Big tankers

Breaking Defense

USAF should buy newly designed air refuelers to meet Chin...

Although there’s a “temptation” to keep buying KC-46s, a plan to procure 75 more of the Boeing-made tankers should be an “upper limit” followed by a new, longer range tanker, the Hudson Institute’s Ti

Finish and fix the 46, interim big tanker 787 tanker while developing the BWB.

Needs a cargo door but a looker, especially as a Guard tail.

Yeah, how many would actually stay after getting that type rating?

27 minutes ago, FourFans said:

Yeah, how many would actually stay after getting that type rating?

All of them for at least 10 years...

1 hour ago, FourFans said:

Yeah, how many would actually stay after getting that type rating?

They would still go thru the full training program at airline X even with the type but it might make them more competitive to the hiring algorithm…

The 787 tanker is a long shot but just for the interwebs. The A-330 MRTT NEO would be my recommendation (interim bigger wing tanker) but politics would likely be insurmountable.

Still it brings up a good question, should the AF become more strategically oriented? That is focus on long range strike and effects, coming from a distance to mitigate the proliferation of short to mid range fires? I’m not saying the whole of the AF should be bombers and big fighters but part of the force design.

As I recall in the original KC-X proposal Boeing offered the 777F with a boom. It crushed in every possible category and the AF came back with, "its to big and won't fit in our existing hangers (707)". So then we had the debacle that was the 330 vs 767.

Now AF wants the plane that won't fit in thier existing hangers.... sigh.

2 hours ago, RegularJoe said:

As I recall in the original KC-X proposal Boeing offered the 777F with a boom. It crushed in every possible category and the AF came back with, "its to big and won't fit in our existing hangers (707)". So then we had the debacle that was the 330 vs 767.

Now AF wants the plane that won't fit in thier existing hangers.... sigh.

Yup, heard the same. Things change, different operational environment now so time to adjust.

The report pushes hard (sts) for the Blended Wing Body (BWB) and Collaborative Tanker Aircraft (CTA), as the long term solution I think they are right, short term a new paradigm is needed though.

If king for a day, if the KC-390 and A-330 MRTT+ could be acquired with an appropriate last tranche of KC-46s, I’d spin down the -135 fleet for this new iron while BWB design which would double as NGAL was spinning up.

Those two designs somehow being acquired in compliance with the Made in America laws/policies.

It’s a two fold problem, two fold approach. Big tankers to launch from relatively safe hardened bases with 1000+ NM set back from operational areas, AR to the next asset who will then AR the strikers assuming more risk going modestly into the A2AD bubble. The BWB will likely simplify this paradigm a bit (reduced signature, better range/offload, better organic defense) but we gotta crawl before we run.

5 hours ago, Clark Griswold said:

If king for a day, if the KC-390 and A-330 MRTT+ could be acquired with an appropriate last tranche of KC-46s...

KISS Principle.

Axe the -330, keep the KC-46, drop any/all FAA certification.

Tankers have a strategic mission. Keep that in mind.

30 minutes ago, Sua Sponte said:

Tankers have a strategic mission. Keep that in mind.

True, the need for a very large fuel load for either offload and/or loiter while ideally the situation cools down is highly desirable

AI Google says loiter for 4 hours at 1000 NM from launch and offload 110k, that’s time to decide whether to execute Wing Attack Plan R or not. #strangelove

Tactical tanker is KC-390, Standard tanker is KC-46, Strategic Tanker is KC-45 (A-330 MRTT+).

Build it in the Airbus plant in Mobile.

Tactical and Strategic are each 20% of the tanker fleet, 60% are Standard tails.

Edited October 29Oct 29 by Clark Griswold

6 hours ago, AC&W said:

KISS Principle.

Axe the -330, keep the KC-46, drop any/all FAA certification.

Yeah, I see your point however with MRTT already flying the technical risk is low and fleet complexity manageable, I think.

On 10/29/2026 at 10:11 AM, Clark Griswold said:

True, the need for a very large fuel load for either offload and/or loiter while ideally the situation cools down is highly desirable

AI Google says loiter for 4 hours at 1000 NM from launch and offload 110k, that’s time to decide whether to execute Wing Attack Plan R or not. #strangelove

Tactical tanker is KC-390, Standard tanker is KC-46, Strategic Tanker is KC-45 (A-330 MRTT+).

Build it in the Airbus plant in Mobile.

Tactical and Strategic are each 20% of the tanker fleet, 60% are Standard tails.

Embraer already has a plant in Melbourne Fl and was exploring plans to make the KC-390 in Jacksonville or Nashville. Believe it or not that airplane is ALREADY U.S. manufacturing compliant because many of the sub-components come from the United States. As an example the engines V2500-E5 are right off the Airbus 320 and are made in Hartford Connecticut with one of the most established logistics lines in the world.

2 hours ago, ClearedHot said:

Embraer already has a plant in Melbourne Fl and was exploring plans to make the KC-390 in Jacksonville or Nashville. Believe it or not that airplane is ALREADY U.S. manufacturing compliant because many of the sub-components come from the United States. As an example the engines V2500-E5 are right off the Airbus 320 and are made in Hartford Connecticut with one of the most established logistics lines in the world.

Amen

This is not that hard, we just need a bold leader to stick their neck out and propose an aggressive plan to change this part of our force structure.

Really it’s a two part argument, CAF needs a doctrinal change that states given the increase in threats to bases, greater set back and basing flexibility (ACE) necessitates changes in our AR capabilities to support those forces.

Larger offloads at greater range, sufficient booms at conventional ranges, some capability to ingress into the furthest ranges of the A2AD bubble, some capability to base adhoc on nonstandard locations for ACE… the MAF could then propose a new AR force.

Paywalled but the AR enterprise is getting looked at

https://aviationweek.com/defense/budget-policy-operations/us-air-force-starts-another-look-future-aerial-refueling-needs