Vision waiver info

[pittsdriver]

Thanks. My concern is the depth perception. I rarely passed the DP test while on active duty FC1, but went to Brooks and passed all those tests and was cleared. Joining the guard to fly RPAs and don't want the hassle of going back to Brooks. Some reason have a hard time with the circle tests in the box.

[deaddebate]

IIU still requires depth perception, but if you need a waiver, it's almost guaranteed.

[dvlax40]

Quick tip man.... find those magic illusion pictures that you stare at and see a hidden 3d object and practice on those if you have to go again, i went from struggling a civilian randot to completing it before they finished explaining the test

[Guest]

Thanks. My concern is the depth perception. I rarely passed the DP test while on active duty FC1, but went to Brooks and passed all those tests and was cleared. Joining the guard to fly RPAs and don't want the hassle of going back to Brooks. Some reason have a hard time with the circle tests in the box.

Going back to Brooks isn't really an option. It's at Wright Patt now.

[Kilabe26]

Deaddebate... so waivers for myopia (for both visual acuity and refraction error) are fairly easy to get? I didn't see the waiverable limits for visual acuity in the waiver guide, but I guess 20/80ish is pretty guaranteed for a waiver (mainly looking at Kaputt's situation)?

[81L BLR]

Waivers for myopia are usually very easy to get. There are no published waiver limits for visual acuity. 20/80 uncorrected distant vision is usually not a problem as long as the refractive error falls within the waiver limits.

[deaddebate]

Deaddebate... so waivers for myopia (for both visual acuity and refraction error) are fairly easy to get? I didn't see the waiverable limits for visual acuity in the waiver guide, but I guess 20/80ish is pretty guaranteed for a waiver (mainly looking at Kaputt's situation)?

Waivers for myopia are usually very easy to get. There are no published waiver limits for visual acuity. 20/80 uncorrected distant vision is usually not a problem as long as the refractive error falls within the waiver limits.

As 81L BLR said, the uncorrected visual acuity doesn't really matter. The focus is on your ability to correct to 20/20 and the strength of the vision Rx to get to that level (AKA the refractive error). There are a few other things I could say about waivers and testing, but I would be creating more silly questions by posting minimally relevant information. Long story short, I believe you're over-thinking this. Slow down, trust that the folks at MFS aren't trying to screw you over, and that they are the best Physical Standards folks in the Air Force.

And yes, waivers for "Excessive Refractive Error" are very common and usually approved without much trouble.

Edited April 1, 2015 by deaddebate

[Kilabe26]

As 81L BLR said, the uncorrected visual acuity doesn't really matter. The focus is on your ability to correct to 20/20 and the strength of the vision Rx to get to that level (AKA the refractive error). There are a few other things I could say about waivers and testing, but I would be creating more silly questions by posting minimally relevant information. Long story short, I believe you're over-thinking this. Slow down, trust that the folks at MFS aren't trying to screw you over, and that they are the best Physical Standards folks in the Air Force.And yes, waivers for "Excessive Refractive Error" are very common and usually approved without much trouble.

Waivers for myopia are usually very easy to get. There are no published waiver limits for visual acuity. 20/80 uncorrected distant vision is usually not a problem as long as the refractive error falls within the waiver limits.

As 81L BLR said, the uncorrected visual acuity doesn't really matter. The focus is on your ability to correct to 20/20 and the strength of the vision Rx to get to that level (AKA the refractive error). There are a few other things I could say about waivers and testing, but I would be creating more silly questions by posting minimally relevant information. Long story short, I believe you're over-thinking this. Slow down, trust that the folks at MFS aren't trying to screw you over, and that they are the best Physical Standards folks in the Air Force.And yes, waivers for "Excessive Refractive Error" are very common and usually approved without much trouble.

Thanks guys... Definitely puts me at ease!

[Lenny1107]

I currently fly fighters in the Marine Corps. I have been offered a job flying fighters in the ANG. My vision is 20/20 both eyes. My recent manifest distance without drops is OD: +1.25 -0.50 OS: +1.00 -0.75 However with Cycloplegic drops it is OD: +3.25 -0.50 OS: +3.00 -0.50 with an Astigmatism of REGULAR. I am obviously in limits with out the eye drops but with the eye drops I BELEIVE I am out of limitations for AF standards. My question is if I transition to the ANG, since I am going from a fighter jet to another fighter jet which type of flight physical will I need, a FCI or a FCII? My second question is, which category (i.e. Myopia, Hyperopia, or Astigmatism) am I actually out of limits on and is it waiverable or am I going to DQ? I have been told that our medical paperwork from the Navy/Marine Corps will no longer transfer over anymore and that all pilots coming to the AF must go to WRIGHT-PATT for a full up medical evaluation. Nothing would be worse then to give up 10 years of flying TAC AIR just to DQ an AF flight physical.

[deaddebate]

I currently fly fighters in the Marine Corps. I have been offered a job flying fighters in the ANG. My vision is 20/20 both eyes. My recent manifest distance without drops is OD: +1.25 -0.50 OS: +1.00 -0.75 However with Cycloplegic drops it is OD: +3.25 -0.50 OS: +3.00 -0.50 with an Astigmatism of REGULAR. I am obviously in limits with out the eye drops but with the eye drops I BELEIVE I am out of limitations for AF standards. My question is if I transition to the ANG, since I am going from a fighter jet to another fighter jet which type of flight physical will I need, a FCI or a FCII? My second question is, which category (i.e. Myopia, Hyperopia, or Astigmatism) am I actually out of limits on and is it waiverable or am I going to DQ? I have been told that our medical paperwork from the Navy/Marine Corps will no longer transfer over anymore and that all pilots coming to the AF must go to WRIGHT-PATT for a full up medical evaluation. Nothing would be worse then to give up 10 years of flying TAC AIR just to DQ an AF flight physical.

(Replace) 6.24.7.1. Pilots of fighter, rotary wing, fixed wing (non-fighter) aircraft transferring from sister service to an equivalent weapon system in the Air Force are considered trained assets. Air Force FCII standards apply. Complete all requirements for pilot’s age IAW PHA and ASIMS guidelines. This FCII physical will be entered into PEPP for baseline comparison and into AIMWTS if flying waiver required.

(Add) 6.24.7.2. Pilots of fighter, rotary wing, and fixed wing (non-fighter) transferring to AF from a different type of weapon system are not considered trained assets. Flying Class I standards apply. These pilots would require initial FCI physical and successful completion of MFS. This FCI physical will be entered into PEPP and into AIMWTS if flying waiver required.

You should only need the FC II retention standards if you are transferring to the same or similar platform. This is slightly open to interpretation, but generally equates to Fighters are Fighters, Heavies are Heavies, etc. I don't have the vision standards in front of me right now, but I'll check this tomorrow. I think you will need a waiver, which is likely to be approved. Dilated manifest is what counts. 81L BLR could elaborate, but it's my understanding that dilated exam is closer to your true refractive error. Edited April 2, 2015 by deaddebate

[deaddebate]

Some follow-up, looks like you won't need a waiver if you indeed do qualify for a FCII application (again, dependent on the airframe). If you do need a new IFCI, you don't meed waiver criteria and would probably be DQ'd. Stick with your current platform.

[Lenny1107]

I appreciate the information. I wonder if its even something LASIK could fix before I even transition, if its going to even be an issue. This stems from rumors about a new regulation that is apparently coming down from NGB that anyone coming into the AF, even from sister services, to fly even as rated pilots must go to Wright-Patterson for a flight physical. One would think that the DOD would be standard across the board with regards to aviation. Flying a fighter jet should be the same medical standard in any service.

[Kilabe26]

As 81L BLR said, the uncorrected visual acuity doesn't really matter. The focus is on your ability to correct to 20/20 and the strength of the vision Rx to get to that level (AKA the refractive error). There are a few other things I could say about waivers and testing, but I would be creating more silly questions by posting minimally relevant information. Long story short, I believe you're over-thinking this. Slow down, trust that the folks at MFS aren't trying to screw you over, and that they are the best Physical Standards folks in the Air Force.And yes, waivers for "Excessive Refractive Error" are very common and usually approved without much trouble.

DeadDebate and 81L BLR, what are the chances for an astigmatism waiver? I keep bouncing between 1.50 and 1.75... Is it just as easy to get as a myopia waiver?

[deaddebate]

That's well within the waive-able range. There's no worry here. If you're already getting the excessive refractive error, this will just be tacked on.

[Kilabe26]

That's well within the waive-able range. There's no worry here. If you're already getting the excessive refractive error, this will just be tacked on.

I know in the waiver guide, an astigmatism waiver apparently needs ACS review and evaluation. Therefore, does that elongate and/or hurt the chances of it getting approved (even if I tested somewhere in the waiver able range, i.e. 2.00)?

Also, what's the ACS Excessive Astigmatism Management Group?

[deaddebate]

I know in the waiver guide, an astigmatism waiver apparently needs ACS review and evaluation. Therefore, does that elongate and/or hurt the chances of it getting approved (even if I tested somewhere in the waiver able range, i.e. 2.00)?

Also, what's the ACS Excessive Astigmatism Management Group?

I can't say for certain, but I'm fairly confident is this will extend your waiver processing time a bit as it is reviewed at another office for recommendations, and the management group is most likely merely a tracking mechanism for studies. You'll get measured before UPT, then after, at your local MTF. A few extra steps, a little more time, but no concern over actual approval. Hopefully time is not a scarcity for you.

[Kilabe26]

Hi, I'm an OTS CSO-select and I just came out of my FC1A physical. Had a couple items that they said was waiverable (PRK, Height, and Depression) but the vision for my right eye near vision came out to 20/30 uncorrected and 20/25 corrected with lenses. They've submitted the package for approval but I was told that the 20/25 was unwaiverable. Any chance if they're wrong or recourse if the physical get shot down such as an ETP? Or is my only option to not pass Go and not collect $200?

What's your height?

[Guest]

Hi, I'm an OTS CSO-select and I just came out of my FC1A physical. Had a couple items that they said was waiverable (PRK, Height, and Depression) but the vision for my right eye near vision came out to 20/30 uncorrected and 20/25 corrected with lenses. They've submitted the package for approval but I was told that the 20/25 was unwaiverable.

No. You must correct to 20/20. You will absolutely be denied if you can't make that happen.

Went to a local optometrist right after my post to double check the prescription that the Flight Clinic gave me. They were able to correct my vision to 20/20 in both eyes with a different prescription. Will go to a second optometrist tomorrow to confirm and if confirmed, get the right glasses and retest.

In the meantime, I'm going to try to stop the Flight Doc from sending my packet out.

[futurepilot2011]

Got selected for an ANG pilot slot and I am just curious,

Had my eyes checked and they are 20/70 barely.

my prescription was

2014

o.d. -1.25 -0.50 axis 88

o.s. -1.55 -0.50 axis 77

2015

o.d. -75 -50 axis 85

o.s. -100 -50 axis 65

(two different doctors).

I fear I may need a waiver in some way or another for my FC1 for vision. Am I correct? How long will the waiver take if needed?

[Guest]

Got selected for an ANG pilot slot and I am just curious,

Had my eyes checked and they are 20/70 barely.

my prescription was

2014

o.d. -1.25 -0.50 axis 88

o.s. -1.55 -0.50 axis 77

2015

o.d. -75 -50 axis 85

o.s. -100 -50 axis 65

(two different doctors).

I fear I may need a waiver in some way or another for my FC1 for vision. Am I correct? How long will the waiver take if needed?

You are well within the waiver standard. This is a very common waiver. You will almost certainly need a waiver, you will almost certainly get approved. Because this is a simple excessive refractive error, it'll tack on only a few additional days of processing.

[futurepilot2011]

You are well within the waiver standard. This is a very common waiver. You will almost certainly need a waiver, you will almost certainly get approved. Because this is a simple excessive refractive error, it'll tack on only a few additional days of processing.

thank you!

[Kilabe26]

You are well within the waiver standard. This is a very common waiver. You will almost certainly need a waiver, you will almost certainly get approved. Because this is a simple excessive refractive error, it'll tack on only a few additional days of processing.

How long does it typically take to receive an approved astigmatism waiver (from when they submit it at MFS)?

Edited August 4, 2015 by Kilabe26

[Guest]

How long does it typically take to receive an approved astigmatism waiver (from when they submit it at MFS)?

You mean you went to MFS for an FC1, & the condition was found there? About 2-4 weeks after your last day at MFS.

[Kilabe26]

You mean you went to MFS for an FC1, & the condition was found there? About 2-4 weeks after your last day at MFS.

Are you (docs at MEPS or local ANG flight surgeon) able to submit a waiver if detected in MEPS? Or can the flight/vision waiver process only start post FC1?

Edited August 4, 2015 by Kilabe26

[Guest]

Typically, that isn't how it works. That's possible, but 95% of cases would be determined by MFS once at MFS after they clear you to be scheduled. In borderline cases, your local doc would provide additional documentation to make your case more favorable, but the waiver and physical are bound together. The waiver isn't approved separate of the physical.