Promotion and PRF Information

[Hot Sauce Hoy]

Is recent performance in the current grade most important?  For example, for Lt Col board does performance as a Major weigh a lot more than CGO performance?

[disgruntledemployee]

One other thing about strats is many commanders try to take care of many folks and thus there are a few more categories these days like x of y ACs or IPs.  Its not hard to find those gifted aviators with gifted leadership, they're often well known, a minority, and they get #1 (I'm making it sound easy, but it takes time and effort).  The rest of us I think pick a route, either a master of all things aviation and fill in enough squares to make rank or those that play the game to its fullest and fill squares, volunteer for jobs, and try to show leadership.  The irony is #1 CGO is likely weighed more than #1 AC or IP at a board.  Part of that I think is that FGO and CGO are universal across all AFSCs.

Saucy, I think that sustained/improved performance is the more weighty item.  Ever seen the #1 Lt get lost in the crowd later on as a Capt or Maj?  Petered out.  Move along, next record. 

Out

[di1630]

You guys want to get good strats and pushes in the USAF....learn outlook/excel/memo writing skills at a young age. Those $7.50 an hour secretary skills will get you further than your $3 million pilot training education. Don't crash a jet and be a good exec, you'll go places.

No kidding. I wish this were sarcasm but it's not.

[Duck]

You guys want to get good strats and pushes in the USAF....learn outlook/excel/memo writing skills at a young age. Those $7.50 an hour secretary skills will get you further than your $3 million pilot training education. Don't crash a jet and be a good exec, you'll go places.

No kidding. I wish this were sarcasm but it's not.

Man I hate to say this but I really agree. So much of making rank in the Air Force is really all about just organizing activities and programs successfully, pushing for those jobs that you know are going to be painful and are going to make you hate your life!

[TheInner]

4 hours ago, di1630 said:

You guys want to get good strats and pushes in the USAF....learn outlook/excel/memo writing skills at a young age.

The real key is developing the ability to effectively communicate, which I believe is what you are saying but in a more sarcastic fashion.  

In the flying community (at least in my corner of it) we do an exceptional job of building verbal communication skills through our brief/airborne comm/debrief but don't get exposed to any written communication skill sets unless we go to the staff.  I once had a commander spend over an hour with some of us discussing email writing.  On the surface it sounds ridiculous, especially when the commander has more tactical credibility then a handful of some of my past commanders combined but he made an effective point in saying that the world's greatest idea may never be heard if you are unable to communicate it appropriately.  

 

[di1630]

You guys want to get good strats and pushes in the USAF....learn outlook/excel/memo writing skills at a young age.

The real key is developing the ability to effectively communicate, which I believe is what you are saying but in a more sarcastic fashion.  

No sarcasm intended. I'm mainly intending for the young'ens looking to get the strats or anyone wanting the F-35/KC-46....just saying the strats, assignment pushes etc go to the guys who align themselves with the leadership.

When I was a young Capt, I remember working my butt off pulling 12 hour days, dedicating myself to flying, being a great IP etc.. Then I got moved to a paper pushing job for "broadening" and worked 1/2 as hard for 3x the results of when I was flying focused at least as far as OPR's were concerned.

Sad truth.

Now as far as communication skills....have you seems some of the ppt, memos, emails etc. that big blue loves? It's complete crap.

[ArcticGator]

Does a board recognize and appreciate "late bloomers" or people who were lost in the shuffle for periods of their career?  For example if someone goes from staff pushes of NAF to MAJCOM to HAF and command pushes in a 3-4 year period, does that improvement carry significance? 

I can appreciate steady improvement because I think we identify future leaders at too early of an age at times. 

Edited March 27, 2016 by ArcticGator

[SnapLock]

2 hours ago, ArcticGator said:

Does a board recognize and appreciate "late bloomers" or people who were lost in the shuffle for periods of their career?  For example if someone goes from NAF to MAJCOM to HAF and command pushes in a 3-4 year period, does that improvement carry significance? 

I can appreciate steady improvement because I think we identify future leaders at too early of an age at times. 

Due to the competitive nature of the AF I don't think that will matter if you are looking to be a select at your board or get selected for school later as a candidate.  It really depends though and if your senior rater is pushing for you then good things can happen.  However, a consistent record of #1 strats sprinkled with DGs and a strong senior rater push with a high DP strat are what is going to matter to a board.  There are people out there who have done well as late bloomers, but that is rare.  I'll admit I'm getting old and crusty, and can be pretty jaded, but Big Blue is going to do what it is going to do...so keep looking for people to get selected for leadership too early.  

One of the biggest things that I saw that disgusted me about this stuff in the AF was when my DO got called to do other things unexpectedly.  There was no one else left at my base that could leave their current job who had gone through school and staff to take over as DO, so they put in the best Lt Col non-school/non-staff guy.  The dude absolutely rocked it and everyone really looked up to him.  He did an outstanding job, but as soon as someone with the right "credentials" showed up he was immediately yanked out and the "credentialed" person was put in as DO.  That left a pretty bad taste in my mouth, I shouldn't have been surprised.   

[NKAWTG]

8 hours ago, ArcticGator said:

Does a board recognize and appreciate "late bloomers" or people who were lost in the shuffle for periods of their career?  For example if someone goes from staff pushes of NAF to MAJCOM to HAF and command pushes in a 3-4 year period, does that improvement carry significance? 

I can appreciate steady improvement because I think we identify future leaders at too early of an age at times. 

Your “late bloomer” will have a chance, but I wouldn’t hold your breath over it.  Consistent job performance, i.e stratification is the most important factor for the boards.  One bad rater or OPR writer won’t derail your promotion potential.  But going from having strats to no strats will cost you school slots and command opportunities. 

Stratifications are also a mix of what your strats were before and what you did during the reporting period.  Getting a strat mid-career when you didn’t have one previously is heavily weighted toward luck.  By that, I mean someone ahead of you has to PCS, or you need move into a more favorable pool.  You don’t have control of either of those situations.

Having talked some recent board members, they mentioned having the senior rater stratify beyond the typical 20% threshold was helpful.  Picking out the top of the list was easy, but past that, the records all look the same.  Having your senior rater push you as top 3^rd or half would be enough to make the cut when they promote 70 to 80% of the eligibles.  

[Hot Sauce Hoy]

On March 19, 2016 at 4:30 PM, Bender said:

How are we in a spot where a guy even wonders here? Unless there is "the rest of the story", this is a slam dunk. Almost makes think there is something you're now sharing and trying to get a half truth here.

Bendy

It would be helpful to know what a gray zone "P" PRF looks like for O-5 IPZ. I have no idea what a record at the "cut line" would look like. I don't have access to previous years PRFs. If I knew what a PRF right on the edge of the promotion line looked like (assuming all boxes checked and no big negatives) I would probably be able to better discern my chances. 

[Bode]

So a complete random question. If someone ends up with 5 strats on an OPR which may be their top one before their PRF is that a signal to leadership? I'm used to seeing one per block on an OPR. This guy's were all top 10-15 percent type all strated in different ways.

Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

[Skitzo]

Most I've ever seen has been three, and that was a major being pushed for 2BPZ. Had an ADO, Maj overall and YG strat.

Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

[ArcticGator]

Is being on an AOC staff considered similar to NAF staff?

Edited April 1, 2016 by ArcticGator

[Bender]

It would be helpful to know what a gray zone "P" PRF looks like for O-5 IPZ. I have no idea what a record at the "cut line" would look like. I don't have access to previous years PRFs. If I knew what a PRF right on the edge of the promotion line looked like (assuming all boxes checked and no big negatives) I would probably be able to better discern my chances. 

Naturally. You'll have to ask people to share them individually...although it would be in interesting topic to see people post their PRF bullets with basic demographic data (B/I/APZ, DP/P/NP, etc.) and result. I always tell people they should find a PRF early on from a mentor they respect, so they have an idea of where they're going OPR to OPR.

I have no secret repository, nor have I kept any that I've worked on (other than my own). That said, I would imagine a starting point here would be having trouble finding a stratification for each line, being forced to use third tier stratifications, or CGO stratification for the O-5 IPZ. Shrug...the actual "gray zone" generalization will change every time, but I bet it has some commonality through out.

Probably not very helpful. I'd share mine, but it's a 1 below and (I'd like to think, at least) not in the area that would shed light on your question.

Bendy

[Chuck17]

8 hours ago, ArcticGator said:

Is being on an AOC staff considered similar to NAF staff?

They're the same "level" but once you get beyond MAJCOM it's all the same in big-blues eyes. 

The RSAP (rated staff allocation process) has thrown the whole stratification of staffs on its ear to get certain staffs healthy this year for the summer VML. 618 AOC has a lot of talent coming in to the tune of graduated Sq/CCs, school guys, WOs, etc. 

Luck and timing my friends, luck and timing. Bloom where planted.

Chuck

[pawnman]

On 3/19/2016 at 4:44 PM, BFM this said:

Seen a number of IPUGs rammed through in min time, only to watch the newly minted IP go up to wing and occasionally log some IP time on the 781 to maintain currency for the next year or so, and then it's off to school. But hey, got that K prefix...check.

We're trying to do that with Striker Vista.  Take an IP in one jet, train them in a completely different jet, make them an IP inside of a year, then off to school and staff.

[pawnman]

On 3/7/2016 at 5:22 PM, Lord Ratner said:

Interesting data point I heard. Apparently all 6 school selects at Lakenheath have declined. Rumor has it a council of the elders was called to figure out how this happened... They must not read BO.net

Maybe there's still hope for me to go to school.

[pawnman]

On 3/11/2016 at 7:59 PM, Hot Sauce Hoy said:

I have good job progression and solid strats and good top 10% Maj strats at SQ and WG level, numerous FGO awards including SQ FGOY, and a SR push that strats me 1/5 IAPZ and "if I had a DP, he'd get it" with all the right pushes. My SR didn't have a DP, and I didn't get one at MLR. I feel good about being in a good position but you never really know with a "p" and what the competition is bringing to the table. 

I got promoted to major in a similar situation.  FLT/CC OTY for the OG, numerous awards, strats, and job progression.  I even did my MBA, back before AADs were masked.

I, too, had the "if I had one more DP to give".  I didn't feel bad about the P until later, when the SQ exec told us the allocation rate was 75%.  I still struggle to understand how I can be #1/24 flight commanders, #3/64 instructors in my squadron (the FTU), and be in the bottom 25% of my year group.

[Bode]

Seen a number of IPUGs rammed through in min time, only to watch the newly minted IP go up to wing and occasionally log some IP time on the 781 to maintain currency for the next year or so, and then it's off to school. But hey, got that K prefix...check.

We're trying to do that with Striker Vista.  Take an IP in one jet, train them in a completely different jet, make them an IP inside of a year, then off to school and staff.

Striker Vista?

[pawnman]

48 minutes ago, Lstcause257 said:

Striker Vista?

It's Global Strike's plan to "broaden" leadership among the bombers.  Take B-1 guys and make them BUFF guys.  Take BUFF guys and make them B-1 guys.  Take B-2 guys and...well, who knows, because most of the B-2 guys were already B-1 or BUFF guys before going to the B-2.

The problem is, they are targeting "high performing officers" in year groups that will get PRFs written next year.  Folks who have already made a name for themselves in their home communities, and now they are going to have a PRF written by a different wing, that flies different aircraft, with different priorities.

[Duck]

How would the board look at a record that has several top strats but chose to NOT put them on their prf? Would a senior leader even let you sabotage yourself like that? Does the board really dig into your records? My OPR before my board shouldn't have a strat and will be my top OPR. Crazy questions I know, just trying to figure out options.

[ArcticGator]

My SR chose to leave a # of strats off that suprised ke a bit. But once I thought about it I think it made sense. First, he cut out some repetitive ones. Once they state you are 1/7 AC's, they may feel they don't need to say you were also 2/12 AC's rift next to it.

Also, they may leave off a good strat that is maybe top 15 or 20% when trying to paint you as a consistent top 10% performer, for example. I don't really agree with that, but that may be their technique.

Maybe they are trying to paint breadth. My SR left off a good CGO strat but I am at my O-5 board so I don't know if that was the reason

I guess it all depends on what you have in your box of strats. Personally I think the more the better if they are top 20% but I am not a senior rater or board member.

However, I am pretty sure that board members are at least looking at the top and bottom lines of the rater and additional rater blocks of the OPRs. At least I hope they are.

[Herk Driver]

I have drafted several of my own and written many others and the SR changed all of them. I doubt a self destructive PRF would be signed unless the SR truly thought it accurately reflected your performance. YMMV.

[Skitzo]

Striker Vista?

It's Global Strike's plan to "broaden" leadership among the bombers.  Take B-1 guys and make them BUFF guys.  Take BUFF guys and make them B-1 guys.  Take B-2 guys and...well, who knows, because most of the B-2 guys were already B-1 or BUFF guys before going to the B-2.

The problem is, they are targeting "high performing officers" in year groups that will get PRFs written next year.  Folks who have already made a name for themselves in their home communities, and now they are going to have a PRF written by a different wing, that flies different aircraft, with different priorities.

AFSOC did this with the "Commando Reach" program a couple years ago... Results were mixed.

[PlanePhlyer]

15 hours ago, pawnman said:

I got promoted to major in a similar situation.  FLT/CC OTY for the OG, numerous awards, strats, and job progression.  I even did my MBA, back before AADs were masked.

I, too, had the "if I had one more DP to give".  I didn't feel bad about the P until later, when the SQ exec told us the allocation rate was 75%.  I still struggle to understand how I can be #1/24 flight commanders, #3/64 instructors in my squadron (the FTU), and be in the bottom 25% of my year group.

This^. 

Big blue wonders why people are leaving.   Should have planned the Christmas party bro!