Drawbacks of not going for a commission?

[Guest PalmettoGuy]

Hey folks,

I just graduated with a B.S. and have lately been thinking about enlisting in order to try out for a pararescue slot. However, it seems that everyone I talk to discourages me from enlisting and urges me to seek a commission. This includes a former Navy officer as well as a retired AF colonel who flew F-111's.

I have visited the specialtactics.com message boards (CCT/PJ's "Baseops.net") and have considered the advice given by those guys, however, I was also wanting to hear about the benefits/drawbacks from some current officers (any enlisted folks feel free to share as well). I know that officers get paid significantly more, and that they get more leadership experience earlier in their careers. But what other drawbacks are there?

Thanks ya'll

[Guest RamRod]

Do both...Become a CRO (Combat Rescue Officer)

Benifit: The pay is exceptionally better as an officer. This everyone knows.

Drawbacks: I have a couple of buds that went on into this career field and after talking to them it is a mix of commanding units in the field and battle staff tours. If you want to stay in the weeds all your life, the CRO might not be for you; however, I'm an outsider lookin' in so here is a website: http://www.specialtactics.com/crocriteria.shtml

You may have already found this section on Specialtactics.com but call the numbers and those guys can give you a better gauge of the mission and career field.

Good luck!

[Guest DangerousLT]

Unless it's changed recently, your chances of getting into pararescue are much greater if you're enlisted. There are very few slots available for CRO's.

As far as benifits... eh... yeah, the pay is better, but there's a lot of responsibility and bullshit "career broadening" that goes along with being an officer as well. That's all well and fine, as long as you buy into it.

If you're not interested in flying, it really boils down to two choices. Do you want to be an "operator", the guy who's job is to get shit done, who gets to do all the cool stuff, and not get paid as much? Or, second choice, do you want to be the guy that mostly spends time in the office, doing "leadership" stuff, and every once in a while heading out to do the mission... and getting paid more for it. Yeah, initially you'll spend a lot of time in the field as a CRO, but eventually...

Two worlds of thinking. BTW, I wouldn't limit myself to combat rescue. Depending on what your interests are (saving lifes vs. kicking ass), you might consider the other branches. Seals, Rangers, whatever. Each is equally respected.

[pcola]

Email Chuck Norris and ask what he'd do. After you get roundhouse kicked to the face (through the internet, no less), decide that you'd rather kick ass now and worry about money later and enlist. After your enlistment is up, become an officer and CRO.

[jcj]

pararescue is an enlisted career field and is exceptionally competetive. CRO is also exceptionally competetive and may (if not most) are prior enlisted PJ's who come back as officers.

[Guest ruckerstud]

My thoughts on passing up a non-flying commission

Drawbacks: you don't get paid as much, you get treated like an A1C fresh out of high school

Pros: You actually get to do what you signed on to do i.e. turn wrenches, pull triggers etc. You get treated like an A1C fresh out of high school.

[ 22. July 2006, 08:15: Message edited by: ruckerstud ]

[Guest mikedjp]

perspectives from a guy who enlisted with a BA who is now an officer.

Although I wasn't pararescue, I've known a few PJs and PJ washouts here is what I know:

The washout rate for pararescue is really high for various reasons, mostly physical/medical. Even if you work hard enough to finish the program, you can't control getting injured. So the question you need to ask yourself is if you don't mind doing 4 years enlisted in another career field in the event that you don't make it. That said if you can get excepted into OTS as a CRO and for some reason don't make it, then at least your an officer for the remainder of your career. (however you may get force shaped if you don't make it.) LIke others said the drawback to being a CRO as oppossed to a PJ is that after a couple of years you will do less operating and more managing. I would think being a CRO is awesome because you are managing the most professional airmen the USAF has to offer and your job is important because they need officers to go to bat for them at command levels. Another thing to think about is if you enlist as a PJ and make it, you will be much more competitive to go to OTS with a CRO slot. Or if you enlist and don't make it...you can cross train into another career field and then apply for OTS as a pilot or nav. There are tons of options. You could also consider applying for a guard or reserve unit that has PJs and a CRO or two.

[Guest KoolKat]

If you enlist as a PJ and make it, I don't think you'd wanna do anything else.

At least not in the sense that is being dicussed here.

BENDY

[Guest croftfam]

Okay, I work with PJ's and CRO's everyday. If you want to operate, go PJ. If you want to train with the PJ's, but not "operate" in the sense that you are the one hacking the mish with a gun in your hand, then go CRO. CRO's do not, I repeat, do not deploy on the helo with the PJ's unless it is in a mission management position. The PJ's do the work, and the CRO's do the dirty fight-for-the-PJ's-needs work. They train, get the same certs, and get almost as much medical training as the PJ's, but they are not going to be operators like the PJ's.

Somebody brought up a good point on the injury/washout rate. You have a better chance as an officer than an enlisted guy. Getting into the rescue program as an officer is much easier than on the enlisted side. They NEED officers, so starting the program on the O side is easier. Finishing is not always so easy. You will be looked at under a higher power microscope, so prepare now.

Just my $.02

EDIT: Let me clarify. Having talked with many senior PJ's and CRO's many times on this exact subject, I know a lot about it, but no where near all.

CRO's mission says they will be operators. Have I talked with any CRO's that have been out in the field with the PJ's FR'ing out of the helo, or climbing up the rope, or securing the LZ? No, nor have I talked with any other guys that have talked with any CRO's that have.

PJ's don't want their CRO's out their with them for the actual mish. They love training with them, and look up to them, but know that they are the guys doing the admin "garbage" portion of the job.

Hope that clears it up.

[ 23. July 2006, 10:46: Message edited by: JorryFright21 ]

[Guest croftfam]

Not to bring up it up again, but I will.

I talked to our PJ's last night for you. CRO's oftentimes think that they are PJ's, and that they will be deploying with the teams often. Not the case. They can jump with the team, but only when they absolutely need them (not very often). They echoed my thoughts though on the mission management part. They are there for command and control and to act as a liason for the PJ's. It is a lot better when an officer explains to some O-6 why it is that they can't do something specific than when a SrA or even a SSgt tries to explain it. They usually get the stiffarm.

Also, I was wrong on the medical training part. They get SABC and that is about it! Anyone on here can do SABC.

[Guest viper24]

Jorry...I think you have some good points, but some wrong ones as well. My bro is a CRO and hes in the weeds with the PJs some times, like right now in Iraq. True, its not every day, but they do go out and operate with the E side of the house. Maybe its because he was 14 years in the E side as CCT and PJ, but CROs do go in the field and "play".

PalmettoGuy, if you want, PM me and I can hook you up with my bros email. He said he will answer any questions he can. Good luck with whatever you decide.

[Guest croftfam]

Originally posted by viper24:

Jorry...I think you have some good points, but some wrong ones as well. My bro is a CRO and hes in the weeds with the PJs some times, like right now in Iraq. True, its not every day, but they do go out and operate with the E side of the house. Maybe its because he was 14 years in the E side as CCT and PJ, but CROs do go in the field and "play".

This is probably the number one complaint of every PJ I've talked with. The CRO's that used to be PJ's think they are still PJ's. They force themselves into the mission where they are not needed/wanted. Like I said, they can deploy on a mission (of course they deploy to the desert with them) with them, but it is a rarity.