Catbox

The stupidity of the press is staggering. This story has some simple technical errors that should have been fact checked but for the author to act "surprised" by this capability on a purely theorhetical level is well...just dumb.

Hey man...knock it off with the NSFW hot T&A stuff.

Jesus man, how many young pilots did you make cry during your AD days?

My dad worked as MX troop in the 8th TFW in Thailand, while I always took his stories with a grain of salt, he like everyone else would have followed Robin Olds to the depths of hell. One of his favorite stories was how the old guy took the time to know first names and hometowns of all the maintainers, I'd assume as many of the other enlisted troops as well. One leadership style based on personal interaction, trust and a willingness to give a shit vs. a style based on intimidation, needless information and worthless embarrassment in front of peers.

Brother...the separation paperwork is at AFPC. I'm years past cynical, time to live off the wife's hard work for a while.

So in essence they could have used a scalpel to trim the dead weight from the 157 instead of the cleaver and let those who wanted to punch get out. They still could have been well on their way working toward 1500 cuts to get within the 10% satisfactory window. Instead they chose to screw over guys who have deployed, sacrificed and been put through the ringer. I truly want to believe the leadership has biggest picture and the best interests of the country and individuals at heart but it gets harder and harder to swallow that pill.

Sadly, no, that isn't the case. Not saying this applies to you at all...but bitches don't get weeded out...irrespective of gender. That's a pretty stylish hat for Nobel prize winner.

Out of hand?!!!! This was awesome and I think you handled yourself just fine toots. And that high minded idealism will only make you that much more bitter when you get to be my age.

Greatest thread ever... An aging fighter pilot and a dude who looks like Prince argue over sucking c---.

Understood and interesting stuff from everyone...can we just close this thread and go back to watching you battle with Masshole in the bar?

Ok cheap shots at each other's appearance aside...I think you hit the nail on the head. The Air Force has a ton of potential...I really like to think that if some enemy came knocking on the door of Alaska or California we would rally Wolverine style and be able to kick ass. Maybe the drag of continual nation building and other contingencies has made us bored and thus we focus on queep like uniforms, volunteerism, “everyone’s a warrior” and slogan after slogan after slogan (after slogan).

Sarge...you have to admit some NCO's have really f-ing stupid haircuts. I keed, I keed. Now where is that belt I bought in 1994...I'm taking the wife to Chili's tonight.

I'm probably like everyone else here, I have a love/hate relationship with the Air Force. But I think when it comes right down to it, as an organiztion the Air Force has its self screwed tightly into the wrong hole (no sts on that, sorry). I think baseops is a pretty good representation of the officers and some enlisted who truly care about what is going with the service and the most active boards and threads are the ones where people bitch and complain about Big Blue. 90% of the time I agree with the points being made, or at least where the frustration is coming from. When I was at SOS and they brought the War College guys in for Capt/Col discussion. I will never forget after taking quesitons from a bunch of angry, know-it-all Captains for the better part of an hour, the Colonel simply told us "YOU have to allow YOUR Air Force to make mistakes." I agreed with him at the time, but how many mistakes is enough? Would we as individuals have been cut the same amount of slack if we spent SIX years trying to figure out force shaping initiatives? How about the idiocy with uniforms? Reflective belts? What about one of the most expensive airframes ever being grounded for five months? Having said that what is OUR problem? If there was one thing (or a few things) that could turn crap around what would it be? I have my theories...leaders not allowed to be leaders is probably the biggest one...but I don't any earth shattering answers but maybe someone else does.

I’ve talked ad-nasuem about this on other threads but I too am getting out at 13 years…retirement be damned. I make no bones that this is the hardest decision I have ever had to make because at my deepest core I love being an Air Force officer, I love the “entre” wearing a bag around town gets me, I love it when an old guy shakes my hand and simply says thank you…and I even enjoyed deploying and the only time I shed a tear as an adult was the welcome home I received from total strangers at BWI. But this has to be done…the shenanigans are just too much for me. I’ve spent time away from home and have kids with whom I have to get reacquainted with at least once a year all while my wife has watched her hard earned and expensive education wither away into near uselessness because no company in their right mind would deal with the uncertainty (I guess I shouldn’t forget all the base newcomer’s briefs that remind her of the “great” opportunities at AAFES). I’ve seen mind-numbing stupidity when it comes to uniforms (“combat” uniforms that are essentially shrink-wrap in a fire, “sweat-causing” fabric in the ill-fitting PT uniform and arguments whether a belt should go on the blues). I’ve now seen good majors get fired because they caught a bad break, didn’t have someone looking out for them, wrong place at the wrong time, etc… and didn’t get promoted. No doubt some bad apples got shown the door but how many of those 157 guys were the best sticks in the squadron, the most knowledgeable, trustworthy, etc… I’ve been in squadrons where good CC’s with the best of intentions work ridiculous hours on queep, so much so that they have to be propped up every time they step in the jet. To top this all off I have seen an E-9, in writing, criticize Robin Olds for his famous/infamous appearance. Not attempting for a second to understand what Olds was trying to accomplish…that leadership doesn’t always come out of AFIs, the color of a persons boots and t-shirt, or even some imaginary professional image that has never fully existed anyways. What does my disgust have to do with the current retirement row? If I was still proud to serve I would gladly do the next 7+ years and collect what I felt like was a well deserved retirement. But my disgust with the present state of things means that I would just be a hanger on waiting for the dole like any other welfare recipient, no matter what retirement scheme congress conjures up. For those of you that still feel that pride and want to serve…god bless you…the country needs you.

I've been looking through my .pst to find that breif but can't seem to find it. I dont remember exactly but I think all 12X were heavy for year groups in the late 90s. However 12S were one of the few AFSCs that were offered continuation this year. edit: check out https://gum-crm.csd.disa.mil/app/home when you log in do a search for "officer sustainment matrix" This shows exactly the opposite of what I claimed but I very specifically remember a line graph that showed navs being heavy.

I saw a briefing that my functional gave back in May (prior to all this non-continuation crap) and if I remember correctly there were significant overages in all 12X specialties in and around my year group (96). They were mitigating this against the massive shortfalls they had in the 11X positions (specifically 11F) and they would need the 12X for <50% manned staff positions. Maybe, just maybe these staff positions that we were all supposed to be aiming for just aren’t that important? There is nothing about all this that makes sense to me, how can unit/staff function be less than 100%+ manned if the Air Force is over manning strength? How can they let guys with 15 years of experience go if certain staff billets are less than 50% manned? I could spend all day asking these questions and don’t think I would get an answer that makes sense to me.

matmacwc...heres the reg I was referencing. I'm sure ARC/ANG can make thier own rules when it gets to getting someone on (I imagine a bro network helps a lot) but this is out there: 9. REGULAR OFFICERS: Regular officers who are discharged based upon nonselection for promotion are ineligible for a Reserve appointment (AFI 36-2005, Appointment in Commisioned Grades and Designation and Assignment in Professional Categories, Table 2-2, item 25). A waiver of this policy will be granted only in rare instances, wherein (1) the officer's specialty (AFSC) and experience are demonstrated to be extremely critical to the Reserve Forces, (2) the quality of the officers past performance and conduct is judged to be exceptional, and (3) a Guard or Reserve unit endorses the officer's request to affiliate. For further information regarding waiver requirements for Reserve appointment, contact HQ ARPC/DRPB, DSN 926-6446. edit: I'm a retard.

Two big reasons for this... AFPC says that once you are twice passed over twice for LtCol you are ineligible to go guard and reserve. The AF Times article quoted someone from AFPC that they were going to be waiving this on a case by case basis. My thinking here is that I could get into the guard/reserve now without a waiver. This is what I've read and interpreted...if anyone can clarify this or has a different outlook please let me know. 2nd reason is that the wife has her job now...it's not quite a once in a lifetime opportunity but it is close to it. She is an MBA and a well known company with local offices/manufacturing sought her out. Her starting pay is not nearly as good as mine but if she performs well, it will catch up. This is the area we want to settle, we have a house, good schools, etc... If I forced the issue, she would move and not take the job but I know in my mind she would never forgive me for that. I had thought about this long before my assignment came up (and AFPC did a TERRIBLE job of matching me with anything even near what was on my ADP) but this has really forced the issue because I have to make a decision. Again I could leave the family, let her take the job and wait out the two years to see what happens and as was mentioned in an earlier post, be $300K up. But some of that would vanish in keeping two households, trips back and forth and extensive need for child care. Frankly it would devastate the kids (6,4) who have seen me vanish for months at a time enough to know they don’t want it anymore. Again my thinking on this is not perfect—why I’m on a message board asking for advice from strangers (informed as they are). This is probably boring the shit out of everyone but I appreciate the indulgence as I argue with myself in public.

No offense intended with the contractor jab...I worked very close with all the OEF ground EW contractors on my last deployments and pretty much to a man they were all good guys. However even most them acknowledged that getting $200K a year was a little like highway robbery espcially while the AF officers doing the same job got about half and the enlisted Army EWs made so much less.

From what I've read it wasn't an evaluation of records per se, it was if you have the right AFSC you get continued. I agree that the sky is not falling and I'm also positive that in two-three years there will be the "oh shit" moment at AFPC and everyone from Captains on up will get continued. The problem I have had with this non-continution crap is how it came out of the blue. Big Blue swears up and down that they gave everyone fair warning in letters from CSAF, force shaping and RIF breifings but I have looked back through and the letter from CSAF has one line saying somthing about selective continuation "possibly" being not offered. AFPC force shaping breifings have one bullet implying "maybe" selective continuation options would be limited, amongst hundreds of bullets telling Captains and younger Majors all the options they have up to, during and after the RIF. there's an interesting discussion on the issue here: http://www.afpc.af.mil/news/story.asp?id=123260118

M2- Thanks for the insight--its not easy and as resolute as the wife and I were yesterday we both had a sleepless night thinking about the what-ifs. If the idiocy with the selective-continuation would not have happened this year (and come as such a surprise) this would have been a no brainer, I would have stayed in. Her job is less money to begin with but its with a Fortune 500 company that is actually growing so if she plays her cards right she could top out at a higher salary than I could ever hope to get in the next seven years plus my retirement-but a steady paycheck and benefits for life (hopefully the house of cards doesn't collapse) is nothing to shake a stick at even with the promise of higher dollars down another path. We are lucky in that we have savings, absolutely zero debt (mortgage excluded) and I have the GI Bill, guard, reserve and other avenues. But that guaranteed income is such a sweet deal. My RIP hasn't shown up yet so I have 7+ days to figure this out.

I do actually, I was a panel and retrained as an EWO. I have no doubt I could get the scummy contractor jobs. In fact I did basically the same thing that the ground contractors did on my last bogus deployment as a Brigade EWO. I've already looked into it, at least what I've found so far is downrange...for at least double what I make now. Trying not to get sappy but I really appreciate the honest feedback from everyone. Posting this thread has been the best thing I've done since all this uncertainty came about. edit:grammar

Can I get the name of her dentist?

It's not that hard of a decision but I have to convince myself that this is a good thing. The worst part about it is that the Air Force and I got to this point, its almost like breaking up with the "sure thing" girl. All the time, memories and expectations out the window in seven days. Having said that, like you, I'm just so tired of the crap. And everyone up and down the chain knowing its crap.

The sentiment of the day, I'm afraid this one is all too possible. Edit: the sentiment of Nov 2010. Whoops.