JS Posted December 1, 2009 Share Posted December 1, 2009 What incident? Just wanting to be clear on what we're talking about... Just talking in general about the violent crackdown on the passive resistance to the reflective belts - the major getting arrested and sent home, the LT getting the tray ripped out of his hands (which, by the way, the above mentioned O-6 who I quoted said that never happened. In true Stalinist form, that event has been erased from history - sorry Disco_Nav), the Marines not getting served food, the airmen getting denied use of the Caddilac for not having a reflective belt on, etc. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
slacker Posted December 2, 2009 Share Posted December 2, 2009 Wait....what? A major got arrested and sent home? For what? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SuperWSO Posted December 2, 2009 Share Posted December 2, 2009 Wait....what? A major got arrested and sent home? For what? 2? I missed that nugget of info if it was mentioned previously. On what grounds was he arrested. I've only seen that for blatent violations of G.O. 1 (ie falling down drunk in Iraq.) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Napoleon_Tanerite Posted December 2, 2009 Share Posted December 2, 2009 2? I missed that nugget of info if it was mentioned previously. On what grounds was he arrested. I've only seen that for blatent violations of G.O. 1 (ie falling down drunk in Iraq.) ALLEGEDLY, he was wearing his sunglasses on his head in the chow hall, a SSgt told him to take them off his head, he said "i don't take orders from airmen" so the SSgt got a LTC (who was in PTs) to come back him up, the Maj got mouthy and he was arrested for disrespecting a superior officer... I guess respecting superiors is a one way street. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Rubber_Side_Down Posted December 2, 2009 Share Posted December 2, 2009 ALLEGEDLY, he was wearing his sunglasses on his head in the chow hall, a SSgt told him to take them off his head, he said "i don't take orders from airmen" so the SSgt got a LTC (who was in PTs) to come back him up, the Maj got mouthy and he was arrested for disrespecting a superior officer... I guess respecting superiors is a one way street. I don't understand this at all. When was the last time any of you were "corrected" by an enlisted on uniform infractions and had them do it politely/with proper respect? I'm not saying it's okay for a Maj to openly disrespect a Lt Col, but neither is it okay for a SSgt to order an officer to take his sunglasses off his head. A simple request would've done just fine. I don't mind being corrected so much as I do mind that people do it with a tone-of-voice that implies you are knowingly violating regs. "Oh, what's that, Airman Fvcknuts? I need to tuck in my PT shirt? Well, since you just saw me get up from a bench press, couldn't you just assume that I had no idea my shirt came untucked in the back?" It shouldn't be okay for anyone to throw away basic customs and courtesies. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Lockjaw25 Posted December 2, 2009 Share Posted December 2, 2009 We take care of our people...but only if they wear reflective belts. I still can't wrap my brain around denying food and or bathrooms without a reflective belt. Maybe we'll deny ammunition or weapons next. Or aircraft. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pawnman Posted December 3, 2009 Share Posted December 3, 2009 Wait....what? A major got arrested and sent home? For what? He didn't get sent home...he was part of a terminally-delayed jet-swap. Although the O-5 did originally file charges when the major pointed out that while, yes, he was breaking regs for having sunglasses on his head, the O-5 was also in violation for not wearing his hat outside. Charges were dropped, but said major was still fired from his job back home. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JS Posted December 3, 2009 Share Posted December 3, 2009 I don't understand this at all. When was the last time any of you were "corrected" by an enlisted on uniform infractions and had them do it politely/with proper respect? I'm not saying it's okay for a Maj to openly disrespect a Lt Col, but neither is it okay for a SSgt to order an officer to take his sunglasses off his head. A simple request would've done just fine. I don't mind being corrected so much as I do mind that people do it with a tone-of-voice that implies you are knowingly violating regs. "Oh, what's that, Airman Fvcknuts? I need to tuck in my PT shirt? Well, since you just saw me get up from a bench press, couldn't you just assume that I had no idea my shirt came untucked in the back?" It shouldn't be okay for anyone to throw away basic customs and courtesies. There are three sides to every story. The O-6 who was involved and who told me the story said that the Major was asked nicely (4 times) to correct his sunglasses. He caught an attitude with the SSGt and then the LtCol, he refused to show give either of them his ID card, and eventually the cops were called. The version I heard was that he was "sent home," but I assume that is what they say about everyone who get into a little trouble. I am no defender of the shoe clerks, but if a first sergeant comes up to me, which happened to me a few weeks ago, and says (while I am in PT gear and he has no idea what rank I am) "Sir, can you please take your sunglasses off your head?" You really don't have much recourse besides the fact that you are wrong, he is right, and he is being professional just like he was told to be. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GearMonkey Posted December 4, 2009 Share Posted December 4, 2009 Does the OTBH Sup prohibit wearing sunglasses indoors? I took a quick look at the parent AFI and it doesn't seem to mention this. Sorry if this has been covered before. Needless to say most of the search results are from the last few replys to this topic. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JarheadBoom Posted December 4, 2009 Share Posted December 4, 2009 Does the OTBH Sup prohibit wearing sunglasses indoors? I took a quick look at the parent AFI and it doesn't seem to mention this. Sorry if this has been covered before. Needless to say most of the search results are from the last few replys to this topic. Pretty sure it clearly states that sunglasses will either be worn correctly (on your face and over your eyes), or carried in your hand. NOT pushed up on your head, not hanging from Croakies/straps, not dangling from the main zipper or pockets of your zoombag, etc. I know they stressed it pretty hard during the ghey in-processing brief the last time I passed through that hellhole... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
zrooster99 Posted December 4, 2009 Share Posted December 4, 2009 Does the OTBH Sup prohibit wearing sunglasses indoors? I took a quick look at the parent AFI and it doesn't seem to mention this. If you're asking if it's prohibited to wear them over your eyes like you normally would outside in the sun, I don't think there's any prohibition. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GearMonkey Posted December 4, 2009 Share Posted December 4, 2009 If you're asking if it's prohibited to wear them over your eyes like you normally would outside in the sun, I don't think there's any prohibition. Yes, I meant over the eyes. I plan to continue wearing them pushed up on my head at the Grab and Go and other quick stops. If I get called out I'll just put them back over my eyes so my hands are still free for carrying stuff and other helpful purposes. The DDs should love that! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
chim richalds Posted December 4, 2009 Share Posted December 4, 2009 The real problem isn't respect or Amn ordering officers, it's the culture we promote that makes people give a shit about any of this. Push Back! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Herk Driver Posted December 4, 2009 Share Posted December 4, 2009 Pretty sure it clearly states that sunglasses will either be worn correctly (on your face and over your eyes), or carried in your hand. NOT pushed up on your head, not hanging from Croakies/straps, not dangling from the main zipper or pockets of your zoombag, etc. I know they stressed it pretty hard during the ghey in-processing brief the last time I passed through that hellhole... Actually, the AFCENT Sup allows CC's to authorize sunglasses to be worn by a strap around the neck. Not sure what the AUAB sup says and whether the AFCENT sup can actually authorize this is a whole other discussion. But, I'll take it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pawnman Posted December 5, 2009 Share Posted December 5, 2009 If you're asking if it's prohibited to wear them over your eyes like you normally would outside in the sun, I don't think there's any prohibition. There must be, because they have posted on every door "Please remove all headgear and sungless in accordance with blah blah blah". Never paused long enough to actually read what they cite, but I imagine it's one more addition to the AUAB uniform reg. I'm probably repeating myself, but I completely fail to see how having a supplemental regulation for a deployed location that is thicker than the damned parent reg is in any way, shape, or form helping to generate sorties, improve morale, or have any kind of positive effect whatsoever on the mission. New one I got today was that a new style of shoe has been banned..."finger" shoes? I'd never even heard of them. They did take the time to point out that "athletic shoes" are the "primary shoes to be worn with PT gear" and reiterate the ban on flip-flops, sandals, Crocs, and whatever else the double-D's have put on their hit list this week. Copy, while I'm deployed, I can never relax and be off-duty. I almost wish we did those climate assessment surveys out here...I have a pretty good idea what they would say about the relationship between these kinds of rules and morale. Ah, almost forgot, and completely unrelated...so, during the Carlos Mencia/whoever else is performing show...no alcohol within the confines of Memorial Plaza. You can have your beer, or you can watch the show, but you can't do both. Apparently, having beer in the gravel is still OK...just not under the Bra itself. Actually, the AFCENT Sup allows CC's to authorize sunglasses to be worn by a strap around the neck. Not sure what the AUAB sup says and whether the AFCENT sup can actually authorize this is a whole other discussion. But, I'll take it. The AFCENT Sup also says that your PT gear is reflective enough without a belt, and we can all see how that worked out. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JarheadBoom Posted December 5, 2009 Share Posted December 5, 2009 ...I completely fail to see how having a supplemental regulation for a deployed location that is thicker than the damned parent reg is in any way, shape, or form helping to generate sorties, improve morale, or have any kind of positive effect whatsoever on the mission. I also fail to see any rational reasoning for it, and it's a failure I'm proud of. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
XL0901 Posted December 5, 2009 Share Posted December 5, 2009 (edited) New one I got today was that a new style of shoe has been banned..."finger" shoes? I'd never even heard of them. Actually saw these last time I was there (about 10 days ago) Bet that ONE dude is pissed Edit: Based on his lack of PT gear AND reflective belt I assumed he was a civilian...or a transient guy who doesn't give a shit Edited December 5, 2009 by XL0901 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
zrooster99 Posted December 5, 2009 Share Posted December 5, 2009 There must be, because they have posted on every door "Please remove all headgear and sungless in accordance with blah blah blah". Never paused long enough to actually read what they cite, but I imagine it's one more addition to the AUAB uniform reg. I'm probably repeating myself, but I completely fail to see how having a supplemental regulation for a deployed location that is thicker than the damned parent reg is in any way, shape, or form helping to generate sorties, improve morale, or have any kind of positive effect whatsoever on the mission. OK. Might be an OTBH specific thing, then. I've been doing it for years (for short distances) when I have my hands full. Fortunately, I've only had a couple 1 or 2 night RONs at the Deid so far. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Herk Driver Posted December 5, 2009 Share Posted December 5, 2009 The AFCENT Sup also says that your PT gear is reflective enough without a belt, and we can all see how that worked out. Speak only for AUAB on that one. Some AOR locations actually follow that rule; the one I'm currently at happens to not require a reflective belt anywhere other than the flightline. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
czecksikhs Posted December 5, 2009 Share Posted December 5, 2009 I was walking to the chow hall at ASAB tonight in PT shirt, shorts, and black knit watch cap. I pass a SFS First Shirt and his lackey and the shirt says, "Can you take off your hat?" When I inquire as to why I should do such a thing, his lackey chimed in and stated that it's not authorized without a jacket or pants and, anyways, "This is a first sergeant who just gave you an order. Do you want us to call the law enforcement desk?" I laughed and kept walking until this clown demanded to see my ID card and the lackey started dialing 911. We traded ID cards, I took the hat off since I wasn't 100% sure of the reg, he realized I was an O-3 and started adding a whole lot more "Sirs" and a salute or two, and I am still in awe. I had read about these homos on-line, but I had never seen a real live specimen in the wild in its' natural habitat until now. What a sad creature! It's only a step above sock and sweaty shirt checker at the chow hall. Turns out, the USAFCENT reg has a provision that you need a pair of long johns or an outer garment before you can escalate to a knit cap. 6 years, 38 days until I can Palace Front. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JS Posted December 5, 2009 Share Posted December 5, 2009 Does the OTBH Sup prohibit wearing sunglasses indoors? I took a quick look at the parent AFI and it doesn't seem to mention this. Sorry if this has been covered before. Needless to say most of the search results are from the last few replys to this topic. 6.1.2. Eye protection: Eye glasses, sun glasses, and ballistic glasses (clear or tinted) must meet the requirements of AFI 36-2903. The glasses may be worn with or without restraining straps. At no time will sunglasses hang around the neck, be worn/positioned on top of/on back of the head, or hang from any uniform, including the PT uniform. 6.1.2.1. Sunglasses/ballistic eyewear will not be worn indoors, unless directed for safety reasons (protective eyewear is mandatory in the BPC racquetball courts). ------------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Not sure how long that has been in the reg, but guys a while back were just wearing their sunglasses inside to avoid getting bitched at, so that is why they changed it, in my opinion. One small thing that a lot of guys are doing now is just hanging their sunglasses from their ID holder (if they have those ID holders that hang from your neck). It says the sunglasses can't hang from your uniform, so that complies. I also found another little trick that is bound to get some attention some day. When I workout, I run my earphones underneath the collar of my t-shirt and have it drop out at my waist to go into my MP3 player. At the top of the headphone cord, there is a plastic piece that holds the right and left earphone together. When not listening to music, I can pull the headphones tight to my neck and hang my glasses from it. With a quick glance (or even a sustained look), it appears the glasses are hanging from my t-shirt and will surely elicit a response some day. Sorry, but I get bored and have to keep these ass-faces on their toes. And lord have mercy on the sole of the douche who tries to correct me on a reg that is not a reg. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Scooter14 Posted December 6, 2009 Share Posted December 6, 2009 Sorry, but I get bored and have to keep these ass-faces on their toes. And lord have mercy on the sole of the douche who tries to correct me on a reg that is not a reg. His pet fish or the bottom of his shoe? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BQZip01 Posted December 7, 2009 Share Posted December 7, 2009 (edited) 6.1.2. Eye protection: Eye glasses, sun glasses, and ballistic glasses (clear or tinted) must meet the requirements of AFI 36-2903. The glasses may be worn with or without restraining straps. At no time will sunglasses hang around the neck, be worn/positioned on top of/on back of the head, or hang from any uniform, including the PT uniform. 6.1.2.1. Sunglasses/ballistic eyewear will not be worn indoors, unless directed for safety reasons (protective eyewear is mandatory in the BPC racquetball courts). ------------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Not sure how long that has been in the reg, but guys a while back were just wearing their sunglasses inside to avoid getting bitched at, so that is why they changed it, in my opinion. One small thing that a lot of guys are doing now is just hanging their sunglasses from their ID holder (if they have those ID holders that hang from your neck). It says the sunglasses can't hang from your uniform, so that complies. I also found another little trick that is bound to get some attention some day. When I workout, I run my earphones underneath the collar of my t-shirt and have it drop out at my waist to go into my MP3 player. At the top of the headphone cord, there is a plastic piece that holds the right and left earphone together. When not listening to music, I can pull the headphones tight to my neck and hang my glasses from it. With a quick glance (or even a sustained look), it appears the glasses are hanging from my t-shirt and will surely elicit a response some day. Sorry, but I get bored and have to keep these ass-faces on their toes. And lord have mercy on the sole of the douche who tries to correct me on a reg that is not a reg. NICELY DONE!!! Keep fighting the good fight. If people are going to technically and methodically (not to mention in the most obnoxious way...) enforce the rules, we might as well be technically and methodically sitting on the edge of the rules without breaking them. Edited December 7, 2009 by BQZip01 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SuperWSO Posted December 7, 2009 Share Posted December 7, 2009 6.1.2. Eye protection: Eye glasses, sun glasses, and ballistic glasses (clear or tinted) must meet the requirements of AFI 36-2903. The glasses may be worn with or without restraining straps. At no time will sunglasses hang around the neck, be worn/positioned on top of/on back of the head, or hang from any uniform, including the PT uniform. 6.1.2.1. Sunglasses/ballistic eyewear will not be worn indoors, unless directed for safety reasons (protective eyewear is mandatory in the BPC racquetball courts). So if you can't have your glasses on indoors, but they can't be on your head, hanging from your shirt or suspended around your neck - where are they supposed to go? In your PT pockets? Oh those don't exist! Do they have an airman running a "sunglasses check" at the door of each facility? It seems like they have regulated away every conceivable option in this case. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Vertigo Posted December 7, 2009 Share Posted December 7, 2009 I was walking to the chow hall at ASAB tonight in PT shirt, shorts, and black knit watch cap. I pass a SFS First Shirt and his lackey and the shirt says, "Can you take off your hat?" When I inquire as to why I should do such a thing, his lackey chimed in and stated that it's not authorized without a jacket or pants and, anyways, "This is a first sergeant who just gave you an order. Do you want us to call the law enforcement desk?" I laughed and kept walking until this clown demanded to see my ID card and the lackey started dialing 911. We traded ID cards, I took the hat off since I wasn't 100% sure of the reg, he realized I was an O-3 and started adding a whole lot more "Sirs" and a salute or two, and I am still in awe. I had read about these homos on-line, but I had never seen a real live specimen in the wild in its' natural habitat until now. What a sad creature! It's only a step above sock and sweaty shirt checker at the chow hall. Turns out, the USAFCENT reg has a provision that you need a pair of long johns or an outer garment before you can escalate to a knit cap. 6 years, 38 days until I can Palace Front. This has been around forever with the regular uniform (ie the rule if you're going to wear a watch cap you need to also be wearing a coat/jacket with it). Makes sense to me, if it's cold enough for a watch cap why are you wearing shorts? And if it's warm enough to wear shorts why the need for a watch cap? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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