[Track Selects and Assignment Nights]

KEND 22-03AH/AF

T-1

C-130H, Great Falls, MT ANG

C-130H, St. Joseph, MO ANG

C-130J, Little Rock

C-130J, Ramstein

HC-130J, Davis-Monthan

WC-130J, Keesler AFB, MS AFRC

C-17, Wright-Patterson AFB, OH AFRC

C-17, Charleston

C-17, McChord

C-17, McGuire

C-21, Ramstein

C-5M, Dover

C-5M, Travis

KC-135, Fairchild

KC-135, Kadena x2

KC-135, March

KC-135, Mildenhall x3

U-28, Hurlburt x2

T-38

A-10, Davis-Monthan

B-2, Whiteman

F-16, TBD x3

F-22, Eglin 

F-35, Luke

T-6, Vance

T-38A, Langley

[Guard/Reserve timeline to UPT]

On 11/9/2021 at 9:43 PM, CaptainMorgan said:

Yeah, but it’s probably only about a 3ish month difference for the heavy guys given that MAF fundamentals is substantially shorter than Phase 3 was.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

True, even funnier is that UPT 2.5 takes longer than 2.0. More hours and training requirements in both T-1 and T-38 tracks. I guess they produce unqualified pilots faster, but don’t push them through the bad any faster than legacy syllabi. At least we get more hours 

[Guard/Reserve timeline to UPT]

On 11/5/2021 at 8:59 AM, ryleypav said:

So to that end, with 2.5 since you get wings at the end of T6 now (correct me if I'm wrong) does that commitment still start at winging, or at the end of UPT? Unless end of T6 is considered end of UPT now at the 2.5 bases. 

Commitment starts with wings after T-6s

[Degradation of SUPT]

On 8/5/2021 at 12:36 AM, Sprkt69 said:

It seems failing/washing out has been pushed to the FTUs

Not at Vance. There have been a steady stream of CRs for months, and not too many have recovered back into the pipeline. 

[Degradation of SUPT]

On 7/26/2021 at 10:33 PM, BashiChuni said:

What’s the current pass rate rate thru UPT? Seems like in my neck of the woods you have a pulse, you graduate

17.7% wash out of T-6 2.5 syllabus. At KEND there have been a steady flow of CRs for months so I don’t doubt the number

[Degradation of SUPT]

On 7/22/2021 at 11:01 PM, BashiChuni said:

I’ll take that feedback with a HUGE GRAIN OF SALT

Why? The 2.5 studs should be a better product since they show up to T-1 and T-38 with 30+ hours of additional air under their asses compared to 2.0

[Degradation of SUPT]

On 7/22/2021 at 7:28 AM, pawnman said:

Makes it a lot harder to fail them out of Phase III. Turns It from a commander's decision and a handshake into an FEB.

Historically only 1.5% of studs wash out of T-1s and 0.9% out of T-38s. So we are talking literal handfuls, maybe, of studs getting through who otherwise might not. Except the T-6 syllabus now has more training requirements and 50% more flying hours, raising the attrition rate from 9% to 17% in Phase II. 

[Track Selects and Assignment Nights]

23 minutes ago, Royal said:

Six graduates? Are class sizes significantly smaller and drops happen more often or what?

I'm not sure about this class specifically. 6 went T-1 and 6 went T-38. I'm sure some were pushed forward and some were washed back. I know class sizes went up to 30 for subsequent UPT 2.5 classes, the first of which should drop in the next few weeks.

[Track Selects and Assignment Nights]

Vance 21-11 T-1

 

T-6 FAIP

C-17

EC-130H

AC-130J

C-130J

U-28

[Civilian Path to Wings]

6 hours ago, Air_Space said:

As far as I know yes but the new UPT 2.5 syllabus has students go straight from T-6 to -130 so who knows. I wouldn't be surprised to hear that the -1 only program isn't available for 130 people but who knows. Literally anything is possible right now it seems like

130 and U-28 folks are the only two platforms that can accept T-6 only right now. However at Vance the first 2.5 class will still track T-38/T-1.  Also fun fact the last T-6 2.0 flight at Vance took place yesterday.

To answer the OP, he'll go to Vance or Randolph. 

[UPT Segregation]

2 hours ago, Sprkt69 said:

What are they not liking about the program? 

I’m curious as to why they wouldn’t like it either. Only one check ride and they can use spare rides from Trans to use on Form if they need. Maybe they don’t like the early access academics.

[UPT Segregation]

2 hours ago, tac airlifter said:

I think racial segregation is a bad idea, ultimately destructive to unit cohesion and will degrade combat capability.  
 

Also curious if washouts from this class will “wash back” into regular UPT.

 

It’s not segregation or minority-only, it’s integrating more minorities to more accurately reflect national diversity rates. The only downside is that it’ll push a few white dudes back a few classes. Also it’s a standard UPT class (or 2.5 class if at Vance) so if they wash then there’s no second chance.

[UPT Segregation]

38 minutes ago, TreeA10 said:

What happens when this person gets to a squadron and finds that the majority of the squadron is genetically different?  Going to ask for help or going to wait for the squadron demographics to change? You have to fight with what you have where you find the fight not what you wish you had and where you wish you were.  I admit getting through the program is a foot in the door, which is great, but the education in UPT is more than just stick and rudder activation. 

They’ll probably live life in the squadron as a minority like they live most of their lives as a minority. I imagine no change, but I’m not a minority so I couldn’t say for certain

[UPT Segregation]

16 hours ago, jice said:

Totally agree with you. 

I’m skeptical of the rationale that’s being repeated in this thread re: the justification behind an “America Class.” No offense intended to student pilots, but has anybody in a position to speak to the decisionmakers’ rationale provided insight? “Checking washout rates” seems like a massive misunderstanding of social science and statistics or something coercive with subversively racist intent. (I have faith the latter isn’t the case and hope the former isn’t either... though “no class As for X years!... don’t notice all the Bs and Cs” doesn’t build confidence.) 

In any case, @brabus’s comment is a perfect reason that we shouldn’t let anybody (to include the young guns at work) see us roll our eyes at the seemingly clumsy and overtly progressive “first all XYZ ABC” stories. Those are exactly the reactions that give people confidence in saying “it’s going to be harder for you; don’t bother.” The only ones with actual SA are us. 

Gen. Mills said the rationale essentially is that UPT is tough and requires the class to work together and that when you’re the one minority in a class full of white guys, it may be somewhat more difficult to reach out for help when you need it when the people you reach out to aren’t like you.  
He worded it a lot better but that is the gist of the idea. He also admitted that it will naturally negatively affect the diversity of future classes but they are looking to see if there is a measurable effect on washout rates for minority students. 
 

I don’t think it’s a bad idea to try FWIW

[UPT Next]

14 hours ago, Danger41 said:

How long are guys sitting casual before starting UPT now? I think we should start those casuals on ground school immediately and get them some basic instructions before they start UPT and give them access to the sim building. Give them basics to develop their hands and some instruction for primacy and that way, they can start the syllabus ahead of most guys and trim time off of how long UPT takes. If the goal is truly to produce talented aviators, let the motivated ones work on it instead of some bullshit casual job. Get rid of syllabus deviation and shit like that and allow students to take care of events themselves ahead of time. Just rewrite those events to make them hours requirements and assign some IP’s to ensure they’re not going full stupid with what they’re doing. Then give them something like a checkride prior to UPT start to ensure they’re at a standard and start them on the syllabus. I honestly think with some basic instruction with this type of training you could cut out large portions of contact and local instrument sorties. 

Vance is already doing this with their new 2.5 classes. Studs get early access to academics and knock out several tests before their class actually starts.

[UPT Next]

16 hours ago, CharlieHotel47 said:

AMF topoff STUDs in Banzai are about done with T6 phase and the extra AMF stuff. Apparently the Toner banzai bros will have a shorter Toner phase similar to what is expected at 2.5. Not sure about the 38s.

 

This is correct.  Most are done with T-6 phase and will have the shortened Toner phase, though no one is sure exactly how short or long it will be. -38's are also getting a reduced syllabus but it doesn't sound like it's been finalized yet. Current Banzai studs have not been winged, but all classes going forward are expected to wing after T-6 phase.

[Those of you who have retaken the TBAS: how much did it affect your PCSM?]

On 8/2/2019 at 7:56 AM, Flyingsolo said:

Hey, 

 

Can anyone help me decide on what to study for the TBAS. I will continue to study the flash cards, but is there anything else that will help?

There isn't really anything else to study other than the flashcards.