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WARNING - Possible Thread Hijack - WARNING Sorry, disagree about the USAF Memorial. Looks like giant stainless steel spaghetti. I'm not knocking us having a memorial, but it should commemorate something concrete (no pun intended) like, say, the first jet to jet combat in Korea or a Vietnam Weasel mission or Linebacker mission or something. The abstract just doesn't cut it for me. It goes along with changing the uniform and AF symbol every too often. OK, situation is under control, we now return you to your regularly scheduled thread. DC Zoo is pretty good if your gonna be in Adams-Morgan with kids.

Downtown one - conveniant metro access, adjacent to all the other Smithsonian stuff. This one has the Wright flyer, Apollo 11, X-1, Douglas World Cruiser (first 'round the world flight 1924), etc. It is more cramped and, frankly, cluttered with too many tourists usually (damn them!). The one at Dulles is a u-drive (costs $12 for parking, but entrance is 'free.'), much more spacious. Starts with examples of 19 ought ought aircraft, then moves logically through time - lots of warbirds - Enola Gay, some German and Japanese stuff - fairly rare as well, and most common US WWII types, into Korea, Vietnam and beyond. The -80 707 prototype, a Concorde, SR-71, helos, a huge exhibit on aircraft engine development from the first putt-putts to the R-2800 and beyond pistons and into jets - turbo and beyond. Space gallery is pretty cool, shuttle glide test model 'Enterprise' (they fired debris at the leading edge of this one during the Columbia accident investigation), some other rockets and displays. Replica ATC tower is cool to get a good view of Dulles ops if you go to the top. Much less crowded during the trips I've been. Nothing else out there as its colocated with Dulles, however.

The Marine flag lowering ceremony is a great sight held at the Marine Barracks downtown. Have to get tickets in advance. Outdoors, hotter than Hades, however. Either Air & Space Museum - downtown or new one by Dulles Old Ebbits Grill - very DC-ish; lots of Congressional staffers (bow-chicka-bow-woo), not uncommon to see reps or senators there.

We interviewed a Reserve guy for one of our spots; his full time gig was working for a certain oil rich royalty. He says he's well into the six figures. 30 days on call, 30 days off while the other crew is on call. Can't verify the validity of his claim, but have no reason to doubt him.

United States Air Force Weapons School Comprised of 16 squadrons, the U.S. Air Force Weapons School teaches graduate-level instructor courses that provide the world's most advanced training in weapons and tactics employment to officers of the combat air forces. Every six months, the Weapons School produces approximately 80 graduates who are expert instructors on weapons, weapons system and air and space integration. They take to their respective squadrons the latest tactics, techniques and procedures for air-to-air and air-to-ground combat. The Weapons School also produces the Weapons Review magazine, the CAF's premier professional tactics publication. The Weapons School began in the late 1940s as the USAF Gunnery School. This school was designed to teach air combat lessons learned and sought to improve pilots' aerial gunnery skills in the P-51, F-80, F-84 and F-86. In 1953, the school was renamed the USAF Fighter Weapons School and in 1992, with the advent of Air Combat Command and inclusion of bomber courses, the school changed its name to the USAF Weapons School. Today, the Weapons School offers weapons instructor courses for the A-10 Thunderbolt II, the B-1B Lancer, the B-2 Spirit, the B-52 Stratofortress, the EC-130H Compass Call, the KC-135 StratoTanker, the C-17 Globemaster II, the C-130 Hercules, the F-15C Eagle, the F-15E Strike Eagle, the F-16 Fighting Falcon, the HH-60G Pave Hawk, the RC-135/W Rivet Joint, intelligence instructors, space instructors, senior directors serving on the E-3 AWACS, E-8 JSTARS and ground control and reporting centers and special operations forces crewmembers aboard the AC-130, and MC-130. https://www.nellis.af.mil/library/factsheet...eet.asp?id=4098

"Around the World in 175 Days" by C.V. Glines In 1924, the US Army Air Service sent four Douglas World Cruisers (two place, open cockpit, used wheels and floats) and 8 men on a circumnavigation of the world. In a time of extremely tight budgets and threats of losing the air capability, the Air Service saw the flight as a PR dream and a way to wake up Congress. Using pre-staged supply dumps, set up in unique circumstances by other junior officers who got it done no matter what, these airmen battled storms, fog, heat, ice, and non-stop PR at each stop to get the mission flown. They lost their commander, a major, soon after setting out, when he wiped out on an Alaskan mountain top - both he and his mechanic survived and after a 10 survival story of their own, were rescued. After each day of flying, these guys had to perform their own post-flight maintainance - wiping down the fabric aircraft, oiling/gassing the Liberty engines, re-tensioning the bracing wires, varnishing the dope fabric, etc, for an average of about 6 hours after each flight. At an average of 75mph, these guys got it done and probably saved the US Army's aviation branch. Two DWCs made it all the way, one is now in the Smithsonian, the other is in the Santa Monica Museum of Aviation (closed the last time I checked). These were some iron aviators.

Way cool. Medal of Honor is one of those tough ones to earn...................... THORSNESS, LEO K. Rank and organization: Lieutenant Colonel (then Maj.), U.S. Air Force, 357th Tactical Fighter Squadron. Place and date: Over North Vietnam, 19 April 1967. Entered service at: Walnut Grove, Minn. Born: 14 February 1932, Walnut Grove, Minn. Citation: For conspicuous gallantry and intrepidity in action at the risk of his life above and beyond the call of duty. As pilot of an F-105 aircraft, Lt. Col. Thorsness was on a surface-to-air missile suppression mission over North Vietnam. Lt. Col. Thorsness and his wingman attacked and silenced a surface-to-air missile site with air-to-ground missiles, and then destroyed a second surface-to-air missile site with bombs. In the attack on the second missile site, Lt. Col. Thorsness' wingman was shot down by intensive antiaircraft fire, and the 2 crewmembers abandoned their aircraft. Lt. Col. Thorsness circled the descending parachutes to keep the crewmembers in sight and relay their position to the Search and Rescue Center. During this maneuver, a MIG-17 was sighted in the area. Lt. Col. Thorsness immediately initiated an attack and destroyed the MIG. Because his aircraft was low on fuel, he was forced to depart the area in search of a tanker. Upon being advised that 2 helicopters were orbiting over the downed crew's position and that there were hostile MlGs in the area posing a serious threat to the helicopters, Lt. Col. Thorsness, despite his low fuel condition, decided to return alone through a hostile environment of surface-to-air missile and antiaircraft defenses to the downed crew's position. As he approached the area, he spotted 4 MIG-17 aircraft and immediately initiated an attack on the MlGs, damaging 1 and driving the others away from the rescue scene. When it became apparent that an aircraft in the area was critically low on fuel and the crew would have to abandon the aircraft unless they could reach a tanker, Lt. Col. Thorsness, although critically short on fuel himself, helped to avert further possible loss of life and a friendly aircraft by recovering at a forward operating base, thus allowing the aircraft in emergency fuel condition to refuel safely. Lt. Col. Thorsness' extraordinary heroism, self_sacrifice, and personal bravery involving conspicuous risk of life were in the highest traditions of the military service, and have reflected great credit upon himself and the U.S. Air Force.

Steve, Your post kinda pointed out what I was trying to say in my first attempt on this thread. I believe the RAF has essentially turned inward towards its past glories as it continues to shrink to miniscule size. I'm not knocking the current Brit bros, just that there aren't that many anymore. I see some of the same trends regarding the USAF, but I believe that we continue to look forward - for a variety of reasons - vice always looking back.

We're on the same side of this issue. I have spoken to Gen Olds and some other still living USAF warriors from our past. I've even written about a fair number of ones not so famous, but just as important for our combat heritage. 1924 'Round the World Flight' - first successful circumnavigation of the globe - great story about iron men in fabric airplanes as an example. Small group of Lts told by the boss to 'make it happen.' And they did.

7. And I've never spoken to Frank Luke, Dick Bong, Tommy McGuire, Harry Thyng, Robin Risner, or Leo Thorsness, but I'd bet a fair few of the USAF ops side know who they were. I'd hope so.

Au contraire; I'd say we are very aware of the warrior part of the USAF - see the Robin Olds thread - but the institutional BS is held in contempt. Perhaps as a result of the coup separating the USAF from the shackles of the Army (how's that for descriptive!), then the constant remaking of the 'image' depending on who's got the biggest 'stick,' i.e. LeMay, He who must not be named, Fogleman, etc, then there is no long established heritage to honor. Flying and fighting seems to work ok as a history.

My eyes! Aggh, my eyes!

In most ways, this is really a good thing. We don't become so hide-bound that we have to do things because 'that's the way we always do it.' Drawback is we keep having to shell out bucks for Marine wannabe uniforms or Army lite PT gear.

Re command, both pilots and WSOs can, depending on the MWS, of course, command if you get the opportunity and are good enough; it's not just a game for pilots. However, this is one of those questions will you second guess yourself in five years? In the interest of full disclosure, I'm neither pilot or WSO so you may opt to cease reading as of now, but given a choice, I'd recommend pilot - both in and out of the USAF, it gives you, generally, more options. Finally, if you go pilot and, God forbid, don't make it, would you have the option to reattack as a WSO considering the age? Good luck.

Winner!

My sentence would have ended at this. (SAC survivor, so I can say it...............) However, regarding the 'Creed,' I am an American airman On active duty, I will not pose nude Regarding endless queep and AEFs to the 'Stan I will not cop a a 'tude

Please don't ever include the 'only' part in describing your service. Unless you are an Air Force Band conductor..........

My spanking is acknowledged, we now return to your regularly scheduled posts........

Mambo, Nice use of the language of we farm animals............. My concern, if unfounded so be it, was I was just sayin'.........

Ok, only a controller, err, ABM, here, so I don't know my place, but might I suggest you ixnay on caps and lims in open source? Believe it or not, there are countries out there with real Air Forces that might like to know all the beeps and squeeks of what works and what doesn't. Or is that just some old SAC security neurons suddenly and randomly firing?

Since they announced a merger, it's probably a moot point.

The 'cool' intel briefs during mission planning.....

Concur. I had to do this while here in DC. Took a tux shirt, some gnarly fabric from a fabric store, went to the tailor who previously could not get his head around the concept, told him "cut this out, replace with this." Viola! One party shirt.

From horse's.......mouths (yeah, that's the word) who have sat on active and reserve promo boards (unknown re ANG), some universal truths........... Almost a Letterman Top 10 list for advancement 1. Command 2. PME (in residence if at ALL possible, especially ACSC/equivalent and AWC/equivalent. Although it's been done and guys have done well without it, not going to school in residence is the first major roadsign that your career has just stalled. Recoverable, but you have to Avis it and try harder. Getting command is really hard without in-residence PME.) 3. Advanced degree 3a. Weapons School., etc, is way good. 4. High stratification in OPRs/PRF. "My #1 of XX" is your goal. If that, then a DP is a given. 5. Medal commensurate with your grade and one in there within the last 12-18 months. Combat decorations score better than "I was there" medals. 6. Deployment (s) documented in your records. 7. Records are up to date/nothing missing. Make sure all your OPRs/awards are in there. 8. And although I disagree with this one in particular, exec jobs are a fast track way to accomplish #s 2 & 4. Look at the GO bios and see how many of them did it. Like promotes like. 9. Get all the above done ASAP, then you don't have to worry about it at the last minute. WG/CCs and above don't really care that you are "enrolled" in ACSC at the time your board meets. They want to see it done. 10. Enjoy the ride; if being CSAF is not your be all and end all, then relax a little. Many, many before you have made Maj and even Lt Col and can look at themselves in the mirror just fine without pinging about most of the above. For most promotion boards, each panel member takes about 15-30 SECONDS in the first cut to winnow out the dross or determine the top candidates The former go in the big "thanks for playing" pile and the second go in the "no brainer, promote now" pile. The middle ground is where they will take a little more time to look at records.