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HuggyU2

Fingertip and Formation Landings

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On 5/13/2020 at 4:55 PM, MD said:

Miramar and Oceana are both 200’ wide runways, more than enough to do section T/O and landings in a Tomcat. Unless something had changed prior to their retirement, Tomcats regularly did section T/Os and landings.

Fair enough, I didn't even join the military until they were considered a threat aircraft so it was just a thought. 

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8 hours ago, VMFA187 said:

Fair enough, I didn't even join the military until they were considered a threat aircraft so it was just a thought. 

Its a reasonable thought though, as the Tomcat does have a heck of a wingspan when forward swept!

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16 hours ago, HuggyU2 said:

In the T-38?  Pretty sure you're wrong.  And no, we haven't been "lucky".  Same way you haven't been "lucky" you haven't killed yourself in whatever you fly.  You've worked hard at being good at it.  

No, I'm talking about all formation landing mishaps.  And yes, we have been LUCKY to have not had more fatalities.  How about the F-16 formation landing at Kunsan where #1 ended up in literally stuck in the fence?  Couldn't get out of the jet because the fence went over the canopy.  Stuck in a crashed jet with over a thousand pounds of fuel sitting a couple feet behind him.  Did skill keep that jet from catching fire and burning that pilot to death?  No, it was either God or luck.

 

I work hard to be the best pilot possible.  But I also know that I have been lucky.  I've made mistakes that could have or even should have gotten me killed.  I've had 3 high speed close passes inside 500' in my career, two of them I maneuvered the jet to avoid the mid-air.  The third one was plain dumb luck to have not hit and almost identical to a mishap that happened a few years later and killed one of the pilots.  I learn from the mistakes and do my best to not repeat them.  Doesn't mean that I'm a better pilot than other guys who weren't so lucky making the same mistake.

 

The fact that more people haven't died from something is not a reason to charge ahead like the risk doesn't exist.  Again, the argument is as simple as looking at where the majority of Class As happen in fighter type aircraft.  If I recall some of the the previous safety briefs correctly, if you combined takeoff/landing phase with midairs, I think you have close to, if not over, 50%.  Why combine two of the greatest risks for so trivial of a benefit?

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Was chatting with a fighter pilot tonight who told the story of his callsign. Basically he almost ran into another jet when his tire blew during a form land.




Sent from my iPhone using Baseops Network mobile app

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There was also a loss of directional control during a form takeoff at Sheppard two years ago that resulted in ejection. One of the pilots involved told me he remembered being directly under the other aircraft.

 

I believe many of these close calls are not captured in the stats.

 

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Speaking of formations... 😲😲 😲

If the "best of the best" can fuck it up, so can everyone else!

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Wanna fly a formation landing still but big blue cut you off?

 

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