Academy (USAFA) Flying Assignment

[WeMeantWell]

How hard is it for a pilot/rated officer (with 96 gate months met and 2 masters degrees) to get an assignment to the Academy? is it easier as an academic instuctor? or flight instructor? is it possible to do both?

Will volunteering for some bad assignment, allow me to get there afterwards?

Thanks in advance.

[flyguy2181]

I know that there were assignments to USAFA in the last VML cycle. The assignments were to the OSS squadron and they will put you where they need you. I do not know if you do any teaching or other side jobs while you are there. From my understanding, it is a career killer (if you care...because otherwise you live in CS w/ a 9-5 flying job)

[afnav]

My boss took a job at USAFA as a flight instructor. It didn't seem to hurt him, but he's topped out as a graduated squadron commander (ASBC squadron that shut down) at O5.

I'll ask him when I see him and post it here.

[Zepplin559]

You can go fly the Twin Otter for the jump team there, I have a buddy in that squadron. Pretty sure you have to have a connection to get that job, though.

[schokie]

I know of two guys from my last squadron that went there to be glider IPs. One was a junior Capt, 4FL type. He went there about 3 years ago. The other was a mid-level major IP who just left for this assignment. I'm not sure what sort of connections either one had to use to get the assignment. If you're interested I can ask them for more info.

[WeMeantWell]

Thanks for the replies, I think I would be happy with any job there; career aspirations have taken a back seat to 2 little girls now in my life.

I wish the AF would have an easily-searchable job availability list. I always hear about people getting great jobs to different places, but there does not seem to be a way to find out about them; unless you know of someone that went to do them. AMS is horribly inadequate.

[HeloDude]

I wish the AF would have an easily-searchable job availability list. I always hear about people getting great jobs to different places, but there does not seem to be a way to find out about them; unless you know of someone that went to do them. AMS is horribly inadequate.

Biggest understatement of the last 69 years. The Air Force flat out sucks at the assignment process. They offer you phone numbers to your functional....who never answers the phone. They offer you his email address...but he'll rarely email you back. The only way you can usually talk to your functional is through your CC (I know that's the way the AF wants it)...and even then, you rarely find out about those special hidden good deals.

All I can say, is that the Air Force, especially among the flying community, is a good ol' boys club (boys meaning guys and girls). If you've got an 'in' with certain people, you get the hook up. If your commander likes you/wants to help you and he's got an 'in', you get a hook up. That's about how it works. The ADP in my opinion is fairly useless.

[Guest alfakilo]

All I can say, is that the Air Force, especially among the flying community, is a good ol' boys club (boys meaning guys and girls). If you've got an 'in' with certain people, you get the hook up. If your commander likes you/wants to help you and he's got an 'in', you get a hook up. That's about how it works.

I retired twenty years ago, and things may have changed...but I was a firm believer in helping the system along as much as I could. I figured that the AF wasn't probably going to know what I wanted unless I told it...and the Dream Sheet (or whatever it's called today) wasn't it.

There used to be an office in the basement of MPC where a Sgt sat who put names to the requirements. Back then, I was a Tweet IP with 3 years+ on station and I wanted a fighter to the war...or anywhere else for that matter. So I flew to Randolph, found the Sgt, and told him I was his guy if anyone ever dropped out of an assignment. It worked. A month or two later, he called one Wednesday morning and asked if I could be at Luke to start F-4 training the next Monday.

No problem.

After that, I dealt directly with MPC or TAC/DP for the next 15 years. My theory was that the assignments guys were just regular folks...and they probably enjoyed putting someone where he wanted to go rather than just passing the hat. When I was going thru retirement out-processing, I ran into a guy I knew who had finished up in a really DS job. I asked him if he had tried to work that assignment...he told me that he didn't believe in trying to manipulate the system and that he allowed it to work as advertized.

And it did. The lousy job went to the guy who showed the least interest. Someone had to fill that slot...my guess is that personnel figured if this guy didn't care (as a LTC), why should they.

Don't know about today. But I do suspect this...if you don't ask, you have no business complaining.

[sputnik]

Thanks for the replies, I think I would be happy with any job there; career aspirations have taken a back seat to 2 little girls now in my life.

I wish the AF would have an easily-searchable job availability list. I always hear about people getting great jobs to different places, but there does not seem to be a way to find out about them; unless you know of someone that went to do them. AMS is horribly inadequate.

I don't know anyone who went to Twin Otter so I can't speak to that. But I know at least 3 people who've gone to gliders. Wasn't particularly hard for any of them, it's a standard AETC assignment just like any other white jets. Which means your funtional has to release you before you can go. Then again, it's a bill that has to be paid, so someone is going to fill it.

Like any other assignment, timing is everything. If there isn't one available when it's your time, or your community isn't letting anyone go to a white jet, you ain't going.

As has been mentioned, the CC has huge impact. If he/she doesn't think it's the right assignment for you it's going to be a tough sell. For most of the guys I know who went, this was the hard part. They got the 'this is a career ending move' speech, but then went anyway. One of those guys is a Sq/CC right now come to think of it. So much for career ending.

Good luck. I kind of want to do that myself.

[HuggyU2]

I was at ICAS in Vegas 3 weeks ago, and sat next to a Captain who was a full time glider IP. She had a tour in the C-17 before the glider gig, and I thinks that's all she's done.

Also, I know a guy who's been around the USAFA and AETC flying world a bit. He finished up command of the flying unit in Pueblo, and just got selected for O-6 a few months ago.

Edited December 30, 2008 by Huggyu2

[A-10 Bubba]

Bumping this back up. I'm looking for anyone I can PM about this topic (flying IFS/gliders/Jump planes) to get a little more info on what the flying/living situation is like. I'm in a similar situation as Biaspoint was, looking to step off the fast track for a bit with my young family, and I'm gathering more info on what is out there. I am not a USAFA grad, so I'm unfamiliar with how the programs work from the instructor pilot side.

Appreciate any updated input.

[craino21]

One of my buddies just got picked up to go get another masters and teach biology at USAFA. He will also be flying the Otter (supposedly all rated instructors fly the otter as well, so you keep earning flight pay and gate months). I can't speak to the actual life as he PCSs in the spring.

I know in our squadron we got an email stating that they were taking applications, he submitted his and got picked up. He's a pretty squared away dude (he was also picked up for TPS at the same time and got to choose) but if they'll let someone out of the -60 to go they'll probably let you out of anything.

[busdriver]

Gliders are primarily instructed by other cadets. The motor gliders and the Otter are flown by rated Officers, I think most of IFS is civilian instructors. In any event, you'd be living in C-Springs, not deploying and generally having a blast.

If you dig teaching, being an instructor within the dean of faculty (ie teaching academics) is pretty laid back but time intensive, there's no such thing as office hours at the zoo, if you can manage you're expected to help out whenever. If you're not a teacher type, being an AOC (essentially a mentoring commander type billet) you would be in the position of setting the model of how young grads view the leadership role, either to follow in your footsteps or to do everything exactly opposite. Bear in mind cadets tend to be very cynical. Imagine taking a bunch of very young but very bright young people and treating them like children. They will see through any and all bullshit instantly, the kind of people they respect can be seen by looking at the thread about Gen Welsh.

[Hercster]

Hey all, looking for any updated information that might be out there. A possibility in the near future and not deploying for a while and living in CO is very appealing right now. Thanks.

[sputnik]

I teach as faculty and fly as attached guy in Powered Flight. Drop me a PM

... In any event, you'd be living in C-Springs, not deploying and generally having a blast.

Completely untrue if you're a full time flyer. They deploy 100% in their AEF bucket--which is nothing different than anywhere else.

If you're faculty....you're pretty safe (except from 365s).

[raimius]

IFS is a DOSS aviation deal in Pueblo, last I heard (minimal AF slots).

Do they have motor gliders at USAFA now?

[GearMonkey]

IFS is a DOSS aviation deal in Pueblo, last I heard (minimal AF slots).

Do they have motor gliders at USAFA now?

USAFA does their own intro flight program with SR-20s. They must be special or something.

[Hercster]

PM sent.

[RTB]

USAFA does their own intro flight program with SR-20s. They must be special or something.

Intro yes, but doesn't count for IFS.

[Breckey]

It's more of a "the Air Force Academy has still has airplanes with engines on them" type of program

[sputnik]

To a degree that's true. The program is pretty similar to IFS, minus the consequences. Stated intent is to motivate cadets towards aviation.

There are also officers flying with the gliders, the Otter, and a few luckless souls at Peublo with IFS (the drive sucks)

[nrodgsxr]

To a degree that's true. The program is pretty similar to IFS, minus the consequences. Stated intent is to motivate cadets towards aviation.

There are also officers flying with the gliders, the Otter, and a few luckless souls at Peublo with IFS (the drive sucks)

luckless is hardly what I'd describe dudes stationed at AFA that get to fly for a living. The drive is about what uav guys do to operate drones at creech on a daily basis.

[sputnik]

Valid

[olevelo]

Are there any flying jobs for navs?

[Azimuth]

Are there any flying jobs for navs?

Sure, but they look like this.