Steve Davies Posted March 24, 2011 Share Posted March 24, 2011 Can't find the original thread using either the SF or Google Search Site... ...but the outcome of the Ohio State flyby has been released (although the investigation is still ongoing, apparently). Pilot has relinquished his wings in exchange for honourable discharge. Non-AF Times linky: Press-Citizen Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
OverTQ Posted March 24, 2011 Share Posted March 24, 2011 According to the investigation, the highest elevation of the stadium is at the northwest corner of the press box, which is 160 feet above ground level. Cedar Rapids Approach Control verified that the aircraft cleared the scoreboard, which is 118 feet above ground level by 58 feet and were 16 feet above the press box, which put them at 176 feet above ground level. That is well below the minimum 1,000 foot standard. Note to self, turn off Mode C. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Flare Posted March 24, 2011 Share Posted March 24, 2011 More like note to self, turn off tapes. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
matmacwc Posted March 24, 2011 Share Posted March 24, 2011 (edited) The T-38C MDP told on em as well. And where did that damn thread go of all the videos? Some mod deleted that Enron style. Edited March 24, 2011 by matmacwc Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HuggyU2 Posted March 24, 2011 Share Posted March 24, 2011 More like note to self, turn off tapes. More like "The climate has changed... don't do low flyovers". Steve, "Iowa" State. I know that Ohio and Iowa are probably the same place to a Brit. Kind of like Ireland and Northern Ireland to many Yanks. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
alwyn2d Posted March 24, 2011 Share Posted March 24, 2011 (edited) I saw the wings coming off but not the approx $12K fine. Since the FAA had tapes on his airspeed and altitude, will he possibly receive a FAA violation? That may just be a commercial airline killer for him if he wishes to go that route. Good Officer and Pilot, bad decision and got Caught. Lights, action, CAMERA. Edited March 24, 2011 by alwyn2d Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hacker Posted March 24, 2011 Share Posted March 24, 2011 I saw the wings coming off but not the approx $12K fine. How'd you figure that math? As part of a negotiated agreement with the Air Force, he forfeited $3,518 pay for two months Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CHS17 Posted March 24, 2011 Share Posted March 24, 2011 Steve, "Iowa" State. I know that Ohio and Iowa are probably the same place to a Brit. Kind of like Ireland and Northern Ireland to many Yanks. Actually you are both kinda right. The game was Ohio State at University of Iowa. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
alwyn2d Posted March 24, 2011 Share Posted March 24, 2011 (edited) How'd you figure that math? Just goes to show you, you can't always believe in what's printed in newspapers. They stated 2 months of Major pay. Anyway, he could have used the money for Graduate school. Edited March 25, 2011 by alwyn2d Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Herk Driver Posted March 24, 2011 Share Posted March 24, 2011 (edited) Just goes to show you, you can't always believe in what's printed in newspapers. They stated 2 months of Major pay. Anyway, he can use the money for Graduate school. 2 months forfeiture of Major's pay through an Art 15 is not possible. Maximum permissable punishment for an officer depends on the rank of the Commander imposing punishment. 1) General Officer or General Court-Martial Convening Authority and you are an officer: Forfeiture of one-half month's pay for two months, 60 days restriction, 30 days arrest in quarters and a reprimand. 2) Colonel and you are an officer: 30 days restriction and a reprimand. Edited March 24, 2011 by Herk Driver Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
theat6bisasham Posted March 25, 2011 Share Posted March 25, 2011 (edited) 16 feet above the press box? Glad he got canned. I can't believe we FINALLY did something that is akin to punishment. That guy was the next Bud Holland.....big difference between "guys lets dip a little lower than usuall"....and "lets go down and try and hit the stadium while off altitude nine-hundred-and-eighty-four feet".. Flame away - but it's true....he was going to get someone killed - plus if he was legit, he would have just fessed up - but the reports say he LIED to the investigators. Clear cut BS on his part. Should have came home, gone to the boss and said "I F'd up boss" and taken his punishment. It's his own fault now what happened... Edited March 25, 2011 by theat6bisasham 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HuggyU2 Posted March 25, 2011 Share Posted March 25, 2011 16 feet above the press box? Just to be clear, he didn't fly over the press box. He flew down the center of the field, and the press box was to his side. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HU&W Posted March 25, 2011 Share Posted March 25, 2011 Just to be clear, he didn't fly over the press box. He flew down the center of the field, and the press box was to his side. Potentially right under his wingmen, esp if a breakout was required. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
busdriver Posted March 25, 2011 Share Posted March 25, 2011 What's the accuracy of a transponder's altitude again? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
daynightindicator Posted March 25, 2011 Share Posted March 25, 2011 another lesson learned (already stated in the other, "lost" thread) flybys are a break-even event. you can't ever win, you can only just escape without punishment. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HuggyU2 Posted March 25, 2011 Share Posted March 25, 2011 flybys are a break-even event. you can't ever win, you can only just escape without punishment. A very over-used cliche. I've led dozens of flyovers. And I've done a lot better than "break even". Many perks have come with doing them. Some of them good, some of them fantastic. Some of them were personal satisfaction, like leading Missing Man flyover for guys I knew. Some were "materialistic" benefits. And in each case... I was getting to fly. In a jet. In fact, I usually was The Lead. That ain't bad. In any case,... I'll be sure to double check my altitude at the "target". But I'll keep doing flyovers. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
zrooster99 Posted March 25, 2011 Share Posted March 25, 2011 "lets go down and try and hit the stadium while off altitude nine-hundred-and-eighty-four feet".. Not defending him, but 16' above pressbox elevation does not = 16' AGL. So he wasn't 984' low. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Shiner Posted March 25, 2011 Share Posted March 25, 2011 I want to believe so badly that losing your wings AND getting discharged over this is justified, even as an effort to make people pucker up before they think to execute airshows/public displays below published guidance. I just can't say that it is warranted, though, especially the discharge. A huge fit over something negligible in the grand scheme considering worse shit happens daily. Who knows though, after all the ass-pain this guy has been through, I am sure he was happy to get a free pass out of his ADSC. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
flynhigh Posted March 25, 2011 Share Posted March 25, 2011 (edited) More like "The climate has changed... don't do low flyovers". Steve, "Iowa" State. I know that Ohio and Iowa are probably the same place to a Brit. Kind of like Ireland and Northern Ireland to many Yanks. Happened in the state of Iowa, but not Iowa State. University of Iowa (Kinnick Stadium). Sorry, couldn't resist. Edited March 25, 2011 by flynhigh Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Herk Driver Posted March 25, 2011 Share Posted March 25, 2011 Not defending him, but 16' above pressbox elevation does not = 16' AGL. So he wasn't 984' low. Right and wrong... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HeloDude Posted March 25, 2011 Share Posted March 25, 2011 I want to believe so badly that losing your wings AND getting discharged over this is justified, even as an effort to make people pucker up before they think to execute airshows/public displays below published guidance. I just can't say that it is warranted, though, especially the discharge. A huge fit over something negligible in the grand scheme considering worse shit happens daily. Who knows though, after all the ass-pain this guy has been through, I am sure he was happy to get a free pass out of his ADSC. You must have not read the article: ...and he will separate from the Air Force of his own accord AFT also ran the story saying that the guy was already planning to retire, so he is not getting 'discharged' under the classical sense. He is also not getting a 'free pass' out of his ADSC--don't know where you came up with that one. As for nature of the incident, he needed to be disciplined and I'm sure the punishment could have been much more severe. I'm not a lawyer, and correct me if I'm wrong...but you always have the right to refuse a CC's Article 15 and go before a Court Martial. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hacker Posted March 25, 2011 Share Posted March 25, 2011 Flame away - but it's true....he was going to get someone killed - plus if he was legit, he would have just fessed up - but the reports say he LIED to the investigators. Clear cut BS on his part. Should have came home, gone to the boss and said "I F'd up boss" and taken his punishment. It's his own fault now what happened... I'll simply reply this way: - If you know Maj Kopacek and believe this, then call him and get his side of what occurred. - If you don't know him, then you are seriously mis-assessing him as an individual based on a very small sliver of info you've been given. - NJP cases rarely tell the "true" story...especially for a guy who was days away from separating from the AF (and the AF knew they didn't have a career to wreck, yet still had a message to send to the rank-and-file) BL: There's a lot about this story that you don't know, and your "assessment" of the situation reflects this. It's not any of my business to discuss those details, but it's important to know that this punishment was more for the benefit of the "Rest of the AF" than it was punishing Kopacek's actions. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Danakonda Posted March 25, 2011 Share Posted March 25, 2011 Crucify them if you want to but these guy were good guys! I trained/flew with many of them and I know they are great pilots. Everyone has made terrible decisions and had regrets for what they have done. That doesn't excuse the fact that they served as fighter pilot during a hostile time and caused harm to the enemy when we were counting on them. War has many different facets they all have a part. appreciate them. -Danakonda 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BQZip01 Posted March 25, 2011 Share Posted March 25, 2011 Not defending him, but 16' above pressbox elevation does not = 16' AGL. So he wasn't 984' low. Swing and a miss. You are supposed to be 1000 feet above the nearest obstacle. If he was 16 feet above the press box, he was 984 feet lower than he should have been. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HuggyU2 Posted March 25, 2011 Share Posted March 25, 2011 You are supposed to be 1000 feet above the nearest obstacle. If he was 16 feet above the press box, he was 984 feet lower than he should have been. To continue to pick nits,... you must be 1000' above the highest obstacle within a 2000' horizontal radius. The press box was more than likely not the highest obstacle within 2000'. The stadium lights probably were. If so, he was more than 984' too low. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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