with you in a business or personal capacity will immediately see your lack of regard for the standards..it will be as plain as the nose on your face (or what’s under it).

Target 3. Untucked shirts or rolled-sleeves in the PTU: I’ve heard every excuse in the book…but have also seen some validated issues. If the shirt is tucked into the shorts PROPERLY (not “bloused” over the waist-band) and the shorts drawstring is cinched-up (not left baggy like MC-Hammer pants from the 90’s)…you can probably run like a scalded cheetah and it isn’t coming out. I’ve actually tested the theory on folks before…and they’d probably collapse from exhaustion before the shirt popped out. If it does, you are part of the 1% that has a longer torso than the shirts were made to support. If it comes out…tuck it back in immediately and you’ll be fine. There isn’t a 3-step or 30-second rule in effect. Do it as soon as you can.

BOTTOM LINE HERE: I don’t care what you think about the standards…they are still the standard, so keep you out of it. If I had the option, I’d do a lot of things differently….but I don’t.

Target 4. Rolled sleeves in the DFDU: Easy to spot since everyone else across the AOR can’t push their uniform sleeves up (and most folks know that requirement). DFDU “no-roll” sleeve guidance is documented in AFI 36-2903’s at the Air Force, CENTCOM, AFCENT and ASAB levels. Not sure why it’s reiterated in every single level of our uniform standards…but regardless of the “alleged” overkill, it still seems to be an issue.

BOTTOM LINE HERE: In much the same way that Aviation checklist discipline is important…uniform standards discipline is also significant…it tells us how to maintain the Human Weapons System.

Target 5. Tobacco use in unauthorized areas: Way too much evidence to support a lack of integrity in this area. Cigarette butts thrown near buildings (which probably means folks are smoking right outside the doors). Besides the wanton disregard for other people’s health, the wanton disregard for our shared community spaces also needs to be addressed. I cannot begin to tell you how diametrically opposed I am to having non-smokers clean-up after smokers. So smokers should expect further activity in this realm very soon if self-policing doesn’t work. If the rule-breakers can’t be reigned-in, we’ll possibly be looking at dropping the number of designated tobacco use areas in the B400 areas down to ONE. BOTTOM LINE: Want to get on a recurring cigarette-butt clean-up crew? Break the rules and you’ll probably be in the starting lineup.

REQUIREMENT – Help fix these issues…and don’t let our cultural “norms” transform into anything less than full/mandatory compliance. Attack apathy early…and often if necessary. If you need help…elevate to someone who can.

BOTTOM LINE: Leaders at all levels need to do two things. Meet the standards personally…and ensure compliance in those who don’t. The broken windows can’t all be fixed by just a select few since this isn’t a spectator sport. Start with you…and work your way out. If someone informs you of a shortfall…be thankful. That person is simply doing their DUTY…and actually cares enough about you to say something.

ROCK BOTTOM LINE: Don’t get confused and think that all of the aforementioned things are “Chief Xxxxxxxx’s” requirements. Nope. Those are the result of 74 years of history/heritage. All of those requirements are purposefully stated in AFI’s signed-out by General Officers and by YOUR Wing Commander. They are also enforceable under Articles 92 and 134 of the UCMJ. Make no mistake about it…we simply execute policies, standards and directives…our Commanders create them...and the cycle will continue for the next 74 years - with, or without us.

V/R

CMSgt X. Xxxxx Xxxxxxxx

Wing Command Chief Master Sergeant

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Target 2. Mustaches. If you wear one, it will be worn properly. Tom Selleck’s, Pancho Villa’s and Robin Old’s mustaches do not meet the AF standard. Period. For ease in reference, I’ve included a picture for those of you who may be visual learners. If you’re approached by me or someone else scoping-out your ‘stache…it may be because you’re pretty close to the vertical line. It’s not personal…just 100% professional. If anything, I hope everyone takes a look in a mirror at least once during the day for a vector-check on ALL standards. NOTE: Some folks may actually think that purposefully wearing a mustache “out of regs” is cool. Think again, since your example is far from cool & the people in your leadership chain might start questioning your commitment to other standards.

Robin Old's was a ######ing hero Chief. Ever say anything less than exceptional about him again and I'll hurt you, slowly :flipoff: .

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

ROCK BOTTOM LINE: Don't get confused and think that all of the aforementioned things are "Chief Xxxxxxxx's" requirements. Nope. Those are the result of 74 years of history/heritage. All of those requirements are purposefully stated in AFI's signed-out by General Officers and by YOUR Wing Commander. They are also enforceable under Articles 92 and 134 of the UCMJ. Make no mistake about it…we simply execute policies, standards and directives…our Commanders create them...and the cycle will continue for the next 74 years - with, or without us.

V/R

CMSgt X. Xxxxx Xxxxxxxx

Wing Command Chief Master Sergeant

First, there can be only one bottom line; this message has 6-9. Second, if the Air Force began in 1947, by my count we have been around for 64 years, but I've been incorrect about math before. Finally, these rules are definitely not from our history and heritage, they are from 96.9 shoe clerk uniform boards in 64 years.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Shouldn't the Wing Commander be publishing memos regarding the standards that will be enforced in his wing? Or do Wing Commanders now abdicate their authority and enforcement of standards to SNCOs?

I had the pleasure of serving under Gen Ron Keys while he was the Wing Commander at Eielson. He introduced himself to the pilots of the base by telling us that we should picture his face in our HUDs while we flew. If we couldn't explain to him what we were doing while we did it, we probably shouldn't be doing it. He also very clearly explained that if he was forced to do the jobs of other people assigned to his wing, he didn't need them. And if he didn't need them, he'd fire them. He was a man who led by example, took responsibility for leading his wing, and made it clear to all in his wing what his expectations were. He certainly didn't ask his SNCOs to take command of standard enforcement.

That entire letter absolutely reeks of a complete absence of effective practical leadership at ASAB. To tap into the Chief's line of thinking, he would be more accurate to trace the lack of basic discipline to a lack of professional morale. That in turn, can be traced to a lack of leadership from the top. Forget mustaches and tucked in shirts. Somebody send that base an actual leader. The rest will follow and the Chief can go back to being something other than a TI.

  • Upvote 2

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Guest

I just don't understand this anal retentive uniform standards enforcement obsession. It borders on insanity.

It is not new but it hasn't been this bad since Vietnam. Richard Drury describes similar behaviors in My Secret War.

Unfortunately, I think we're a bit off track in terms of priorities. For example, uniform standards are not the emphasis item among the people I have known from many different nations who were what I would call full up warriors. If you are lucky enough to spend time among these kinds of people you will notice it is more like the bar scene in Star Wars than a group of "Human Weapon Systems" spit shined and ready for inspection.

I can only think there must not be enough fighting going on and we have too many people not doing the fighting that's not happening.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Stand by for next months email from Chief Shoeclerk:

Our Air Force Heritage; Why the Persians Defeated Leonidas on the Third Day

The real reason King Leonidas' 300 men could not hold against the Persians 200,000 after three days was that the Persians had done a uniform inspection and fixed all their discrepancies that morning and thus their 'Human Weapon Systems' were in perfect condition. Abbreviated by the Persians as HumWS, the legend of the victory was the original inspiration for the Hummus (note the similarity to HumWS), the delicious Chick Pea dip that spread throughout the Persian Empire. Hummus was a daily dish throughout the Persian Empire and thus reminded the soldiers that a proper uniform will defeat any enemy.

Edited by Smokin

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

This guy sounds like the kind of douche who patrols the Dragon DFAC and hands out business cards so we can "feel free to contact him later." That E-9 is something else...

Agreed with rainman, if you're doing enough flying and fighting and keep the operation lean there won't be time to worry about this kind of BS. Might happen if this whole thing in Afghanistan starts to wind down in earnest. The folks who will be there till the end can focus on actually working instead of conducting a social experiment on how many ridiculous rules you can create and enforce...

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Ok, the simple fact is the new standards suck. But there are loopholes to everything right?

So what can we still wear that isn't addressed or is vague and we know it will piss leadership off? I saw a previous post about wearing tan boots with the green flight suit. I'm sure I would get questioned about that.

Anything else to boil their skin? Being an O-1, especially in AETC, is pretty awesome. I love the comments that come from asshole Captains with less TIS than me and love pushing studs around because they are finally in charge of something. :salut:

  • Upvote 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

The word floating around here is that white v-necks are authorized undershirts for bags. Can anyone confirm or deny that?

Not really sure I'd be willing to wear one, but I'm sure if you wanted to piss off leadership it'd be one way.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Verbatim from a squadron commander's e-mail concerning FDU patches at XX FTS at XX FTW yesterday:

exception on Fridays where you can wear wing patch or US flag

A SQ/CC can't tell you you can't wear the fucking American Flag!!! I think the point was made previously that the non-rated community does not run the Air Force. Pilots are creating and enforcing this bullshit, and this is more evidence of that.

Ok, the simple fact is the new standards suck. But there are loopholes to everything right?

So what can we still wear that isn't addressed or is vague and we know it will piss leadership off? I saw a previous post about wearing tan boots with the green flight suit. I'm sure I would get questioned about that.

Anything else to boil their skin? Being an O-1, especially in AETC, is pretty awesome. I love the comments that come from asshole Captains with less TIS than me and love pushing studs around because they are finally in charge of something. :salut:

We have started wearing the brown undershirts with green boots. Looks like shit, but totally within the regs.

Edited by Gravedigger

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

A SQ/CC can't tell you you can't wear the fucking American Flag!!!

Oh really? Wanna cite something on that?

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
A SQ/CC can't tell you you can't wear the fucking American Flag

Of course they can.

PS, there's an enormous portion of the USAF flying community that doesn't wear the flag on their flight suits.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Oh really? Wanna cite something on that?

Sure

8.4.7. Left Sleeve. Normally wear the US flag, emblem of appropriate wing, group, or center, positioned no lower than 1 inch from shoulder seam in accordance with MAJCOM supplements to this instruction.

The AFI states that it is an OPTION to wear a flag. I am aware of no MAJCOM instructions which prohibit American flag wear.

Of course they can.

PS, there's an enormous portion of the USAF flying community that doesn't wear the flag on their flight suits.

Just because "an enormous portion of the USAF flying community...doesn't wear the flag" doesn't mean a squadron commander can order you to take off a perfectly valid patch.

Honestly though, if my Sq/CC asked me to remove an American flag, I would be disappointed in him, lose respect for him, and comply with his request. It isn't worth any sort of fight.

On a related note, I wore my Nav School patch today (still an authorized patch in a certain MAJCOM supplement!). A high-ranking officer saw it, smiled, and said, "Nice. I like it." No criticism. No reading the riot act. No E-9-esque temper tantrum. Truth is, I think they'd rather have us express ourselves through extremely-low-grade insubordination (we all know we are breaking "the rules") and have higher morale than have low morale and look pretty. One of the two will get us through the next war and looking pretty ain't a winning tactic in any AFTTP...

...maybe the Thunderbirds...

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Sure

8.4.7. Left Sleeve. Normally wear the US flag, emblem of appropriate wing, group, or center, positioned no lower than 1 inch from shoulder seam in accordance with MAJCOM supplements to this instruction.

The AFI states that it is an OPTION to wear a flag. I am aware of no MAJCOM instructions which prohibit American flag wear.

3.2.5.4.(ACC) Left Sleeve. A vivid emblem, approximately 3 X 3 inches in size, of the appropriateparent wing, separate operating group, or numbered air force will be worn on the Velcro. Members may wear the Weapons School Patch, USAF Test Pilot School (graduate or instructor) upon completion of the appropriate school. Installation commanders prescribe wear of the U.S. flag on the FDU. If prescribed, implementation will be installation wide.

Doesn't sound like you get to pick.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

A guy in our squadron is ordering morale patches that say "No Morale" on them since no morale patches are authorized.

  • Upvote 6

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Join the conversation

You can post now and register later. If you have an account, sign in now to post with your account.
Note: Your post will require moderator approval before it will be visible.

Guest
Reply to this topic...

×   Pasted as rich text.   Paste as plain text instead

  Only 75 emoji are allowed.

×   Your link has been automatically embedded.   Display as a link instead

×   Your previous content has been restored.   Clear editor

×   You cannot paste images directly. Upload or insert images from URL.

Sign in to follow this  

×
×
  • Create New...