Duck

That's a good question. How are late rates taken care of in the 11F community currently? And how late are we talking? A brand new Capt is a lot different than a mid to senior dude in terms of the flying community.

I see your point brother. It all depends on Big Blue and how they manage this. I'm excited some of my friends might get a chance to go fly fighters which they deserved 8 years ago. I truly hope it works out for them. I have 100% faith in their flying ability, their work ethic and their attitude. I don't share that faith in the Air Force that put them in heavies in the first place...

Also what pool of 38 dudes are we pulling from. At my UPT base it has been damn near 100% fighters for all that "qual'd" for the past 2-3 years. I know a couple younger (2011 commission) Captains who were 38 to MC-12 but most of us are 2007-2010 commissioners either just met our majors board or meeting in the next year.

The FAIP vs MWS crossflow guys are going to be a minimum of 2 years age difference. Think about it. MWS crossflow: UPT - MWS school - 1st Duty Station (minimum 2 years TOS) - 38 spin up - IFF - B Course... FAIP: UPT - FAIP tour - 38 spin up if required- IFF - B course - ends up in a FS as a mid level Capt. You can't really compare the two.

Brabus, thanks. Exactly what I have been trying to say.

I'm not worried about anything. What I am saying is that these guys are not going to be expected to just be wingmen and learn the jet, which is the right way to do this. They are going to have to take jobs equal to their rank for the sake of "progression". My question for you all is why? Why would Big Blue do this? I can guarantee you it has nothing to do with "for the good of the pilot". Realistically, you are getting a 2d Lt Wingman in a Major/or soon to be. They aren't going to have the credibility to be the old guy in the squadron, so what is the best way Big Blue can use them? 11F required billets not requiring flying. Sure you will get your 200-300 hours, just in time to be an "experienced" dude. Then wham off to do all those second/third tier jobs/staff that would be wasted on dudes that have spent 4-6 more years in your Fighter. I am not trying to be Debbie Downer, but I would just say think critically about this. I am also not trying to discourage anyone. Hell, 4 years ago, I would have jumped on this like BQZip's mom. The right time to divert these guys from their MWS is not when they are mid-level/senior Capts (Which is where most of the dudes who went through UPT during the drawdown are now) but really within 2 years of them getting to their heavy MWS. So standard AF: too little. Too late.

If they would let these guys progress like a normal wingman without holding it against them at promotion boards, I honestly believe we could create good fighter pilots to the point that you wouldn't know they had flown anything else. My view is that the AF doesn't really need more "fighter pilots" but more 11Fs to fill billets.

I agree attitude is crucial. I just don't see Big Blue taking care of these guys at all. You also have to admit that opportunities (aka cockpits) have dwindled A LOT since the 90s. I have no doubt in my mind there are guys who could/would be successful. I doubt they get the chance.

I am a product of AMC myself. All I know is once I got put on the "path": Exec, Shop Chief, Flt/CC, ADO... My leadership raised eyebrows when I would try to get on the road, deploy, etc. I had 2 deployments that I volunteered for denied and was taken off countless business efforts, trips etc... I was barely flying a couple times a month and that was mainly with copilots who needed the work more than I did. So I definitely get the struggle. I don't really blame the player, I blame the game. Having said that, we are getting a lot of well-strated MAF dudes that are getting crushed in T-6 PIT. Not to say that being the #1/2 guy is mutually exclusive to retaining those basic flying skills learned in UPT, because some dudes come in and fly through the program. Also flying the T-38 for 96 hours in UPT doesn't necessarily correlate that you have better stick skills than a dude who didn't. We have T-38 guys come through who suck and T-1 dudes who are well above what I expect a guy coming to PIT. I say all this as a guy who was a T-38 dude back during the "Universally Assignable" days. Talking to my bros on the Fighter side... I wouldn't accept a cross-flow to the other side for anything, but then again this is my last assignment and I am getting out. TL/DR 1. AMC is not a good predictor of good pilots/future leadership. 2. Just cuz you flew the T-38 in UPT, you still may suck. 3. I would love to go fly fighters, but I don't trust the AF and wouldn't take the crossflow pill, regardless of what Blue promises. 4. I am getting out ASAFP

Bingo. As a guy with PIT IP experience I have seen plenty of AMC guys who have great records but get put on CAP because the hands just aren't there. I think it has more to do with how the MAF focuses less on flying and tactical proficiency and more on the office job aspect.

He does know that he can't just put the thing on auto-pilot right?

ITS A TRAP!

I heard since these last couple student classes coming through have been stocked full of "incredible hands of gold" (why else would they all get fighters) that they were going to let FAIPs soak up all the Buffs... Kidding. I love you FAIPs.

And why we won't let any Palace Chase regardless of how close they are to the end of their commitment!

Same. I know I am pissing off my leadership, but it just feels good knowing that at least I am showing Big Blue that my morale isn't "pretty darn good"

Also know another 11B who PCd w/ 3 yrs left... But that was 2 years ago. Man I hate the AF personnel mgt.

Once again the comments section on that article is hilarious. Everyone is an expert...

11B but no hire letter.

Same here.

I don't get it. Only asking 18 months and they disapprove. Trying to plug the ships holes with their fingers so to speak.

Did your Sq/WG recommend approve or disapprove? That's good to hear about them easing the policy on auto-disapprove anything outside a year. My OG called AFPC about a month ago and they told him they aren't seeing much of anything get approved outside of 12 months parole.

It's all cyclical. By the time you young-uns drop the AF will have screwed something else up...

Which is an excuse to get us fat kids running...

Exactly. And because SAF/PC is refusing to approve almost all Palace Chase Apps outside of 6 months, many guys I know are saying screw the Guard/Reserves, I am done with this garbage all together. If they would start being reasonable with PC approvals, guys would stay till retirement in the ARC, instead we lose them forever.

And it was my first student sortie...