FY 14 Force Management Program (RIF, VSP, TERA)

[StretchJr]

2008 11M... Previously was "referred to BPO" and just had movement on my app. Status is now "Referred to AFPC BPO Separations Supervisory Review" which is interesting since they claim they aren't processing until May 1. Possibly just getting all the apps to the last possible step? I have no idea. Any thoughts?

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[Mish_Hacker]

YGBSM! Why are they opening another TERA/VSP window, when they haven't even finished processing the first round??? How do they even know they'll need an additional window until they complete all the current applications...

113 - days since release of the first FY14 Force Management PSDM

68 - days since the VSP application window opened

15 - MORE days until they'll even look at the remaining applications, who have ADSC's, which are now waiverable…I hope this is worth the wait, prolly should have just applied for PC...

You'd think that all of our applications would have been ready for approval, pending the waiver. Then, one click and VSP approved....

Any other words on those folks who apparently already got approved with UPT ADSCs? If those are real, what reason is there to wait til 1 May on the rest?

[Pirot]

If I were them I wouldn't have gotten them ready either... Just like we didn't have to prep our RRF packages until after we knew we would be vulnerable for RIF. Oh wait.

[MooseDriver1]

You'd think that all of our applications would have been ready for approval, pending the waiver. Then, one click and VSP approved....

Any other words on those folks who apparently already got approved with UPT ADSCs? If those are real, what reason is there to wait til 1 May on the rest?

I have yet to hear directly from a confirmed pilot who received an ADSC waiver in person or on this forum

[Herk Driver]

This leads me to a question for Lt Gen Cox: Why are they waiting until after 1 May to process 2004-2008 11X applications? EVERY pilot in that time frame is going to have an ADSC from UPT. That would make it impossible to meet their force reeducation goals without waving an ADSC. I repeat, NO PILOT from 2004-2008 can be released without an ADSC wavier. So why make us wait even longer, continue to string our families along, impact our planning for military careers as well as potential civilian careers for a situation that isn’t going to occur.

02-03 11X’s, different story. Some will have ADSCs, some will not. But there is no reason why they can’t process 2004-2008.

I am a 2006 11M.

Did AFPC say that they wanted to zero out each year group in each AFSC? It really looks to me like they may look for a few more people in year groups that don't have ADSCs to get to the overall numbers. This would allow them to take an overage in some year groups that do have an ADSC. I could be wrong but it looks they are setting up for that scenario. I certainly hope I am wrong.

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Edited April 15, 2014 by Herk Driver

[MooseAg03]

Did AFPC say that they wanted to zero out each year group in each AFSC? It really looks to me like they may look for a few more people in year groups that don't have ADSCs to get to the overall numbers. This would allow them to take an overage in some year groups that do have an ADSC. I could be wrong but it looks they are setting up for that scenario. I certainly hope I am wrong.

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That's what it seems like to me. I just can't figure why they would eliminate higher numbers from the more experienced guys in their pilot force. You'd think they would want to match the overages they identified to keep from gutting the experience level.

Either way, I hear they are hurting for T-6 IPs and now they may create a shortage in the 11M world. It may mean good news for RPA guys like me trying to make it back into an airplane if VSP doesn't work out. But I'm sure big blue will find a way to crush my dreams.

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[lossofclocklossofdata]

That's what it seems like to me. I just can't figure why they would eliminate higher numbers from the more experienced guys in their pilot force. You'd think they would want to match the overages they identified to keep from gutting the experience level.

Either way, I hear they are hurting for T-6 IPs and now they may create a shortage in the 11M world. It may mean good news for RPA guys like me trying to make it back into an airplane if VSP doesn't work out. But I'm sure big blue will find a way to crush my dreams.

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Hmmm. Alpha tour to white jet tour. That'd really "broaden" my career.

[rbigred300]

I spoke directly with the 2007 c17 IP in my squadron that got vsp a week or so ago. He was the first and only vsp approved I have heard of for those with a upt adsc (he has five years). He submitted it in the initial wave and did not get it sent back.

[Herk Driver]

If only there were a knowledgeable person on the ways of A1 that was a BODN member. Although he has been conspicuously absent lately.

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[NotADude]

I hope this is worth the wait, prolly should have just applied for PC...

I don't know about that, the PC office has an epic backlog now. I ended up applying for VSP because getting the required paperwork together for PC was taking way too long. The only downside is now if they disapprove VSP, I'm behind the curve of the alleged 10-20 week wait for processing at the PC office. If I did my job this bad...

[Skitzo]

Yeah where has Chang been these days?

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[stract]

Chang is a nobody, why do you people keep asking for him? He's referring to Liquid.

[Bender]

Chang is a nobody, why do you people keep asking for him? He's referring to Liquid.

Chang is funnier than Liquid. All depends on what you're looking for...

Personally, I'd rather read Chang's account of how awesomely this has all gone. The previously posted email was almost there (i.e. only 48 hours before the retractions went out), but I know for a fact Chang can do better.

Now, if you all are actually looking for answers...sure, Liquid would be a much better choice.

Bendy

Edited April 16, 2014 by Bender

[MSCguy]

Liquid has been on the forum lately, but has been hanging out in the PME thread-probably safer over there.

[Skitzo]

What makes everyone think liquid has anything to do with A1?

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[panchbarnes]

Isn't there a congressman on this forum? Or is this not congressional worthy?

[Bender]

What makes everyone think liquid has anything to do with A1?

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Nobody said that, I don't believe. Were the words not, "knowledgable in the ways of"? He (among others) are likely more knowledgable in the ways of A1 than Chang.

Now if you need someone knowledgable in the ways of WarCraft, Chang's your man...unless you have a Nav or a TSO handy, then just go with what you have readily available. At least they stay and fight back when someone goes LeRoy Jenkins.

Bendy

Edited April 16, 2014 by Bender

[Skitzo]

Chang. Show yourself!

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[aerobat95]

So my application says

AFPC TFSC SDR View (DPTO) (Assigned on: 2/28/2014 7:56:00 AM)

Not exactly sure what that means but its been there for a month and a half now......

[MSCguy]

That means the blindfolded monkey running the show has put your app in the maybe pile. He will hang it up on the dartboard for a decision sometime in the near future.

[Dubs]

So my application says

AFPC TFSC SDR View (DPTO) (Assigned on: 2/28/2014 7:56:00 AM)

Not exactly sure what that means but its been there for a month and a half now......

Are you applying for TERA or VSP?

EDIT: I got antsy and called the TFSC to see where exactly my application was and I was able to confirm my application is indeed at the last stop before approval/disapproval (AFPC OFF Voluntary Separation Pay), but the technician said the only thing it said was "pending" and that she didn't know if I'd hear anything about it before 1 May.

Edited April 16, 2014 by Dubs

[Charlie17Chick]

E-mail from my CC said the status of my VSP App is awaiting my functional's input, but my CMS status says AFPC OFF Voluntary Separation Pay on 2/13/2014. No movement in 2 months, with the exception of uploading my additonal docs on 10 Apr by AFPC ENL Voluntary Separation Pay...weird that the Enlisted VSP branch would handle my docs. I know the incoming (Apr) functional, may be time to use the bro network...

[Charlie17Chick]

So I've gotta give credit to FLY6584 for giving me the idea, and I can completely understand how he wasn't able to read his question during the SECAF visit…they only had 5 during ours. I was tired of bitching about the VSP eligibility and decided to ask the SECAF myself while she came to visit our deployed location. Here was my question:

"Madam Secretary, thank you for taking my question regarding the FY14 Force Management Programs. On behalf of the 2,500 pilots in the 2005-2008 year groups who were identified for the RIF and voluntary programs, my question is on our VSP eligiblity. There are 415, or 16%, currently identified as a coverage in the Air Force, and many have sought to exhaust "voluntary" measures available, vice waiting for the "involuntary" boards. Many pilots have already been denied for VSP due to their Pilot Training service commitments, while others have been processing at AFPC since last month. It has been expressed that the waiver authority for our Pilot Training commitment resides with you, Madam Secretary, so we would like to know if you are expecting to waive these commitments for eligible volunteers? And, if we won't be waived, will this group still be expected to meet involuntary boards without being afforded the option of voluntary measures?"

Her answer: "I assume you are referencing the overages for the mobility pilots, because fighter pilots are currently undermanned. We just took a pause to relook at these programs, and you should be seeing some movement on the applications for those in overages soon"……..so, she didn't really answer the question specifically.

Final question: "To reference the first question, if someone is denied a voluntary program, are they expected to meet an involuntary board?"

Her response: "I would assume not. If they are eligible to volunteer, I don't know why we wouldn't let them and then send them to the boards. Am I correct? Let me ask my leaders (looks at the Generals in the front row). We'll have to confer with the personnel center and get back to you."

I'm not sure what answer I was expecting to hear, but I definitely got the 'Politician Special', vague and brief. I'm one of the lucky ones that still has my VSP application in the system (submitted at 0050CST), so I'm hanging on to hope. From the feel of the forum, I would definitely reapply if you have already been denied. If you want out that bad, what do you have to lose?

Other info of note:

• Use voluntary measures prior to involuntary boards
• Only 11,000-12,000 voluntary apps submitted (my guess is mostly pilots)
• Looking to cut 16,700 from AD in FY15
• 2x Involuntary boards, 13-15 months apart.
• If you meet the 1st board, you won't meet the 2nd unless from disciplinary actions

Specifics:

11M, 2005, ADSC through June 2017

So, no kidding, I believe that what I asked the SECAF is actually being addressed. First, UPT ADSC waivers are approved and delegated. Second, another TERA/VSP board for those officers who are RIF eligible to apply for voluntary programs prior to the board in Oct. Your welcome! https://www.af.mil/News/ArticleDisplay/tabid/223/Article/483997/af-opens-additional-tera-vsp-windows.aspx

[Fuzz]

Good on you for asking, still doesn't excuse the fact that this was a known problem by everyone from day 1 (and prior) and still took over 4 months to address.

[Dagoden]

TERA approved!

12R

2005

No adsc

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