AirGuardianC141747

Great information over and over again. Seniority reigns King, although I would consider living in domicile a very close second if it’s really where you want to live. Those who have cities/towns they want to live/die in because it’s their Dream location and it is a domicile for Big 3/Purple/Brown/SW,JB,F9 whatever gig in aviation or not have a ton of options going for them and I envy as most would. Aviation has great $ opportunities and if DFW, ATL, ORD, etc, etc, etc, fits the bill you have somewhere to shoot for. This past decade has been the first time a pilot can choose a location and then consider the outfit which serves him/her the best for the most part. Adding international and/or commuting creates a more complicated situation. Heavy international takes more time within the pax ranks especially now. A lot of international is held by the cargo outfits early on in your career with wide bodies, schedules get better with time. Do you want international now or later, will it be 3-5 days or 10-14 days depending on lifestyle, children, independent spouse, etc. Domestic hub turns whether pax (just shorter turns vs cargo), day, night, day and night flying are all great questions. 3AM wake ups for 6AM departures day after day for 3,4,5 days 8-12hr days OR 7PM night departures hanging out at a night station(lounge chair/room) return by 7AM. Red eyes for junior pax folks or extra $ for the senior their is goodness in many outfits that you can do a lot of different schedules within a year on property. You may find daytime sleeping does work for you, maybe not - it is a huge consideration for some. *I don’t recommend 17 Days for the general public (I normally do 14-16, still long), but we do day/night and everything in-between. We are slave to the customer we fly for that day. Purple/Brown it will be night, tracks, good food, etc. 75% of the other time it’s random routes daytime and night time or reverse. AMC, DHL, Race Teams, Car manufacturer’s, Alibaba, clothing, Flowers, Lobsters for Asia, they just don’t care they just don’t want it there. Off for a couple weeks, commuting on company dime sometimes my time once a month living where I want to live and sleeping half or third the time just works for me as 74 cargo and 777 would work but don’t go to nearly as many locations. 76 guys like their schedules, 73 folks are starting to fly more. Regarding future longevity with several kids in tow, take care of yourself and go to the Big Players. Pre-pandemic adventure come on over the water isn’t super fine again just yet, pretty decent depending on your priorities. Everywhere has some greatness, some more than most but they ALL have fleas. Take some time and read the topics that interest you on APC such as schedules, class drops, pay, vaccine, contract woes, management styles, new hires, etc. Read the chatter from the line folks doing the deed and find where your priorities/interests lie to best best fit your future for you and your family. ***Very tough right now with the Pax folks and some cargo info as recovery is different at many carriers and today’s win or loss can be tomorrow’s dream or epic fail.*** I wish everyone the best and I push folks who are with us to move on as fast as they can if their dream job is elsewhere. Our variety is unmatched and will get you hired on a routine basis. Nothing guaranteed, but with Atlas blood in the water the Sharks are always near, or just do the flow thru programs for a few years or way less. Most Mil folks are ripe for the picking, especially with the latest changes of approach(folks) entering this profession.

Like nunya said: there are no constants. Commuting adds hours if not days back and forth multiple times a month. Big bases are the most solid, but things expand and contract due to the economy bottom line. Just ask Delta when they had a good footprint in CVG mid 2000s and many other carriers, they shrank heavily. But a lot of things come back so seniority is everything. Make your best guess as timing is a big part of it. Most places it is work, so maximize your pay for the maximum time at home as your happy place. Fly more make more, soft pay, etc. and know your contract.

Glad you put that out there in the universe. New Pay Scales retroactive 1 Sept along with new vacation accrual and new min guarantee. Union email came out yesterday. So there’s that.

Totally on board with that, no one wants a delay in this case and get to the next 10yr contract quicker (hopefully not). I recommended a friend go 737 as he wanted to be domestic initially with mid range kids. Then go 74 like he wanted = Told him don’t let the start pay on 74 $117 drive his decision much as he can do 73 FO $89 for maybe a year and IF things stay the same with his experience jump CA 2nd year thereabouts at $175 and stay domestic 4-5 years with the kids to upgrade 74 at a later date 🤔 maybe, especially as the combined seniority list in Nov will slow upgrades is a solid guess for him. Just a work around if you will. As for yourself, FedEx/UPS and everyone is hiring so you have your choice more so than ever before. I have too much time invested here and dug in like an Alabama Tick. Definitely not for everyone, but the flying appeals to me for various personal reasons. Lazy is one of them.😴

You are Correct - True at normal places. Lots of Woulda, shoulda, coulda in aviation: Thru lawyers, company delays and other run arounds, welcome to ACMI and this was done previously as well (10 yrs ago sadly) estimation still Oct. We’ll see… 73 weren’t flying much but have started to ramp up. We’re seeing 73 Capt upgrades at less than a yr mark due to demand/shortages. Hiring and hemorrhaging as normal but this pay increase ranges on 20-35% or more depending on where you sit, some considerably higher than 50% if able to upgrade from the lower platform and 10% was given last year. Still not on par with many, as soft pay is where many differences lie and succeed. 4th week of vacation added, but not until 12th year. No wins in scope or long term disability. Hoped for home basing (no-go) and some other Cheddar, but it was minimal. As always will will hook’m, Clean’m and fry’m faster than anyone for their next gig - at least we’re #1 at something

Before it’s asked: DOS is Date Of Signing. Most likely Oct we think…

Not the “Leading Industry Contract” by any means, but it has some merit. Definitely could have been better in many areas, but some goodness to it as well. Maybe next time, bit by bit I guess.

As a pilot I had 2 former FE’s in the military flying C-141s with me ( maybe I with them) and one transitioned to LM on C-17s as I did. Both were FE’s on the 747 Classic at Atlas before I arrived. Both of them used 500 hrs towards their ATP and used the companies FE to pilot program allowing them to be 747-400 typed once they had all their ratings and no interview as company employees. They both are Captains senior to me now (one is a Line Check Airman), imagine that. I make them buy dinner as they owe me now during our military times - great guys. There are still a few 747 classic outfits out there which have FE’s of course; thereby employing you on a known quantity while flying on the side. I wouldn’t recommend this, it was just an example of many FE’s up front now. Better to use the route mentioned by others, it is very good info.

Apparently not. Granted the Afghan thread is going strong… Good luck on your endeavors, especially if you plan on living in Alaska that would be great or I guess Seattle, etc. if you can stomach that. Hopefully left coast gets back on track. Having passed thru all of left coast every month for the past year, the mindless ups/downs were Capt InsanO.

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Godspeed to all of you serving still and Thank You. What a crock of Crown Royal as many stations have already started spinning this into “a President who got us out of Afghanistan” while ignoring the HOW it was done and anyone who thinks otherwise knows better. As veterans of Bagram, Kabul, Kandahar, etc., we all knew well before the loss of lives that there would be losses and now it’s far from really over. Amazing that you never had to step foot in country to know this as well. Just that obvious. Be safe on whatever “assignment” you’re on as it’s apparent some higher echelons of leadership in various positions all the way to the top does not have your back aside from those right next to you. Watch your tails Cowboys.

Maybe the Taliban can ask this administration to go back to Little Rock where we first started training (2013) the Afghans on the C-130Hs… Since then several tried/may have disappeared on our soil and quite a few pilots within their “AAF” have been assassinated well before this debacle. Now the threats to them and their families will be carried out after they get what they want…. It’s inevitable. Doubtful if they were ever on any evac lists.

Anytime we engaged in United Nations debauchery so habitat for humanity has been going for along time under the guise of nation building as well. Smoke and mirrors everywhere… just me.

Makes sense as China has been in the opium game centuries before Afghanistan ever was. Another good vein of opportunity for Big Red. Free WiFi, etc for all, now get back to work and leave the product alone…or get your heads bashed in…

If not already mentioned, C17 landing gear is the last large aircraft gear I would attempt take a ride and survive on. Turn, twist, fold, retract, etc. Not good odds even for me having flown her for well over a decade out of Afghanistan alone. It’s just a mess…

Our history dictates that we have very poor exit strategies. When another snake head pops up, here we go again. It is what it is.

Thanks RJ, sounds like a perfect movie for East Coast West Coast hop on some pax carrier. Just like Quiet Place II… First Quiet Place was very quiet, too quiet too slow when I needed a mindless sockem rockem movie to get my mind off the middle seat passenger bleeding into my virus free zone. *I keep movies like Ford vs Ferrari or The Courier(haven’t seen it yet/in my stash) for our Home Screen and mindless entertainment to kill time.

Just make sure you let Taiwan know when I’m not in either country. Wu Han was nice the other day. I’m sure they didn’t want to take me on a Lab Tour. Maybe Doc Fauci could be my guide.

Cool, was wondering what that one was like. I know someone mentioned it wasn’t that great, but I’m more willing to drop 300 cents on it just for some mindless action. Us airline guys get cheap sometimes, just didn’t want to pay $20 on Direct a couple of months ago. Thanks LR! One of my airline buds said The Tomorrow War was very good. I hope it is.

Jump from 62K to 82K at the bare minimum. No extra anything… 103K perhaps, guessing on new contract. Total Guess!!! Well considering he had to endure 3-4 months of training pay around $1600 a month during his first year he will better off. He also was subjected to a 50hr guarantee on year one pay of $87 hr (only 8-9 months of actual flight pay guarantee). 2nd year pay goes to $110 at a 62 hr guarantee on current book (current contract). New contract potential is 2nd year pay $134 or above at 64 hr guarantee or a tad more if lucky above that. Nothing known until mid September but we are ever hopeful for a substantial hike overall. Wow factor probably not, but definitely a better living standard for being paid to travel globally like no one else (only if your into that)

A superb rendition of where we go and what we do. Super Car hauling, Vehicle Prototypes, Race Horse hauling, cattle and other weird animals (blah), Sports Teams, Bands (Foo Fighters back in the day), Oil rig equipment, Beans & Bullets or much Bigger, etc., etc., etc., and like the other haulers Lobster, Flowers, Mail, e-commerce, Laptops, batteries and everything else under the sun that can hurt you - that last part keeps the pucker factor going. You name it we have probably hauled it aside from the public thankfully. We support Purple/Brown during peak and are currently opening a base if you will at MEM just for this. Yes we don’t fly like any/most of us do/have in the military and we’ll never have the outstanding times among your comrades in the heat of battle or beer but who really even comes close. But FF hit the true diversity of talents, ideas and culture influx of Atlas - we cast a very wide net. No hats, no jackets, just clip on ties (mine isn’t) and very “Casual Friday” wear. Being away that long at times is not everyone’s ideal situation especially with children and other home requirements so that would totally suck no lie - gotta be home, can’t stress enough don’t even look this way. Couple of weeks off (just me) is very fulfilling. This long haul does take its toll on marriages, etc. and should be weighed heavily. But some of us don’t consider this work compared to the excerpt below from APC “Widebody FO” pg 13 on a Big 3 site posted 7/26/21. This is actual work to most who have experienced this other type of torment so LordRatner’s maximize your pay, time off and efficiency is pure Gold as your focus. SociaID and others have got this down very well. “We have to get some of that fixed. A 5 day with 4 10-11 hour layovers is exhausting. Especially at 3 & 4 legs a day.” It does go on to say with someone replying - “Call Fatigue” which is correct. This schedule is not uncommon among most PAX carriers anything less than 5 days means more commute. If you live in base and have always wanted to live there that is the best case of living the dream. Many will say it’s not the norm but they’re fairly senior at times having already dragged thru the salt mines and enjoy much better schedules several years later. Captains running really good schedules out there in 10-15 years on the guppy is great (scarebus would be much better size wise for me 6’/240lbs) and have memorized freqs, approaches, controller names and the best Latte vendors/eats within 500ft. Travel junkies wait much longer but your travel benefits can be good as some outfits, but no worries your paycheck will cover it well. STRONG marriage and/or single wanting to see things beyond the military adventure curtain FF said it best. No one does what we do, not saying that’s the smartest thing. You want 3-4 luxury homes, many sports cars and planes, have 1, 2, 3 x-wives and 5 kids. Big 3, Purple/Brown makes things much easier. Definitely a great deal. Ask any Brown Driver, it’s just a job and they fly almost twice as much as we do in a significantly less amount of time. My friend is a 1995 UPS hire still an FO (Hub stuff) says “I’m butt tired and bent over getting off the plane, BUT they make it easy cuz there’s a pile of cash at the bottom of the stairs so it’s easy to pick up!” $$$$$ He has twin girls so he’s preparing, good for him killing it.

You did, kinda… I hadn’t stayed at 5 Clowns for well over 3 years and we were told it was off the books a few months ago. End of June they booked my fellow FO at the “Tony Stark” but myself at the 5 Clowns which was weird. I could have made the changes, but was curious if anything had changed and nothing had as I checked out with several Big 3 guys and Regional guys who were very cool and not too well rested like me. Definitely Atlas Hotel Appreciation Day, won’t do that again. I am a good franchise player normally unless it involves food and this particular hotel. Next time I will spit out my pacifier make a call and they will pound sand.

I guess I wasn’t too far off at 75-100 days. Much more chill on the line. We have some great times and of course challenging moments. Welcome Aboard Herkbum, I hope it treats you right while your here and takes you wherever you desire as a career destination. Thanks SocialD, we hope for better. It’s been a long drag out so we need to get this one done so we can plug all the holes for the next one and so on. Works very well for myself, but could be better and on par with industry standards which I use loosely. Cheers to all and just have fun.

We definitely have some knucklehead schedulers and they can pound sand on most 10 hr resets. Worked with some good ones too and worked things out. Been here awhile so they don’t/haven’t messed with me but once this year. Worked 132 days/233 Off last year, no overtime and one attempted extension - not fantastic but very comfortable. Usually bid 15 day trips that are relatively few at my base. Time zone jumping is tough no doubt but speaking for myself I range from 14-24/30+ hrs off in between flights 70% on time and 30% scheduling is on fire. Despite a few back to backs, still the best if not the most interesting airline type flying out there (my perspective) vs normal shuttling up/downs and/or hub turns of any SORT. Pax moving isn’t on my bucket list, but the AMC runs, etc are unique. Most of my friends at the LCCs or multi-leg carriers state that “it makes the day go fast!” which sounds like work to me while many say 6-12+ hr legs would make them poke their eyes out - Totally get it as it has dragged a few times no doubt, but mostly to be at the next location just chilling and soaking up that environment. Long haul isn’t for everyone and has been my life for 2 decades having had the AF inoculate me since 9/11. Always enjoy going somewhere new (sometimes repetitive), not cookie cutter short haul shuttles (although the triple run out of Korea and back blows I must admit). Prefer 1 leg 12+ hour 4 person crew/dozing for a few dollars, cook, movies, doing other business for 6 hrs or more. What frustrates most is that it could be the Best places hands down but will never be. With a few more clams closer, decent retirement and other benefits we could keep our talent but I will say there are also those that need to move on. Once again your mileage may vary regarding the above, but it works well for me specifically (fairly senior) and several others. If you have any reservations on being away from the hacienda for even 10 days. DO NOT COME HERE! If you want/need to differentiate yourself for future opportunities we work well for future endeavors! Good luck to all.

Cannot agree more with FourFans130. Atlas 74 Perspective Cons up front: Lackluster contract (unable to vote on it) well behind Majors/Brown/Purple/SWA, etc., no pure soft pay per say, trip guarantee, DH Pay, international override, etc. Top issues: 17 Day lines, Pay, Retirement/Direct Contribution bottom line. 14 Days Vaca until 5th year 21 Days maximum. Standard gripes Union/Management like most airlines. Gateway travel although nice may cost you a day up front to preposition and a day after return to base which 19 days is plausible. 70-100 days initial training in MIA unless you live or enjoy MIA. *Inefficiencies throughout… Some Pros are biased which is undeniable… Pros: Gateway Travel and hotel accommodations provided; therefore, it’s never your fault or worry getting to work=live almost anywhere U.S. and many live overseas unlike anywhere else. 30 day and 60 day lines = ability to get schedule done and be off for longer periods or chop up the 17 day lines over 2 months with shorter times away and shorter times at home. Sick Leave at this time is a Big Boy program and Doctors note not required. Pay is decent and doing overtime can nab you significant gains using days off. MIA training folks and overtime hounds can pull near half a mil or more working diligently. MIA is super senior. 74 is a comfortable ride, uniform hung at cruise, no FAs, no pax shenanigans, no bathroom break requests. Casual flying around the globe on paid vacation having some good eats & beverages with friends at interesting venues/locations. Hopefully upcoming “Arbitrated” contract closes the gap to other airlines. Notice I didn’t say equals… 777 More solid scheduled runs predominantly international of course. 76 folks do more airline type schedules every other week or so. Some international but predominantly Amazon and NFL/MLB/AMC Pax charters. 73 side seems like a startup test, unsure what’s really going over there. If new contract nears $300 mark, has significantly better retirement and keeps some of the TA’d goodness most would stay. My doubts fall on retirement gains… *Inefficiencies have been a plus on most occasions based upon length of stay at great locations. A few not so great ones.