EvilEagle Posted June 2, 2005 Share Posted June 2, 2005 Yep, the cockpit shots look like it's just sitting before being started (standby attitude indicator is still caged) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Spartacus Posted July 15, 2005 Share Posted July 15, 2005 Thread revival! I just got it and thought it was awesome! I watched it within about 24 hours. One question to those who have gone through F-15 or even F-16 or A-10 training... does everyone come that close to washing out? It seemed like almost every single one of those dudes had at least one point in their training where they were really sweating it! Especially Love! That dude was awesome and did really well in his graduation ride, but I totally did not expect him to get Top Gun! Side note: Do studs in heavy training go through stresses like that too with their check rides etc? And to think this whole time I thought that if you make it through UPT and got your wings then you had "made" it! It seems like I was wrong! You can wash it during IFF and B course stuff too, huh? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
EvilEagle Posted July 16, 2005 Share Posted July 16, 2005 Yes, you can wash out in IFF and the B course, a lot of folks do. Somebody in every class has a hard time. Out of 8 in my B course, there was one that went to a prog check (1 ride from being gone), and one that struggled slightly less. Malibu (Giggy) didn't actually do as bad in the B course as it was made out on the show -- they added a lot of drama to try to make the show better. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Kula Shaker Posted July 20, 2005 Share Posted July 20, 2005 Originally posted by EvilEagle: Yes, you can wash out in IFF and the B course, a lot of folks do. Somebody in every class has a hard time. Out of 8 in my B course, there was one that went to a prog check (1 ride from being gone), and one that struggled slightly less. Malibu (Giggy) didn't actually do as bad in the B course as it was made out on the show -- they added a lot of drama to try to make the show better. Regarding the folks who wash out of IFF and B Course, what happens to them? Especially in light of the force shaping? Kula Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hacker Posted July 20, 2005 Share Posted July 20, 2005 Originally posted by Kula Shaker: Regarding the folks who wash out of IFF and B Course, what happens to them? Especially in light of the force shaping?Anyone who washes out of IFF or FTU must go before a Flying Evaluation Board (FEB). The purpose of the FEB is to answer the question "is this person fit for aviation service?" If the answer is 'no', then the person can lose their wings or keep their wings but never fly again. If the answer is 'yes' then the FEB can recommend a course of action for the individual -- either to be re-instated into the training program which they washed out of, or to be sent to some other rated flying job. What *usually* happens is the Wing CC is able to offer a waiver to the FEB, and that waiver essentially says "we'll spare you the risk of going to an FEB, and we're sending you to some kind of non-fighter aircraft." Most guys end up taking the waiver, and from IFF most guys go to BUFFs or BONEs. The force shaping initiatives only apply to personnel who wash out of or quit *initial* technical training (in a pilot's case, SUPT). By the time a pilot gets to IFF or FTU, the Air Force has all ready sunk a significant investment into that pilot and would prefer to keep him/her in *some* kind of cockpit so long as the FEB finds them to be a safe aviator. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Beaver Posted July 20, 2005 Share Posted July 20, 2005 You have a few guys that struggle in every B-course, but for most people it is definitely not as dramatic as the show makes it out to be. It makes it look like everyone is on the edge all the time. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
brabus Posted July 20, 2005 Share Posted July 20, 2005 I had lunch with a guy a few days ago who's oldest son is now an IP at Vance. He (the son) knows a guy who put in his FAIP time, getting about 1000 hours. He then went to Tyndall and failed 15 school. The AF kicked him out. Moral of the story, watch your ass and don't screw up...force shaping sucks. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest sickels101 Posted July 20, 2005 Share Posted July 20, 2005 We are told that we can wash out of IFF but if we wash out of RTU we are done (that was included for the prior captains and the likes). So, I would agree with brabus on this one. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hacker Posted July 20, 2005 Share Posted July 20, 2005 Originally posted by brabus: He (the son) knows a guy who put in his FAIP time, getting about 1000 hours. He then went to Tyndall and failed 15 school. The AF kicked him out. Moral of the story, watch your ass and don't screw up...force shaping sucks. No, the moral of the story is that FAIPs with fighter follow-ons, no matter how hard they wanna believe it, don't know a f*cking thing about being a fighter pilot. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
brabus Posted July 20, 2005 Share Posted July 20, 2005 Well, no one knows a f*cking thing about being a fighter pilot until they've gone through the training and then some. So, every single person who goes through IFF and then a RTU doesn't know a thing about being a fighter pilot until they've gone through it all. So yeah, the moral is don't screw up...because anyone could screw up, FAIPs and all. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hacker Posted July 21, 2005 Share Posted July 21, 2005 Originally posted by brabus: Well, no one knows a f*cking thing about being a fighter pilot until they've gone through the training and then some.You might be surprised at how many T-38 FAIPs, especially, show up to Smurfs thinking that they have it all figured out. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Toro Posted July 21, 2005 Share Posted July 21, 2005 Originally posted by SoNotToSpeak: We are told that we can wash out of IFF but if we wash out of RTU we are done (that was included for the prior captains and the likes).Once you are rated and fail to meet standards in any formal training, you aren't automatically kicked out - you will face a Flying Evaluation Board. We had one guy (former T-37 FAIP) wash out of my FTU class and is now flying C-17s. We had another guy (also a T-37 FAIP) wash out of the MQ program at my Ops unit and is now flying B-52s. We had two WSOs wash out of the instructor unit here at Seymour and they also faced an FEB - both are still flying. Originally posted by Hacker: No, the moral of the story is that FAIPs with fighter follow-ons, no matter how hard they wanna believe it, don't know a f*cking thing about being a fighter pilot.Hey now...I learned to drink Weed and liberally incorporate "Container" "so to speak" and "69" into everyday conversation. [ 21. July 2005, 02:21: Message edited by: Toro ] Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hacker Posted July 21, 2005 Share Posted July 21, 2005 Originally posted by SnakeT38: So, I guess all this "harder than this or that" is in the "eye of the beholder". Well, I certainly did not assert that IFF was too tough of a program for a FAIP, IP, or anyone else. If it was that tough, then the pipeline students wouldn't make it through! No, my point regarding FAIPs has everything to do with attitude and nothing to do with stick-and-rudder skills. Most T-38 FAIPs, if they approach the training with the proper attitude, do extremely well at IFF. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bishop Posted July 21, 2005 Share Posted July 21, 2005 Just picked up my copy yesterday at the Macdill AFB Exchange, $14.95 Not a bad deal, still on episode 4. While I am sure there might of been some things that were not filmed for the solo party I am surprised they let them tape as much as they did since its a secretive type thing. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest SnakeT38 Posted July 21, 2005 Share Posted July 21, 2005 Anyone know if Mike Love is still in the USAF, he was a PIT when I went through the second time in 97, then he went to Vance and moved up pretty fast for a B-1 guy. I remember him getting the F-15, they were handing them to ANYBODY that asked along with other jets since the "line to get out" was LONG AND DISTINGUISHED! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest dpiddycanfly Posted October 17, 2006 Share Posted October 17, 2006 Watching the DVD series gives some goog insight into F-15 B-course. But how do other airframes compare? For example I would think that Viper training would take longer since they still have to cover things like BFM and ACM but then they also have to practice air to ground stuff too. Is it longer? Harder? Same? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
EvilEagle Posted October 17, 2006 Share Posted October 17, 2006 Originally posted by SnakeT38: Anyone know if Mike Love is still in the USAF, he was a PIT when I went through the second time in 97, then he went to Vance and moved up pretty fast for a B-1 guy. I remember him getting the F-15, they were handing them to ANYBODY that asked along with other jets since the "line to get out" was LONG AND DISTINGUISHED! Makin' is still in. He's on the Saudi exchange right now... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Toro Posted October 18, 2006 Share Posted October 18, 2006 Originally posted by dpiddycanfly: For example I would think that Viper training would take longer since they still have to cover things like BFM and ACM but then they also have to practice air to ground stuff too. Is it longer? Harder? Same? I can't speak for the Viper FTU, but the F-15E FTU is similar in that you don't A/A and A/G. The length of the course isn't vastly different from the C model, but the depth to which we get into the A/A stuff is much less. They do multiple rides in all phases - OBFM, DBFM, HABFM, OACM, DACM, 2vX, 4vX, etc. The only areas which have multiple rides are BFM and 2v2 (which are very benign). They don't have to demonstrate proficiency in ACM. The fact that we are dual-role means we have more to teach our guys, but we don't get nearly into the depth of A/A that the C model guys get into. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest turtle Posted October 18, 2006 Share Posted October 18, 2006 Viper B-Course Syllabus TR 6X TR (TR6 is a Form8) 3X INSTRUMENTS 1X NIGHT TR A/A 4X OBFM (DemoPro) 4X DBFM (DemoPro) 4X HABFM (DemoPro) 4X ACM (DemoPro) 7X TI (DemoPro) 2X LASDT (DemoPro) 2X ACT (FAM) A/G 8X BSA (4X CURVE, 3X POP, 1X JADAM) DemoPro in CURVE and POP 6X SAT (DemoPro) 2X CAS (DemoPro) 1X SAN Plus 8 Tgt Pod rides after we graduate and a Block 50 class for those going to Block 50s. All from memory, so please correct me if I left something off. [ 17. October 2006, 22:14: Message edited by: turtle ] Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RangerMateo Posted January 4, 2008 Share Posted January 4, 2008 Anyone know where Col Mintz is these days? I about crapped myself when I saw him in the video, he was my FTU/CC back at Tyndall. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dkc0820 Posted January 4, 2008 Share Posted January 4, 2008 Anyone know where Col Mintz is these days? I about crapped myself when I saw him in the video, he was my FTU/CC back at Tyndall. Col Mintz was my CC back at the det when I was in ROTC. Great guy...he is now the AFROTC NW Region CC at the Academy. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RangerMateo Posted January 7, 2008 Share Posted January 7, 2008 Does he have a star now? I'd like to look him up in global, but I don't know about going VFR direct to a General as a 2Lt ;) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest C-21 Pilot Posted January 7, 2008 Share Posted January 7, 2008 (edited) Ranger, You piss standing up, huh? F*ck, simply email the guy. It's not official "breaking the chain" etc, shit your worried about. The dude puts his pants on one leg at a time and would probably be surprised to hear from ya'. If he gets pissed and pulls "I'm the ALMIGHTY...then him and piss in his Cheerios in the morning." Don't sweat it. If I ever played a pivital influence in someones life and they emailed me, I'd feel the same. As far as the AFP series, I've heard that it's "way to made for TV"....never seen it, never will. Edited January 7, 2008 by C-21 Pilot Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dkc0820 Posted January 7, 2008 Share Posted January 7, 2008 Does he have a star now? I'd like to look him up in global, but I don't know about going VFR direct to a General as a 2Lt ;) No star, he is retiring after he is done at the Academy. Just shoot him an email. I recently did to thank him for all the help he gave me and to let him know that since he left my det I have commissioned and started nav training. He was excited and will probably tell you the same thing he told me..."it makes him happy to see 2Lt after your name." No worries. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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