Promotion and PRF Information

[General Chang]

First, congrats to those that made the list. If you defied the odds by making it, remember the rule on luck and timing.

The exec dilemma. Execs do learn something. First is that by doing the job, they usually get a good paper. That means promotion. The rest is politics and commander whims on why they think the way they do. But that may or may not make said exec a better leader as it depends on the person and the commander. But it is a highly successful pathway to bigger things. I say that we need to push our best people into those jobs, and if we know our best people, they usually won't want it nor like it. But if we don't, then the shoes will seek those jobs for the sake of making grade, because they suck in the plane. That is a way to get our top dudes into jobs to make the force better. So the next time you see a shoe make a dive for the job, out maneuver them by pushing your top aviator/leader into the job instead. Keep the shoes (Changs) out. And then constantly remind them to not get brainwashed.

Good luck and out!

Seriously???

Guys, keep your head down, do your absolute best where you're planted, and multiple exec jobs will seek you out. Keep doing well, and you'll continue on to higher-level exec and aide jobs over multiple years. And yes, schools and promotions will follow. The AF only sends their best to these jobs; hence, the rewards at the end of the rainbow.

[disgruntledemployee]

Seriously???

Guys, keep your head down, do your absolute best where you're planted, and multiple exec jobs will seek you out. Keep doing well, and you'll continue on to higher-level exec and aide jobs over multiple years. And yes, schools and promotions will follow. The AF only sends their best to these jobs; hence, the rewards at the end of the rainbow.

Ha ha! I caught one! Men, I suggest you turn on your Chang squelch.

Elders, you know what I meant by my advice.

Out

[herkbum]

Seriously???

Guys, keep your head down, do your absolute best where you're planted, and multiple exec jobs will seek you out. Keep doing well, and you'll continue on to higher-level exec and aide jobs over multiple years. And yes, schools and promotions will follow. The AF only sends their best to these jobs; hence, the rewards at the end of the rainbow.

This now officially confirms Chang's troll status.

[11F]

Guys, keep your head down, do your absolute best where you're planted, and multiple exec jobs will seek you out. Keep doing well, and you'll continue on to higher-level exec and aide jobs over multiple years.

Chang, you have to read what you just wrote. If I were to paraphrase, "A high potential USAF officer should desire to be an aide or exec in at least a group, wing, and NAF leve, maybe more."

Aide and exec gigs are great learning experiences, but one year of one is enough. Other than that, let these HPOs execute their primary duties that the USAF hired them to do and bring their aide/exec lessons learned into the squadrons.

You can't just be an aide/exec for one-third of your career. I'm guessing you were a squadron or group exec once and that's about it.

[di1630]

Being an exec has NOTHING to do with leadership potential. My wife was an exec, and damn good, much better than the pilots (all top notch people) she was an exec with. Guess why? Because she had worked in college as a secretary.

An exec position is nothin more than a glorified secretary. Sure, you are asked the occasional input by your boss, but that could come from anyone else, you are just the easiest to ask.

In the end, being an exec, DS etc, is nothing more than a secretary job where you get the education of watching a dysfunctional bureaucratic organization like the USAF work its magic thanks to hardworking tactical operators and gobs of cash and resources.

If the USAF started promoting people it needed to be leaders instead of the bullied high schooler who finally got a taste of power in ROTC and learned if he kissed enough ass and filled squares he could someday be in charge.

We'd have less Chang's, less people making exec and worthless schools a goal and more warrior minded leaders who gave a shit about things other than their rise in the ranks of big blue.

Edited February 13, 2015 by di1630

[Gravedigger]

I was an OG exec. It was a shit ton of work, but I gained more "leadership" experience from that job than from any other job I've had. Giving direct feedback to squadron commanders as a Captain can be a challenging leadership experience. It's also interesting to see how decisions are made and implemented at all levels. My former boss is now a GO, so that doesn't hurt either. I don't know how other organizations work, but I've never seen an exec picked for secretarial experience. In my experience, squadrons typically nominate quality people for execdom. I know that's not the case everywhere, but damn people sure are cynical about execs around here.

[one1]

An exec position is nothin more than a glorified secretary. .

Being an exec is not the same as being a secretary. If you are an exec and you are only performing duties a secretary would do, then your are doing it wrong. Someone in a position to have an exec usually has a secretary in the first place. If you are an exec doing secretary work, the boss either isn't utilizing you correctly, or doesn't trust you enough to do the job.

Edited February 14, 2015 by one1

[DirkDiggler]

I was an OG exec. It was a shit ton of work, but I gained more "leadership" experience from that job than from any other job I've had. Giving direct feedback to squadron commanders as a Captain can be a challenging leadership experience. It's also interesting to see how decisions are made and implemented at all levels. My former boss is now a GO, so that doesn't hurt either. I don't know how other organizations work, but I've never seen an exec picked for secretarial experience. In my experience, squadrons typically nominate quality people for execdom. I know that's not the case everywhere, but damn people sure are cynical about execs around here.

I gained more "leadership" experience from leading a crew in combat and MSN/CCing TDY ops in multiple countries than I ever did in my exec job. To each his own I guess.

[C-21.Pilot]

I gained more "leadership" experience from leading a crew in combat and MSN/CCing TDY ops in multiple countries than I ever did in my exec job. To each his own I guess.

Unfortunately, in today's Air Force, being tactically savvy and leading from the front plays second best to those execs who are nibbling at the teet of the SQ/OG CC....

I can tell you that where I am at, the Exec is a secretary and known as the worst pilot in the SQ with poor leadership skills.

[DirkDiggler]

Unfortunately, in today's Air Force, being tactically savvy and leading from the front plays second best to those execs who are nibbling at the teet of the SQ/OG CC....

I can tell you that where I am at, the Exec is a secretary and known as the worst pilot in the SQ with poor leadership skills.

I'm in school now, didn't do my exec job till after I was a select so I don't think that statement is accurate across all communities

[tac airlifter]

Unfortunately, in today's Air Force, being tactically savvy and leading from the front plays second best to those execs who are nibbling at the teet of the SQ/OG CC....

I can tell you that where I am at, the Exec is a secretary and known as the worst pilot in the SQ with poor leadership skills.

Don't speak for the whole AF bro; leading from the front, being an expert operator and killing the enemy is still a priority in SOF. Sorry you're in a bitch community. Edited February 14, 2015 by tac airlifter

[matmacwc]

Leaders aren't supposed to keep their heads down.

[Gravedigger]

I gained more "leadership" experience from leading a crew in combat and MSN/CCing TDY ops in multiple countries than I ever did in my exec job. To each his own I guess.

I know this sounds crazy, but for me the ops stuff was the easy part. You go through a ton of training and spend a lot of time studying and doing your primary job as an Lt, with very little else to worry about. So, while being a mission commander was definitely the most fun leadership job I had, it didn't really teach me much I hadn't seen before. The exec job was the exact opposite. It was totally foreign and unnatural to me, and that is what made it so challenging and rewarding in the end.

I don't think being an exec makes me or anyone else better than anyone, it is just a different perspective than most CGOs get to experience, which can be very beneficial moving forward.

[backseatdriver]

So, while being a mission commander was definitely the most fun leadership job I had, it didn't really teach me much I hadn't seen before.

When you and Dirk say "Mission Commander" I'm fairly confident you're not talking about the same things.

[Mark1]

I don't love Chang either, but he is right on one thing. Exec and aide jobs lead to schools and promitions. I think the single biggest factor in a promotion is who you work for and when you work for that person. Primary job performance, strats, DGs, etc only matter so much when you aren't in a key position. Guess what, if you are the aide to some General, you are going to be promoted and will go to school. That is a fact. So if you want to be promoted, get those jobs.

The lack of S.A. and general comprehension associated with this post makes my brain hurt.

[di1630]

Being an exec is not the same as being a secretary.

That's what the USAF would have you believe because you are given a #1 strat and sent to a worthless school as a reward for your outlook skills, OPR organizing and deciding to put the USAF bureaucracy #1.

In the real world, exec duties are done by secretaries. And in not knocking secretaries, it's just not why I joined the AF. Here's the definition.

(USAF exec) A secretary, personal assistant, or administrative assistant is a person whose work consists of supporting management, including executives, using a variety of project management, communication, or organizational skills. These functions may be entirely carried out to assist one other employee or may be for the benefit of more than one. In other situations a secretary is an officer of a society or organization who deals with correspondence, admits new members, and organizes official meetings and events.

-sounds a lot like exec duties to me.

[Dupe]

I don't know how other organizations work, but I've never seen an exec picked for secretarial experience. In my experience, squadrons typically nominate quality people for execdom. I know that's not the case everywhere, but damn people sure are cynical about execs around here.

A really good WG/CC told me this about how he picks his exec:

"I solicit for volunteers and I ask the SQ/CCs who they think should be sent up. I then ignore all that crap and interview the top 3-5 guys on the rack and stack. I find the best exec is usually someone who didn't volunteer and a guy who the SQ/CC was trying to hide from exec duty. I always give my exec a 1, 2, or 3 strat."

[Gravedigger]

In the real world, exec duties are done by secretaries.

(secretary description)

-sounds a lot like exec duties to me.

No, that sounds like what the squadron/group/wing secretaries do. If your units have used execs solely to perform secretarial work, that's a shame.

When you and Dirk say "Mission Commander" I'm fairly confident you're not talking about the same things.

Not the point, but I'll bite. I'm also fairly confident we're talking about different things, but the common ground is leading a group of Airmen conducting ops that directly contribute to national security and saving lives. If you think that only happens in the flying world, you're mistaken. Our mission commanders lead crews of young Airmen operating multi-billion dollar satellite constellations that the DoD, President, and entire world depend on. Do you know what would happen if we lost GPS, even for a minute? How many other Air Force missions do billions of people depend on every day?

I don't think leading a crew from the safety of an ops floor in Colorado is the same as being a flight lead, especially in combat, but it's not any less important.

Edited February 14, 2015 by Gravedigger

[di1630]

Somebody please tell me these super awesome exec duties that I missing? Granted, execs do more than the GS-6 secretary, I get that.

But in the end, proofreading OPRs, writing eSSS' for staffing, making schedules, organizing paperwork...

That's what a good secretary does in the business world.

The sad part is reading on here how many people are buying the "become an exec, get a strat, go to school, guaranteed O-5, don't rock the boat, make your bosses goals "your" goals to succeed" bullshit.

And we wonder why many of our current leaders can't speak with credibility, can't identify with the masses and why a ton of good leaders go guard/reserve and say f-you to the system that promotes mediocrity instead of actual leadership.

Because the guy slugging it out on line, doesn't get stratted because while he's teaching tactics in the bar, talking with the young guys, the careerist pussy is hobnobbing with leadership knowing that hard work only matters in the USAF when seen.

That's the issue.

[Danny Noonin]

Guess what, if you are the aide to some General, you are going to be promoted and will go to school. That is a fact. So if you want to be promoted, get those jobs.

Newsflash...if you get picked to be an aide de camp or a 2-star or better's exec, you were getting promoted anyway.

[HossHarris]

No, that sounds like what the squadron/group/wing secretaries do. If your units have used execs solely to perform secretarial work, that's a shame.

Not the point, but I'll bite. I'm also fairly confident we're talking about different things, but the common ground is leading a group of Airmen conducting ops that directly contribute to national security and saving lives. If you think that only happens in the flying world, you're mistaken. Our mission commanders lead crews of young Airmen operating multi-billion dollar satellite constellations that the DoD, President, and entire world depend on. Do you know what would happen if we lost GPS, even for a minute? How many other Air Force missions do billions of people depend on every day?

I don't think leading a crew from the safety of an ops floor in Colorado is the same as being a flight lead, especially in combat, but it's not any less important.

We are, after all, Warriors each and every one.

(Off to collect my participation trophy)

[Duck]

I was an exec for two commanders. Not by choice. One was the best commander I ever had and one was the absolute worst. Both of them at the end of the day would pour a glass of scotch and mentor me. Throughout the week they would also call me into their office tell me what they were thinking and ask my opinion. Occasionally I had the opportunity to save the squadron from a morale busting mandatory morning formation run (etc).

Bottom line I learned just as much about how to not be a commander from the bad one as I learned how to take care of people (promotions, assignments, etc) from the good one. I also learned that while I was just flying the line I didn't always have the big picture (and sometimes neither did they as the CC).

The good commander got tired of the BS and left for the airlines. The bad is now an O-6 school dude.

[DirkDiggler]

I know this sounds crazy, but for me the ops stuff was the easy part. You go through a ton of training and spend a lot of time studying and doing your primary job as an Lt, with very little else to worry about. So, while being a mission commander was definitely the most fun leadership job I had, it didn't really teach me much I hadn't seen before. The exec job was the exact opposite. It was totally foreign and unnatural to me, and that is what made it so challenging and rewarding in the end.

I don't think being an exec makes me or anyone else better than anyone, it is just a different perspective than most CGOs get to experience, which can be very beneficial moving forward.

I'll agree with the last part of your statement there, that being an exec gives you a different perspective. For the me the exec job was learning how the daily administrivia sausage making process of a unit functions, nothing more, nothing less.

What it wasn't was leadership. Its been mentioned a lot in other threads but there's a serious trust issue between the rank and file and upper level leadership. A lot of people in the AF have a very difficult time differentiating between leadership and management and this is one of the sources, among others, of this mistrust. From my experience and the input of my bros, exec jobs show you the daily processes necessary for a unit to function. The exec job only offered snippets of true learning about true leadership. The higher level exec jobs will give guys exposure to higher level sausage making and those guys will get to see senior leaders make decisions, but those execs aren't deciding anything nor are they exercising leadership.

The Marine exchange officers here at the wayward school by the river vary from bemused to saddened by AF efforts to define, describe, and discuss leadership. The Marines have a very focused and defined way of discussing leadership and leadership attributes. When the Marines talk about leadership and leadership case studies they never start inside the exec shop.

[ThreeHoler]

make your bosses goals "your" goals to succeed" bullshit

Because railing against your boss is such a good idea...

Making your boss's goals for the organization your goals for the organization is the right thing to do.

You can argue in private, but at the end of the day, you need to support your boss in public.

[dream big]

Because the guy slugging it out on line, doesn't get stratted because while he's teaching tactics in the bar, talking with the young guys, the careerist ###### is hobnobbing with leadership knowing that hard work only matters in the USAF when seen.

That's the issue.

FWIW, the best C130 instructor I ever had WAS the guy teaching tactics in the bar to LTs, he was also the wing exec yet one of the most proficient pilots I've met. He's a school select now and a U2 driver.

Not sure why being tactically proficient and getting promoted/checking boxes is mutually exclusive.