Scooter14

Nice deflection. My future conversation is absolutely hypothetical and meant to be sarcastic in nature. I absolutely rolled in the things we have been talking about here. My point was 100% about trusting torqued over healthcare professionals. We have had multiple conversations regarding the briefings she gets. Come on over for dinner. It gets to be a broken f***ing record regarding the positivity rates and hospitalization rates and the vaccine take rate/hospitalization rate ratios. Guess what? It’s the same stuff that the AP is reporting, only I often get it a few days prior from a health care professional before it hits the news. These are all topics she has brought up in the past. She’s not making this shit up. Just yesterday she told me that a handful of staff members either elected to work elsewhere or retire early. Others are leaving because they don’t want to get vaccinated. Either way, the number of cases and hospitalizations fluctuates but the number of healthcare workers just keeps decreasing. You can build the biggest hospital (or Air Force) in the world, but you have to staff it with qualified people.

Oh thank God. I’m looking forward to the dinner conversation tonight. How was your day honey? “Well I got another briefing that the COVID case rate is going up, they briefed us on the situation down south where they’re having to open up conference rooms for all of the patients again. Idaho is starting to ration care. Pretty much everyone coming in is unvaccinated. Three ICU nurses gave their notice and we don’t have the experience in the ER staff to backfill them.” Oh. Well, don’t worry about it honey everyone is overreacting. It’s all gonna be fine, torqued said so. “Who’s torqued?” Oh he’s a guy on Baseops. He seems really in tune with what’s going on. Tell the people at the hospital to exercise more and stop watching the news.

“Only read the news. Never watch it.” …says the guy who literally posted a news video you have to watch in response to my news link that you have to read. I’m vaccinated since Feb, I do all of your advice above and I’m and worry free amigo. It’s been really nice, thank you. My wife works in healthcare. Her ICU friends are throwing in the towel out of the frustration of watching unvaccinated middle age people show up there, and we aren’t even in a hotspot. Hospitals don’t pay techs very much, Some of them can make about the same amount in retail and not have to wear a spacesuit and watch people die. The healthcare shortage will soon make the AF pilot crisis look like child’s play. It’s coming. There will be signs like the ones at Wendy’s apologizing for being short staffed, except it’ll be while you’re waiting hours for emergency medical care. I believe at some point a week or so ago in one of these ridiculous threads people never thought they would have to ration healthcare. But here we are, in Idaho where the vax rate is really low, the hospitals are really full and they are beginning to ration healthcare according to the Associated Press article I read. But yeah sure, I’m gullible.

Whatever helps you sleep better at night.

https://apnews.com/article/business-health-public-health-coronavirus-pandemic-idaho-db21f9a14254996144e78aafb1518259 I’ll just leave this right here.

So is permanent lung damage and all the other stuff we don’t know.

Man I’ll tell ya, the medical and scientific communities really should have thought of a solution that could be widely dispersed to keep people out of hospitals and to keep people from getting severely ill with COVID. It’s too bad they couldn’t figure it out.

I thought you said this thread wasn’t about seatbelts…

Accelerate change or lose?

Died uniform question. What are the approved covers with the desert flight suit and with OCPs? I’ve had a desert floppy hat my whole career, worn it on every deployment since 1997. Has that gone the way of the dinosaur?

Misinformation, a lack of credible leadership and the fact you have to dig through a bunch of media sensationalized bullshit to try to find some semblance of facts to make your decisions. That’s why it’s split. There’s whole regions of the country who have bought into the vaccine. There’s whole regions of the country that reject it. The more one is surrounded by one narrative or the other, the more inclined one is to go with the flow. There’s a lot of strong group think out there and not a lot of critical thought.

I’m not talking about this specific issue. I’m just saying the CDC hasn’t really shown me much in general, especially as it relates to the last 18 months.

Don’t tease me

I would argue (maybe not argue, just point out) that mental illness is probably at root cause of violent crimes, domestic abuse, etc. We have a serious mental health problem in this country but people like to call it “gun violence” or whatever because we don’t know how to solve the mental health crisis behind it all. So yeah the CDC should play a role but they aren’t really showing me much lately.

There’s no parallels at all between seatbelt laws and vaccine mandates. Got it.

I agree 100%. The more data we have the better informed our decision making process. And, just to clarify I am anti-mandate, pro vaccine and “pro choice” when it comes to getting the shot. I just am seeing a lot of data that would, IMHO, point to the vaccine being a better idea for folks our age than to roll the bones for natural immunity and risk hospitalization especially when the hospitals are starting to fill up and in places like Idaho they are getting close to having to triage. That sucks. You want it, go get it. You don’t want to take it, don’t take it. There’s pros and cons to both decisions. I do wonder if the vaccine cocktails we’ve been given over the years have had some sort of byproduct positive effect in preventing/lessening the effects of COVID. Somebody posted about that earlier, maybe torqued or Brabus. I would love to see more info on that.

HD, the more data the better. They should have that as well. The more data there is, the better decisions people can make. It frustrates me that it comes out piecemeal. Agree to an extent on the seatbelt analogy…but if you die on the roadway you never take up a hospital bed. I guess you could end up pretty much in the same ventilated state though. There is increasing frustration in the healthcare community. The first wave it was mostly elderly people. This time around it’s younger people and they are hanging on longer, requiring a ton of care, you have to keep rolling them over to get air in their lungs…they are rolling out of the hospital with oxygen tanks to depend on for months. The hospital staffs are tired and many of them see these hospitalizations and ICU visits as preventable with vaccinations the same way they see traumatic head injuries being preventable with helmets and seatbelts. The vaccine, like the helmet or the seatbelt won’t save everyone every time or keep you out of the hospital every time. It’s not magic, sometimes it just doesn’t work, but it should help your odds. To your point I think some are starting to not feel bad about it. They are only human and they are exposed to this suffering day after day. As we all know here, that takes a toll. Many nurses and techs are leaving out of sheer exhaustion and those skills are hard to replace. Oh and yeah, of course big pharma is gonna milk it. 100%.

It’s an unknown amount sure, but that number seems significant. My RN wife sent me this from a hospital in Eastern Maine…I wish more hospitals provided this data. I also wish they included “previously infected” with the hospitalization data, but for now this is what they have. Also…looks like there’s a lot of unvaccinated “young and healthy” people on ventilators in Idaho unfortunately…and triage decisions may be close at hand sadly. https://apnews.com/article/business-health-coronavirus-pandemic-idaho-09941b507483a5c7b0183dcbf03a8254

We are trying to get there. I mean, everything is pretty much open up here in the northeast and the hospitalizations are pretty low because…get ready…. We have a ~70% vaccination rate up here. But what do I know. Nerd lol!

Exactly. Pretty much everything is open in my neck of the woods, except for the small businesses that can’t find help but that’s a whole ‘nother issue to argue about. With the exception of the minor inconvenience of occasionally wearing a mask in an airport and on base I have been traveling, working, flying, going to restaurants, playing hockey in my old guy league, etc. I’m with you hockeydork and I’ve said it all along. Get the shot, don’t get the shot, whatever you want to do. Your call…but know the facts, know the stats and know the ramifications.

Jesus help me. One more time for the people in the back… The vaccine does not prevent COVID. You can still get COVID if you’ve had the vaccine just like you can still get the flu if you’ve had the flu vaccine. The vaccine allows the immune system to mount a more effective response so you are far less likely to die, end up in the hospital or suffer long term damage from the disease. The vaccine also helps your body fight it faster so you are contagious for a shorter duration. It’s not that cosmic folks. Of course the case rate is gonna go up. They all got the vaccine and now they are back to Ops normal. But, what’s the rate of hospitalization between vaccinated and unvaccinated? What’s the intubation rate between the two? What’s the death rate? You need more than one crayon to paint this picture.

I think you’re on to something here…

https://www.edwards.af.mil/Portals/50/documents/AFD-131008-020.pdf?ver In my humble opinion, if you get accepted to Test Pilot School as a pilot you can log every airplane you flew there because…it’s Test Pilot School.

Same team Farva, same team… I know of two people here locally who have had Covid and have had their antibodies tested a bunch of times (because they are donating plasma) and their antibody levels are high enough even months after recovering that they can still use their plasma to treat patients. Im definitely NOT saying that if you think you’ve had Covid go ahead and call yourself good. Im also NOT talking about getting Covid again because we all know anyone can get Covid…vaxxed, unvaxxed, previously infected…it’s the level of severity and mortality that we are trying to tamp down right? What I’m saying is that there should be a way to determine the antibody levels of a previously infected person compared to a vaccinated person. Antibody Levels will likely vary from person to person but I do agree with my aforementioned airline pilots argument that, if his antibody levels exceed those of vaccinated people, why make him take the shot? What is the end goal? If it’s to make sure you have antibodies against the virus he has met that goal. Will the virus derived antibodies wear off? Sure. Will the vaccine wear off? Sure. Is there a rate in which that occurs? I don’t know.