HeyWatchThis Posted December 14, 2013 Share Posted December 14, 2013 Rumor mill at XL is T-1 leadership is pushing for us to hand fly everything below 10,000'......... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
clouseau Posted December 14, 2013 Author Share Posted December 14, 2013 (edited) Automation schould come in handy on days like these- The Chinese might need a refresher on auto- land. http://www.cnn.com/2013/12/12/world/asia/china-smog-aviaition/index.html?sr=fb121313chinablindlanding1p Edited December 14, 2013 by clouseau Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Majestik Møøse Posted December 14, 2013 Share Posted December 14, 2013 Automation schould come in handy on days like these- The Chinese might need a refresher on auto- land.http://www.cnn.com/2013/12/12/world/asia/china-smog-aviaition/index.html?sr=fb121313chinablindlanding1p I would be scared shitless riding in the back of a Chinese airliner during a cat 2/3 landing. Also during the subsequent taxi. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pcola Posted December 14, 2013 Share Posted December 14, 2013 As GHeart would say: "FTFA! Fly the fucking airplane, Lieutenant!" 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sky_king Posted December 14, 2013 Share Posted December 14, 2013 Rumor mill at XL is T-1 leadership is pushing for us to hand fly everything below 10,000'......... As it should. Coupled approaches should be a special syllabus item just to see how to set them up/how they work in case of emergency. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Raul Duke Posted December 14, 2013 Share Posted December 14, 2013 At END on the T-1 side the only approaches the students can fly with the AP engaged are GPS. (Full up GPS, not overlay stuff.) Every other instrument approach (ILS, LOC, VOR, etc.) is hand flown from the base leg or prior to intercepting final. We also don't let them use all of the FMS functions. For example, we make them calculate descent gradients as opposed to letting them simply fix the altitudes in the flight plan to get a Top Of Descent point on the MFD. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hacker Posted December 14, 2013 Share Posted December 14, 2013 At END in the T-38 students use the autopilot and FMS....never. 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Right Seat Driver Posted December 14, 2013 Share Posted December 14, 2013 Rumor mill at XL is T-1 leadership is pushing for us to hand fly everything below 10,000'......... I don't see a problem with that. It is PILOT training. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MooseBoost Posted December 14, 2013 Share Posted December 14, 2013 http://fearoflanding.com/accidents/sequence-of-events-in-the-cockpit-on-asiana-flight-214/ Link to an article with the NTSB video regarding the asiana crash. Poor/improper use of automation to blame, not too surprising. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gator2 Posted December 14, 2013 Share Posted December 14, 2013 I'm at CBM and it's been a battle I've been fighting for a while now to reduce student reliance on MFD. You'd be surprised how many regional pilots are great with that MFD up, but the second you take it away and force them to use the bearing pointer and DME for SA, they get lost as a goose in a hurricane. Normal UPT students with no prior time are even more behind. The pulling of fix-to-fix required training has not helped this in the slightest. Just an opinion of a legacy herk guy that had no such tools. I can use them just fine, but function just fine without them. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jaded Posted December 14, 2013 Share Posted December 14, 2013 Fix to fix's aren't even authorized in the NAS anymore. Good riddance. 5 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gator2 Posted December 14, 2013 Share Posted December 14, 2013 It's not about the fix-to-fix, it's about being able to interpret the information from the instruments. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ElLoco Posted December 15, 2013 Share Posted December 15, 2013 It's not about the fix-to-fix, it's about being able to interpret the information from the instruments. Snore... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Prozac Posted December 15, 2013 Share Posted December 15, 2013 Agree with the need for pilots to be able to do that pilot shit and hand-fly the airplane proficiently. However, guys these days need to be equally proficient with the automation. It's there for a reason and has the potential to improve safety and reduce fatigue during normal ops. The goal should be to never have to ask "What's it doing now?". You should know exactly what the automation is going to do before you push the button. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TheGuardGuy Posted December 15, 2013 Share Posted December 15, 2013 Agree with the need for pilots to be able to do that pilot shit and hand-fly the airplane proficiently. However, guys these days need to be equally proficient with the automation. It's there for a reason and has the potential to improve safety and reduce fatigue during normal ops. The goal should be to never have to ask "What's it doing now?". You should know exactly what the automation is going to do before you push the button. IMHO Automation should be introduced briefly in UPT and be formally taught during IQT of the MWS and seasoning at the first assignment. It's a short year to learn the basics- building a solid foundation of hand flying and a strong ability to interpret raw instrumentation should be the primary objective of the UPT cadre. 6 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gator2 Posted December 16, 2013 Share Posted December 16, 2013 Thank you TheGuardGuy, that's exactly what I was saying. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Spur38 Posted December 17, 2013 Share Posted December 17, 2013 Good stuff! How often do you dim down the FMS/CRT and give the other guy a WAC/Sectional and ash "Where are we"? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gator2 Posted December 17, 2013 Share Posted December 17, 2013 Haven't tried that. Heck these days I'm usually in shock if they have a chart out that they can reach. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Spinner Posted December 17, 2013 Share Posted December 17, 2013 Haven't tried that. Heck these days I'm usually in shock if they have a chart out that they can reach. Or even read... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Steve Holt! Posted December 19, 2013 Share Posted December 19, 2013 Agree with the need for pilots to be able to do that pilot shit and hand-fly the airplane proficiently. However, guys these days need to be equally proficient with the automation. It's there for a reason and has the potential to improve safety and reduce fatigue during normal ops. The goal should be to never have to ask "What's it doing now?". You should know exactly what the automation is going to do before you push the button. I don't know man. The airplane I fly has 3 autopilot options. Altitude hold, altitude and heading hold, and the third option, and they don't do much to make me a better or safer pilot, except maybe to help out when I need to get some snacks from my pocket. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Day Man Posted December 19, 2013 Share Posted December 19, 2013 People fly different planes, steve...I'm guessing you don't have 23 hr days flying across the pond after getting alerting 16 hours into bravo. Add in an A/R and an arrival into busy airspace, and correct manipulation of the automation will ultimately reduce workload for the pilots. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Prozac Posted December 19, 2013 Share Posted December 19, 2013 Great. Get proficient with it in 6-9 minutes and call it good. Other setups will take longer. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TheGuardGuy Posted December 19, 2013 Share Posted December 19, 2013 Great. Get proficient with it in 6-9 minutes and call it good. Other setups will take longer. So your box takes longer to get ready? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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