Almansur Posted August 17, 2011 Share Posted August 17, 2011 Interesting demo. And it seems India will get at least 150 of them... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Prosuper Posted August 17, 2011 Share Posted August 17, 2011 It has allot of similarities to the F-22 except for the difference is that theirs fly's. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
StoleIt Posted August 17, 2011 Share Posted August 17, 2011 Guess the only part they didn't steal was the OBOGS. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ForgotPassword Posted August 17, 2011 Share Posted August 17, 2011 No internal weapons bays? ...thought that was important for the whole "stealth" thing. You don't think there's a big long one in between the two engines? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RASH Posted August 17, 2011 Share Posted August 17, 2011 You don't think there's a big long one in between the two engines? STS Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Almansur Posted August 17, 2011 Author Share Posted August 17, 2011 (edited) You don't think there's a big long one in between the two engines? There are two between those engines. The bird is bigger than a Raptor... and is also "pre-navalized" in structure. Look at that gear! Edited August 17, 2011 by Almansur Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TrainerModel Posted August 18, 2011 Share Posted August 18, 2011 It's cool, we'll slap some Stingers on a Pred... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Majestik Møøse Posted August 18, 2011 Share Posted August 18, 2011 Top rated comment on YouTube: "This must be the next aircraft of the Hellenic Air Force!With this aircraft we will ###### the turks!Greetings to our orthodox brothers in Russia!!!!!!!" No wonder the Greeks are out of money. Much too worried about new and expensive ways to ###### Turks. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ram Posted August 18, 2011 Share Posted August 18, 2011 Avionics, not airshow demos. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ForgotPassword Posted August 18, 2011 Share Posted August 18, 2011 How is this thing going to be IR stealth with those honking unadulterated nozzles on the rear? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Almansur Posted August 18, 2011 Author Share Posted August 18, 2011 How is this thing going to be IR stealth with those honking unadulterated nozzles on the rear? These are prototypes with interim engines. They are saying that they will change a bit on the production model, we'll see. However they claim that the bird will be "less stealthy than the F-22 but more maneuverable"... whatever that means. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Prosuper Posted August 18, 2011 Share Posted August 18, 2011 I've shared a few steins of malt beverage with some Luftwaffe MIG 29 mx troops and they never had anything nice to say either in German or English about Russian engine technology. Very fast, lots of power but very short life span. I hope the Indians have good luck with customer service with the Russians, its like buying a printer, great price until you have to buy toner cartridges. I wonder with the Russian design philosophy if it is even economically viable for them to develop a complex vectored exhaust nozzle for increased maneuverability, I bet it has a LOX system. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ForgotPassword Posted August 18, 2011 Share Posted August 18, 2011 These are prototypes with interim engines. They are saying that they will change a bit on the production model, we'll see. However they claim that the bird will be "less stealthy than the F-22 but more maneuverable"... whatever that means. Did the demo have the thrust vectoring nozzles? I couldn't tell. I know they have had them in a tech demo before. If they weren't on this demo, why not? Oddly, if I remember, their tech demo thrust vectoring nozzles were visually the same, no cloaking attempts like you see on other stealth engines. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
StoleIt Posted August 18, 2011 Share Posted August 18, 2011 Interesting how the leading edge slats seem to also include the portion just in front of the engine intakes. Those things look big enough to be considered control surfaces rather than slats IMO. Did the demo have the thrust vectoring nozzles? I couldn't tell. I know they have had them in a tech demo before. If they weren't on this demo, why not? Oddly, if I remember, their tech demo thrust vectoring nozzles were visually the same, no cloaking attempts like you see on other stealth engines. I'd say those are the 3D vectoring engines. Just looking at the picture the bottom engine nozzle seems to be pointing down-ish while the top one is straight. Interesting to see the Russians are getting away from the V type setup they had a hard on with the in the Su's. Example: ^Su-30MKM Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Almansur Posted August 18, 2011 Author Share Posted August 18, 2011 Interesting how the leading edge slats seem to also include the portion just in front of the engine intakes. Those things look big enough to be considered control surfaces rather than slats IMO. They're calling those "Leading Edge Vortex Controller (LEVCON)". Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Masshole Posted August 18, 2011 Share Posted August 18, 2011 These are prototypes with interim engines. They are saying that they will change a bit on the production model, we'll see. However they claim that the bird will be "less stealthy than the F-22 but more maneuverable"... whatever that means. So if it ever came to it, they are planning on engaging a Raptor in a dogfight? That kind of sounds like a failure in design. "Less stealthy" leads me to believe our Raptors are going to find them first.* *If the Raptors ever fly again Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
StoleIt Posted August 18, 2011 Share Posted August 18, 2011 They're calling those "Leading Edge Vortex Controller (LEVCON)". Good to know. So are they considering it more of a control surface or some engineering trick to keep air going to the intake during crazy AOA maneuvers (cobra, etc)? So if it ever came to it, they are planning on engaging a Raptor in a dogfight? That kind of sounds like a failure in design. "Less stealthy" leads me to believe our Raptors are going to find them first. Well how would two super stealthy fighters end up fighting? Wouldn't it have to be WVR BFM? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Masshole Posted August 18, 2011 Share Posted August 18, 2011 Well how would two super stealthy fighters end up fighting? Wouldn't it have to be WVR BFM? That is exactly what I wonder. Why do we care if it is slightly more maneuverable? If the T-50 is "less stealthy," then advantage 'Merica. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ClearedHot Posted August 18, 2011 Share Posted August 18, 2011 That is exactly what I wonder. Why do we care if it is slightly more maneuverable? If the T-50 is "less stealthy," then advantage 'Merica. Because things don't always work out like you think they will...kind of like when they designed the F-4 and did not put a gun on it because all future airwars were going to be BVR faceshots (sts). Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ThreeHoler Posted August 18, 2011 Share Posted August 18, 2011 For those who haven't read it yet, the Rand study "Air Combat Past Present and Future" is rather interesting. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JarheadBoom Posted August 22, 2011 Share Posted August 22, 2011 Whoops... T-50 aborts takeoff at Moscow airshow. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Napoleon_Tanerite Posted August 23, 2011 Share Posted August 23, 2011 Interesting how the leading edge slats seem to also include the portion just in front of the engine intakes. Those things look big enough to be considered control surfaces rather than slats IMO. Watch the video. You can see them moving in a way that corresponds with the direction the nose moves. I'd venture to say they function more like canards than anything else. I know they're all the rage on a lot of new-fangled fighters (Rafale, Eurofighter, JAS-39). To me this looks a LOT like an Su-37 and a YF-23 had an abomination of a child. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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