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The WOKE Thread (Merged from WTF?)


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2 hours ago, kaputt said:

I asked a buddy who flies 38s with the Raptors if he had heard any rumblings about this guy. 
 

“Oh yeah, everyone here says that guy was an awful pilot.”

And...

”Apparently he Q3’d an evaluation up at Elmendorf so they sent him to IFF”

So yeah, there’s more to the story. 

😮This is my shocked face. 
 

So now we know he's a shitty pilot and human being. Newsflash: the raptor demo pilot ONE DEMO TEAM AGO was a black guy. 
 

 

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Wokeness training is cancelled. Signed - POTUS.  https://www.whitehouse.gov/wp-content/uploads/2020/09/M-20-34.pdf   

Did anyone really believe he would get a fair trial or impartial jury?  Dude was good as guilty before the opening statements started.  He'd have been better off fleeing the country.     To

I've taken part in use of force scenario training a few times, and each time I had my eyes opened a little wider to what law enforcement deals with. If your local department ever offers it, please tak

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Duckworth to vote No on any cabinet member who isn’t “diverse”
https://www.yahoo.com/news/duckworth-threatens-biden-nominees-over-210241753.html

So you’re going to vote solely on one particular immutable characteristic? Weird. 

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19 hours ago, Pooter said:

Sorry dude, I know it hurts. But it's happened to white dudes too. In fact.. almost exclusively white dudes. 

I thought the exact same thing when I read that article.  I was told the same thing as him.  In UPT I was "cocky and talked too much" and in MQT "I wasn't confident enough and never talked".  It is amazing that until I read his story, I never realized that my instructors were not providing me valuable feedback to find the middle ground but were, in fact, just being racist.

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3 hours ago, Pooter said:

😮This is my shocked face. 
 

So now we know he's a shitty pilot and human being. Newsflash: the raptor demo pilot ONE DEMO TEAM AGO was a black guy. 
 

 

Yep, that was my reaction too. 

I also heard some other RUMINT on this guy but I’m not sure I should be the one to share it on a public forum. FWIW it also seems the Air Force did do an investigation into his claims and came up empty. 

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2 hours ago, kaputt said:

Yep, that was my reaction too. 

I also heard some other RUMINT on this guy but I’m not sure I should be the one to share it on a public forum. FWIW it also seems the Air Force did do an investigation into his claims and came up empty. 

https://youtu.be/mBx-eT8D5nc?t=11

This is the forum. 60 minutes wasn't the forum. Go with details.

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That's disappointed. Duckworth has generally seemed reasonable. And I loved when she lot into the guy that hurt himself playing military prep school football for claiming "disabled veteran" status with his business. So I'm disappointed to see her being part of that kind of bullshit.

Sent from my SM-N975U using Baseops Network mobile app

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32 minutes ago, N730 said:

That's disappointed. Duckworth has generally seemed reasonable. And I loved when she lot into the guy that hurt himself playing military prep school football for claiming "disabled veteran" status with his business. So I'm disappointed to see her being part of that kind of bullshit.

Sent from my SM-N975U using Baseops Network mobile app
 

You sound surprised.  She’s very far left...of course she’s going to push the identity politics stuff—it’s literally part of the left’s platform.  

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On 3/23/2021 at 6:48 PM, SurelySerious said:

I think there is a law against that. But hey, Maize Hirono is backing her so it must be okay.

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How did you not know RATM and Tom Morello were far left?

Did you know Tom is black? Because people also stop listening to RATM when they learn he’s black.

“Some of those that work forces, are the same that burn crosses”

Referring to police as KKK members seems pretty obviously “left”. Honestly the song is 30 years old...you’re just finding this out now
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46 minutes ago, busdriver said:

Their entire body of work is blatantly marxist and anti western. Also, musically amazing.



Sent from my SM-T380 using Tapatalk
 

Love those riffs...

Being a leftist wealth distribution spokesman has yielded Tom Morello a net worth of $30M (according to a quick search of the interwebs) thanks to capitalism and free speech.  Let the irony flow through you.

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On 3/25/2021 at 7:20 PM, billy pilgrim said:

thanks to capitalism and free speech.  Let the irony flow through you.

The joy of the market valuing his contributions to music without discriminating against him for his poorly thought out ideas.

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On 3/23/2021 at 2:42 PM, ToHoldShort said:

An F-22 pilot on why he felt discriminated against in the Air Force - YouTube

Video with 60 minutes, seems like there is more to this

Surprised that no one has pointed out to this crowd that in addition to getting an USAFA appointment, UPT slot, T-38 track, Raptor assignment, and admission to Harvard, his wife is a smoking hot fitness model/actress/influencer or some shit from Australia.

I'm sympathetic to his concerns, but yeah.....hard to feel sorry for this guy.

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Tucker Carslon goes after DOD and USAF claiming they have gone woke.

If you don't want to watch the start at 9:00 and watch what he said about Lt Gen Webb, AETC and the way we select pilots.  Sounds like having a PPL will soon loose any weight in the PMSV.

 

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GD he has a punchable face.

And “doughy moron” for a guy that’s ran 2 MAJCOM’s and had the audacity to say that getting a PPL is an indicator of having a more advantaged upbringing? What a moron.

*White privilege trigger warning* I understand the SJW type initiatives if that’s what the people you’re trying to recruit are thinking about now. But recruiting to fly for the services had never been an issue. With that luxury, why not stack the deck to get the best candidates*? I’m also not ignorant to the fact that there are probably some diamonds in the rough out there (look at WW2 fighter aces from rural backgrounds with minimal education), but these upper level policies are about the whole and not the individual. 
 

And the diversity thing is always pumped up as different perspectives to find better answers etc. That’s the opposite of what you want at the tactical level. You want people that are brilliant at the basics and then can leverage those attributes accounted for in recruiting in the non-standard scenarios. If you’re really recruiting for an eventual diverse senior officer corps, that’s a different story. Maybe it’s just a chicken/egg thing.

 

*How the AF determines best candidates is slightly flawed, IMO. There needs to be much more consideration placed on athletic skill and not just academic. In my experience, gifted athletes with average intelligence compared to superior intellectuals with poor athletic ability are much better pilots. 

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48 minutes ago, Danger41 said:

...PPL....

....why not stack the deck to get the best candidates*

I'm not going to watch the stupid video.  Based on comments thus far, the good general did a piss poor job of advocating for getting rid of PPL advantage.

Logical argument for PPL: someone who's already a pilot obviously can already fly, that means they have a higher likelihood of getting through UPT.  Safer bet.

Argument against: Everyone knows the policy, and prospective applicants who can afford it will spend the money to pad their resume (partial PPL, or all the way).  Couple problems: just getting a PPL isn't all that hard given enough time, I would contend that being an experienced pilot vs a brand new minted PPL are very different things.  The former should absolutely be given "credit" the latter is the USAF allowing the public (applicant) to fund it's screening program.  

 

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2 hours ago, Danger41 said:

GD he has a punchable face.

And “doughy moron” for a guy that’s ran 2 MAJCOM’s and had the audacity to say that getting a PPL is an indicator of having a more advantaged upbringing? What a moron.

*White privilege trigger warning* I understand the SJW type initiatives if that’s what the people you’re trying to recruit are thinking about now. But recruiting to fly for the services had never been an issue. With that luxury, why not stack the deck to get the best candidates*? I’m also not ignorant to the fact that there are probably some diamonds in the rough out there (look at WW2 fighter aces from rural backgrounds with minimal education), but these upper level policies are about the whole and not the individual. 
 

And the diversity thing is always pumped up as different perspectives to find better answers etc. That’s the opposite of what you want at the tactical level. You want people that are brilliant at the basics and then can leverage those attributes accounted for in recruiting in the non-standard scenarios. If you’re really recruiting for an eventual diverse senior officer corps, that’s a different story. Maybe it’s just a chicken/egg thing.

 

*How the AF determines best candidates is slightly flawed, IMO. There needs to be much more consideration placed on athletic skill and not just academic. In my experience, gifted athletes with average intelligence compared to superior intellectuals with poor athletic ability are much better pilots. 

I’m confused by your post.  Are you for or against the new policy of ignoring flying experience as a factor used in selecting USAF pilots?

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So, there's an effort to remove a PPL from consideration for selection?  Seems stupid.

I didn't get a slot in college (selection rate went to shit), so I competed for a slot on AD.  I knew a PPL was going to be huge, so I figured it out.  If I can find a way to get for a PPL, anyone can. 

I just looked it up, but back in 95 a 2nd Lt made $1636.20 a month.  BAH barely covered apt rent.  I found a local flight school and paid for my PPL, $2250 at the time, by nearly maxing out a credit card.  I paid what I could each month.  I then bought a block of 50 hrs for $1250 (yes, $25/hr wet, a huge bargain these days, but in a Traumahawk) and got my hours up over a 100 (the next big PCSM milestone). 

Lastly, in my UPT class, we didn't do FSP as it was cancelled a few months before attending and the AF didn't fire up the paid for PPL program yet.  A few folks that didn't have a PPL struggled.  Some made it, some didn't.

But maybe that's the problem here; people can't figure shit out anymore and need systems to change and make it easier for them.  Compare two people for a slot.  One is just existing, but doing good school. The other is busting their ass, working extra to pay for a PPL.  It's not that hard of a call.

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GD he has a punchable face.
And “doughy moron” for a guy that’s ran 2 MAJCOM’s and had the audacity to say that getting a PPL is an indicator of having a more advantaged upbringing? What a moron.
*White privilege trigger warning* I understand the SJW type initiatives if that’s what the people you’re trying to recruit are thinking about now. But recruiting to fly for the services had never been an issue. With that luxury, why not stack the deck to get the best candidates*? I’m also not ignorant to the fact that there are probably some diamonds in the rough out there (look at WW2 fighter aces from rural backgrounds with minimal education), but these upper level policies are about the whole and not the individual. 
 
And the diversity thing is always pumped up as different perspectives to find better answers etc. That’s the opposite of what you want at the tactical level. You want people that are brilliant at the basics and then can leverage those attributes accounted for in recruiting in the non-standard scenarios. If you’re really recruiting for an eventual diverse senior officer corps, that’s a different story. Maybe it’s just a chicken/egg thing.
 
*How the AF determines best candidates is slightly flawed, IMO. There needs to be much more consideration placed on athletic skill and not just academic. In my experience, gifted athletes with average intelligence compared to superior intellectuals with poor athletic ability are much better pilots. 


What's a PPL run these days? $15K? Plus the free time to fly and study? In addition to participating in organized athletics (which also involves time and cost). That's a huge hurdle to overcome to increase your chances, especially if you're trying to remain competitive in other selection factors (grades, athletics, community service). That being said, the AF is trying to help bring more people who may not be able to afford a PPL into the selection pool (including minorities/women) with scholarships for PPLs: https://www.airuniversity.af.edu/Holm-Center/AFJROTC/Flight-Academy/

Plus, generally UPT studs who have (only) a PPL are generally indistinguishable from those who don't by the end of the first T-6 contact checkride. My hunch is that having a PPL decreases your odds of washing out (initial solo is one of the big milestones), mainly because having previous flying experience makes the learning early on a bit easier on average and making that individual a safer investment for the AF.

One problem in modeling (like figuring out who to select for UPT) is once you identify a maximum in the model (like maximizing UPT graduation rate based on selection factors), the question becomes "is that a local maximum, or absolute maximum." In other words, just because I find a peak in the model, doesn't mean I've necessarily found the best solution in the solution space.

You may also have potentially competing goals (minimizing UPT washout vs producing the most skilled pilots). Maybe selecting athletes produces a handful of "great" tactical pilots, but if there's a higher washout rate, is it worth the cost? Or is it better to select to minimize washout rates and accept "average" or "acceptable" pilots (if the minimums weren't good enough, they'd be higher...)?

For better or for worse, pilots run the AF. If we select pilots to only focus on being the best tactically, it hurts our ability to groom operational and strategic level planners with tactical experience (unless the AF were to allow non-pilots to fill those higher level roles). At the same time, focusing solely on the operational and strategic levels may leave us unable to win at the tactical level to achieve those operational/strategic goals. So we need a mix of pilots with different skills, backgrounds, and career desires. And since the AF is run by pilots, it acts as the greatest filter into who is allowed to lead within the AF, so it gets a lot of scrutiny.
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