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Promotion and PRF Information


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22 hours ago, CaptainMorgan said:


No A-code time required for an ATP. SIC on an airplane that requires 2 pilots counts in the FAA’s eyes.


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Ya, you right. 

 

On 5/26/2022 at 5:28 PM, Danger41 said:

Out of curiosity, are you the guy that got U-28’s and went on a Facebook tirade about how shitty that community is? 

Link or screen shot? 

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13 hours ago, viper154 said:

Ya, you right. 

 

Link or screen shot? 

I would assume, like most things AFSOC, it was about not getting taken care of career-wise. The command is good at grooming officers on their HPO list but not so much the middle majority that continuously deploys. I dont think U28s are alone in that matter. 

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I don’t. The only thing that reminded me was that individual and this story talked about EFMP for a kid and how that caused problems for his career.

And it was about how he wanted gunships but got “this piece of shit” lol. Then went on to just go off about the community etc. Unfortunate scenario of getting caught up in emotions and realizing he didn’t have what it took to be flying something requiring one engine and two massive balls.

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1 hour ago, BeefBears said:

I would assume, like most things AFSOC, it was about not getting taken care of career-wise. The command is good at grooming officers on their HPO list but not so much the middle majority that continuously deploys. I dont think U28s are alone in that matter. 

Well aware, U28 community did not do well on this last major board, well below the rated average. 

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6 minutes ago, viper154 said:

Well aware, U28 community did not do well on this last major board, well below the rated average. 

Really?  That kinda surprises me given that on a day-to-day basis that community is doing its primary mission, more so I’d argue than the AC/MC/CVs are (understanding that AFSOC’s day in the sun is over and there’s a bias in the command to all things STS and C-130).  What do you think is the primary driver for the below average promotion rates?

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The SEALs of the Sky comment from 15 years ago.

But seriously, I don’t know. I do know that one squadron was 4/11 on guys making Major which is just obscene and should have raised some kind of red flag one would think. I’d heard it’s because the ops squadrons are constructed in a somewhat unique manner for training with R&D shops and White Cell etc and that doesn’t translate to the Comm Officer on the promotion board. No clue how true that is but this board is a travesty and slap in the face to the Draco community.

It’ll do wonders for the vibe about being the red headed stepchildren and feeling like AFSOC doesn’t like them.

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4 hours ago, DirkDiggler said:

That kinda surprises me given that on a day-to-day basis that community is doing its primary mission, more so I’d argue than the AC/MC/CVs are 

Doing the mission does not matter. Having thousands of combat hours and dozens of air medals does not matter. Risking your life does not matter. Killing the enemy does not matter.

The Air Force does not promote pilots for doing pilot things. The Air Force promotes pilots for doing things that they could hire people for minimum wage to do. 

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1 hour ago, DirkDiggler said:

Really?  That kinda surprises me given that on a day-to-day basis that community is doing its primary mission, more so I’d argue than the AC/MC/CVs are (understanding that AFSOC’s day in the sun is over and there’s a bias in the command to all things STS and C-130).  What do you think is the primary driver for the below average promotion rates?

The rate was about 65%.  I’m not sure why it happened; there were some clean kills with DEROG but many were solidly in the middle of YG packs.  I’d need to know more about the command rates to determine if U-28s hit low or if AFSOC writ large fared poorly.  

1 hour ago, BrightNeptune said:

Having thousands of combat hours and dozens of air medals does not matter. Risking your life does not matter. Killing the enemy does not matter.

You’re right so far as USAF career advancement matters, but I disagree those things do not matter.  They matter to anyone who is an actual warrior, and we still have them around despite organizational efforts.

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The Air Force doesn’t care about anything other than the strat on your OPR. I can guarantee that every aircrew member has done more and made more sacrifices than any nonner out there. We got into this mentality that everyone is the tip of the spear thanks to that tard Welsh, and won’t recover anytime soon.


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The Air Force doesn’t care about anything other than the strat on your OPR. I can guarantee that every aircrew member has done more and made more sacrifices than any nonner out there. We got into this mentality that everyone is the tip of the spear thanks to that tard Norty, and won’t recover anytime soon.


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FIFY. You’re not going back far enough. Hell, I’m probably not going back far enough.
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8 hours ago, SurelySerious said:


FIFY. You’re not going back far enough. Hell, I’m probably not going back far enough.

I know a lot of people don’t like Fingers but I think he did his very best to undo the damage Norty and Welsh did (mostly Norty).  Under Fingers there was a focus on the squadrons, elimination of BPZ and school selects, reduced rated manning on staffs etc. Cultural changes and frozen middle management take time to overcome unfortunately.  Not really sure about the current chief, seems more about talk and optics.  

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I feel like I'm out of the loop, but at what year did promotion to O4 stopped becoming "100%"??

I know this isn't 100% true, but I see a "successful" exec/CAG/XO/Aide tour as key to getting that coveted strat and assignment, and this is what I've seen across all services/branches. 

I also know some people might look down on these kind of assignments but it's a really educational experience that will either serve you well as you progress in rank and responsibility, or influence your decision to not play the promotion game.  This system has been around since the Army Air Corps days and it's not going to change.

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1 hour ago, panchbarnes said:

...exec/CAG/XO/Aide tour...

...play the promotion game...  

Do you know what all of those positions have in common? They don't fly and suck at executing the mission. The Air Force spent millions of dollars teaching them how to perform a combat mission. The Air Force did not spend millions of dollars to make them secretaries, which is what those positions are.

Some of us refuse to play the game. I knew the Air Force was broken when they described the (old) EPR process to us at OTS. Any organization that supported that, or supports the current system is irreversibly broken. SOS only confirmed this. Remember the "Color of Money" game? I felt like I was taking crazy pills when I explained how F'd up that was.

The Air Force does not exist to win wars. The Air Force exists to promote people that do busy work and tow the company line.

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19 hours ago, Danger41 said:

I’d heard it’s because the ops squadrons are constructed in a somewhat unique manner for training with R&D shops and White Cell etc and that doesn’t translate to the Comm Officer on the promotion board.

This right here is one of the serious cultural flaws we have in the AF. Cannot count how many times I’ve been told “we need to write the OPR/PRF/1206 so the personnel/finance/insert noner AFSC can understand”…bullshit. They need to be educated enough about the REAL mission of the service that when a flyer OPR/PRF gets put in front of them they know what they’re looking at and don’t just go “eh, I don’t understand this so I’m going to give it a poor score”. Maybe if our PME spent more time talking about the real mission and less about the cultural fad of the day we wouldn’t have this problem…but I suppose that’s a pipe dream. 

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We have separate boards now.  Blaming it all on the one person who isn’t rated isn’t the reason why these dudes didn’t get promoted.  I suggest you all watch the video on YouTube on how they conduct these boards.  When they grade records If anyone in the group is two or more points off from each other they have to discuss and make up the difference.  Here’s the link.

 

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2 hours ago, Chromedome said:

 Here’s the link.

 

I'm curious how the board process has changed/if at all with the shift to the 2-line PRF, elimination of BPZ/IPZ/APZ and new stratification criteria. WRT bullets being readable to all career fields, I've seen recent feedback from a NAF to try and avoid acronyms to enhance general readability...at what point to CCDR/CCMD, hell even TDY become "standard" acronyms? Isn't the purpose of line operational units to provide combat mission ready forces to combatant commanders? 

There should be  a APFC owned publication similar to the AFTTP 3-2.5 or DOD Style Issuance Guide with common use acronyms that DAF can point to and say to use this. But that would make too much sense and take away people's subjective "in my experience" say.  

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1 hour ago, Chef16 said:

I'm curious how the board process has changed/if at all with the shift to the 2-line PRF, elimination of BPZ/IPZ/APZ and new stratification criteria. WRT bullets being readable to all career fields, I've seen recent feedback from a NAF to try and avoid acronyms to enhance general readability...at what point to CCDR/CCMD, hell even TDY become "standard" acronyms? Isn't the purpose of line operational units to provide combat mission ready forces to combatant commanders? 

There should be  a APFC owned publication similar to the AFTTP 3-2.5 or DOD Style Issuance Guide with common use acronyms that DAF can point to and say to use this. But that would make too much sense and take away people's subjective "in my experience" say.  

I’m not sure it has changed all that much with all those changes.  What I have noticed is that some career fields have benefited from separating all the line of the Air Force career fields and it has hurt some.  In the combat support category, folks who normally would have promoted when we were all lumped together are not making the cut.  Seems to be more competitive now.  

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On 5/28/2022 at 11:24 AM, DirkDiggler said:

Really?  That kinda surprises me given that on a day-to-day basis that community is doing its primary mission, more so I’d argue than the AC/MC/CVs are (understanding that AFSOC’s day in the sun is over and there’s a bias in the command to all things STS and C-130).  What do you think is the primary driver for the below average promotion rates?

I’ll be totally honest, I’m probably not the most qualified or knowledgeable to answer that, but all the people that have responded seem to hit the nail on the head. 

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  • 3 weeks later...
5 hours ago, Slow-Smooth-Fast said:

Yes, select and non-select, myself the latter.

Sorry to hear that brotha. Definitely been there. Passed over like 4 times guessing I will get told the same again. Hang in there. For me it’s been a blessing in some ways. Fwiw, I am flying the line more and still going on TDYs and flying deployments and ended up getting a good fini-assignment where my peers did not. 

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Gotta be some kinda record for the system… seems like this board just got done like what mid-March? Three and a half months is wicked fast. Hope they keep that standard going. Waiting sucks.

Chuck

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