tac airlifter Posted June 2, 2020 Author Share Posted June 2, 2020 4 minutes ago, herkbum said: The video itself. They are wearing all black, to include hoodies and stocking caps. Just like a majority of individuals in the videos rioting in the city. I assume you aren't talking about the lady narrating the video wearing jeans and a grey top; you must be referring the teenager wearing a black Jersey that was shot. Yup, fucking vandal for sure. He should have known to watch YouTube and dress the opposite of rioters, whatever that is. Definitely deserved it. I’m sure now he’ll grow up respecting cops. 3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sim Posted June 2, 2020 Share Posted June 2, 2020 Quote To that end, I’m establishing the 19th AF Diversity and Inclusion Task Force. Lt Col ### will be our lead for this effort. The goal of the task force is to look at areas where we may have blind spots to things such as unconscious bias, review our training curricula to make sure we’re keeping pace with our national aspirations and to connect with our Airmen and leaders to ensure our environment matches the strength of our ideals. After nearly a year as your commander, I’ve had the opportunity to talk to a lot of people, including many of you who have a completely different background and perspective than mine. Universally, you tell me that it’s a great Air Force, but challenges remain, especially if you’re different from the majority. It turns out that if you’re a female student, you’re 4% less likely to graduate UPT, and if you’re a person who identifies as non-white, you’re 13% less likely to graduate. I don’t think this is a result of any one factor, but I am pretty certain we won’t figure out effective solutions unless we tackle the issue head on. As long as people are people and as long as we’re all a little different, the numbers will always be a little different too...but I think the numbers should look a lot more alike in the Air Force of 2020. We know it takes time to make change, ....Diversity and Inclusion Task force!?! 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lord Ratner Posted June 2, 2020 Share Posted June 2, 2020 On 5/30/2020 at 4:57 PM, DirkDiggler said: Yeah, it is. Poor taste would be putting it mildly. Lighten up, Francis. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lord Ratner Posted June 2, 2020 Share Posted June 2, 2020 11 hours ago, FLEA said: One thing a lot of people don't recognize is systematic and institutional racism can exist without there actually being a racist. If you immagine society as a big gumball machine, and you pour all the gumballs in at the top, they should come out proportional. If your gumball machine starts segregating blue gumballs, there is a problem in the machine and a cog is broke. Society is supposed to be uniformed and not look at color. That cog may not have been put there intentionally. Or maybe it was left from people long ago who placed it with the wrong reasons. It may have been placed there to solve a differt problem and unintentionally created the problem we now have. All of this doesn't neccessarily mean the people entrusted to maintain the machine are racist. It does mean the machine is discriminatory and does need looked at, the cog identified, and machined to the point it no longer seperates blue gumballs when performing it's function. That's not the definition of racism. But yes, the second and third order effects of overwhelmingly-liberal policies are exactly to blame for the disparate outcomes between the races in America. Will they ever see that? Nope. Double down and just keep doing what doesn't work. 1 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guardian Posted June 2, 2020 Share Posted June 2, 2020 Do the CMSgt of the AF comment's make anyone else feel uneasy? It's not the content of the message that worries me, although there are some points I disagree with, but its a military member openly commenting on what in many respects is a political issue and using the uniform as a vector for that message. Please share link Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guardian Posted June 2, 2020 Share Posted June 2, 2020 Please share linkNever mind. Found it. FLEA. Slackline. You wanted to kick someone out? This dude is 20 kinds of wrong and needs to be not only booted from his position but looked at for charges. The entire officer and enlisted force in the US Air Force should seek this dudes firing. This is a $hit example of who people should strive to be. Embarrassing. Has any chief of the AF ever said anything so stupid?https://www.google.com/amp/s/thehill.com/policy/defense/500589-top-air-force-enlisted-officer-speaks-out-on-racial-injustice-i-am-george%3famp 1 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
FLEA Posted June 2, 2020 Share Posted June 2, 2020 (edited) 2 hours ago, Guardian said: Never mind. Found it. FLEA. Slackline. You wanted to kick someone out? This dude is 20 kinds of wrong and needs to be not only booted from his position but looked at for charges. The entire officer and enlisted force in the US Air Force should seek this dudes firing. This is a $hit example of who people should strive to be. Embarrassing. Has any chief of the AF ever said anything so stupid? https://www.google.com/amp/s/thehill.com/policy/defense/500589-top-air-force-enlisted-officer-speaks-out-on-racial-injustice-i-am-george%3famp I haven't read his statement yet, still at work. One thing I wanted to point out though, the AF response to this is probably effected by the scathing review from Congress on failure to follow up a 2015 IG report on racial disparity. That was recent, I'll try to find the article when I get home. Edited June 2, 2020 by FLEA 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
skibum Posted June 2, 2020 Share Posted June 2, 2020 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guardian Posted June 2, 2020 Share Posted June 2, 2020 What was it? Video has been taken down Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GrndPndr Posted June 2, 2020 Share Posted June 2, 2020 Mods... Perhaps it's time to break this discussion out into its own thread? 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ebony zer Posted June 2, 2020 Share Posted June 2, 2020 8 hours ago, Guardian said: Never mind. Found it. FLEA. Slackline. You wanted to kick someone out? This dude is 20 kinds of wrong and needs to be not only booted from his position but looked at for charges. The entire officer and enlisted force in the US Air Force should seek this dudes firing. This is a $hit example of who people should strive to be. Embarrassing. Has any chief of the AF ever said anything so stupid? https://www.google.com/amp/s/thehill.com/policy/defense/500589-top-air-force-enlisted-officer-speaks-out-on-racial-injustice-i-am-george%3famp That’s not the entire post nor does it accurately represent what he was saying entirely. It’s a long Twitter post so here you go. Who am I? I am a Black man who happens to be the Chief Master Sergeant of the Air Force. I am George Floyd…I am Philando Castile, I am Michael Brown, I am Alton Sterling, I am Tamir Rice. Just like most of the Black Airmen and so many others in our ranks…I am outraged at watching another Black man die on television before our very eyes. What happens all too often in this country to Black men who are subjected to police brutality that ends in death…could happen to me. As shocking as that may sound to some of you… I hope you realize that racism/discrimination/exclusion does not care much about position, titles or stature…. so yes, it could happen to you, or one of your friends, or your Airmen, or your NCOIC, your Flight Chief, your Squadron Commander or even your Wing Commander. This, my friends, is my greatest fear, not that I will be killed by a white police officer (believe me my heart starts racing like most other Black men in America when I see those blue lights behind me)… But that I will wake up to a report that one of our Black Airmen has died at the hands of a white police officer. As I struggle with the Air Force’s own demons that include the racial disparities in military justice and discipline among our youngest Black male Airmen and the clear lack of diversity in our senior officer ranks…I can only look in the mirror for the solution. I, the CMSAF, must do better in ensuring every Airmen in our ranks has a fair chance at becoming the best version of themselves. While this is a complicated issue…I, along with every other leader across the force, am responsible for making sure it becomes a reality. What have I been doing? Not enough…I have done my share of community service work, been in involved in mentor programs, voted in local, state and national elections, but I’ve come to the conclusion that whatever I have done in the past is just not enough. So, I spent the last week, “plotting, planning, strategizing, organizing and mobilizing” just as Killer Mike, the popular Atlanta rapper and activist encouraged us to do. Twenty-five of my closest friends (White, Black, Asian, enlisted, officer and civilian) and I have an ongoing dialogue where we began by acknowledging our right to be angry about what is happening. We eventually moved beyond the rage and began to think about what’s next? What could or should we be doing as a group and as individuals to stop this from happening in our communities across these United States? We don’t have all the answers, but we do have some of the most brilliant minds, many, who have first hand experience with this topic and we will continue working towards a solution. While we can’t change the world, we can change the communities we live in and more importantly, those where our Airmen strive to be seen, heard, and treated as human beings. I have also not done enough as your most senior enlisted leader… While we have made progress in many of the areas that impact our Airmen and families; I believe that we have not made much progress in this area of racial injustice and diversity among our ranks. This is why I’m working with @GenDaveGoldfein, first and foremost to have a full and thorough independent review of our military justice system. We will look to uncover where the problem lies, and how we can fix it. We are also working to improve the diversity of our force, especially within the senior ranks. I hope this message triggers responses and ideas from each of you on things we can do better. Like me, acknowledge your right to be upset about what’s happening to our nation. But you must then find a way to move beyond the rage and do what you think is right for the country, for your community, for your sons, daughters, friends and colleagues…for every Black man in this country who could end up like George Floyd. Part of my group’s solution involves helping to bridge the communication & understanding gap between law enforcement and young Black men. You decide what works best for you, where you can have the most meaningful impact and most importantly, what you can stay committed to… We didn’t get here overnight so don’t expect things to change tomorrow…we are in this for the long haul. Vote, protest peacefully, reach out to your local and state officials, to your Air Force leadership and become active in your communities… We need all hands on deck. If you don’t do anything else, I encourage everyone to fight, not just for freedom, justice and equality, but to fight for understanding. You might think you know what it’s like to grow up, exist, survive & even thrive in this country as a Black person, but let me tell you, regardless of how many Black friends you have, how Black your neighborhood was, or if your spouse or in-laws are Black… You don’t know. You don’t know the anxiety, the despair, the heartache, the fear, the rage and the disappointment that comes with living in this country, OUR country every single day. So, take the time to talk to someone – your brand new Airmen, your NCOIC or your Flight Commander - about their experiences so that you have a better understanding of who they are, where they come from and what drives them. Frankly, you owe this to every Airmen, but I’m asking you specifically to pay attention to the Black Airmen in your ranks during this trying time. Don’t misunderstand me, they don’t need, nor do they want any special treatment…but they deserve to be treated fairly & equally, both by our United States Air Force & these United States of America…this begins with you, & I am asking, no fighting, for your understanding. Like you, I don’t have all of the answers, but I'm committed to seeing a better future for this nation. A future where Black men no longer suffer needlessly at the hands of White police officers, & Black Airmen have the same chance to succeed as their White counterparts. Trust me, I understand this is a difficult topic to talk about… Difficult…not impossible… Difficult…but necessary. I am Kaleth. I am a Black Man who happens to be the Chief Master Sergeant of the Air Force and I am committed to making this better. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
di1630 Posted June 2, 2020 Share Posted June 2, 2020 Let’s hope the CMSGT identifies with the “Gentle Giant” Micheal Brown and not the one that robbed the store and assaulted a cop.Sent from my iPhone using Baseops Network mobile app Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pawnman Posted June 2, 2020 Share Posted June 2, 2020 15 hours ago, RASH said: Paintballs/beanbags maybe? Sent from my iPad using Baseops Network mobile app Does it matter? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nunya Posted June 2, 2020 Share Posted June 2, 2020 CMSAF sounds pretty racist. 1 3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
WannaFly2019 Posted June 2, 2020 Share Posted June 2, 2020 (edited) 13 hours ago, Sim said: ....Diversity and Inclusion Task force!?! Who did you quote this from? I can fix this UPT issue pretty easy. Fire the few racist and sexist sim instructors. Don't even tell me there's not - because there are quite a few. I've had plenty of friends go through and deal with it, including my wife, who was told "women shouldn't be pilots." Edited June 2, 2020 by WannaFly2019 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guardian Posted June 2, 2020 Share Posted June 2, 2020 Who did you quote this from? I can fix this UPT issue pretty easy. Fire the few racist and sexist sim instructors. Don't even tell me there's not - because there are quite a few. I've had plenty of friends go through and deal with it, including my wife, who was told "women shouldn't be pilots." Not to belittle her experience at all. That sucks and people shouldn’t be made to feel inferior because of something like that. On the flip side, life isn’t perfect and can’t be made that way. Often life’s greatest rewards come at the end of a giant struggle you either voluntarily or in voluntarily went through. Doesn’t matter. We are better when we overcome the negative and bad. Should people be held accountable for their words and deeds? Sure. As long as it doesn’t infringe freedom of speech. What is one of the worst things you can do to those who say and do things like that? Prove them wrong. In a big way. Should we adapt and overcome and show why America is the greatest country ever in the entire world and no one is close? Absolutely. We are created equal. We don’t exist equal. And if we try and level the playing field for those who don’t try hard to be the best so that everyone can play....well that’s just wrong. I want the best possible doctor (who gets rewarded for being the best) operating on me if the time comes. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guardian Posted June 2, 2020 Share Posted June 2, 2020 That’s not the entire post nor does it accurately represent what he was saying entirely. It’s a long Twitter post so here you go. .Hence I included the link. But thanks for pointing out your perception of wrongness in my statement. The link was a direct link to his statement hence I wasn’t mis representing him. And the more and more I read it, the more I think he doesn’t realize his own racist attitude, fear mongering, and over all manipulation of facts to cause even more divide and strife. All I have to go on for this man is these statements and that he has reached the position he has which don’t equal each other. For someone in so high of a position, his statements are unforgivable. To identify with criminals and people he gives an assumption of wrongly shot and then place it on the high office he has achieved and rationalize it is flat out wrong and Un-American. I hope the CSAF does the right thing and retracts his statement and takes a hard look at non judicial punishment for him. His statement is flat out wrong and causes further issues. In fact it is Sick to think that this man has sway over the susceptible young minds in the Air Force. Is this really what our service is coming to? It’s embarrassing. 1 2 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guardian Posted June 2, 2020 Share Posted June 2, 2020 Mods... Perhaps it's time to break this discussion out into its own thread?Completely disagree. This is very much online with WTF? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guardian Posted June 2, 2020 Share Posted June 2, 2020 Re: Gen Slifes comments I think diversity and inclusion are absolute good things to talk about. The theory he talks about when discussing the box with his is a good one. In general I’m all for a capitalistic society or military who’s goals are to take advantage of those with big time talents in specific areas. And sometimes having two sides of a coin in terms of two different people from different backgrounds (or diverse positions) is an absolute requirement. So I like his first little bit. Now let me take it a step further from my own opinion. You can have two black guys and everything about the two of them is completely diverse except for their skin color. And having the two of them do a particular task because they are the best at it and their diversities help them achieve it. Now apply that same mentality to any color skin. Now take one black guy and one white guy who are hardly diverse at all. Grew up the same, exposed to the same environment, family structure, back ground, education and for all intensive purposes they are the same. But society and sadly the Air Force is starting to go this way to say that they may be almost the same exact person but because their skin is a different color, they are diverse and that’s what we need. I disagree with that overarching mentality. Now another step further. I agree that we are exposed to different environmental stimuli as a product of our skin colors. And that diversity can be good. It can also be bad. So there are so many individual traits where do we stop the diversity discussion? And how do we make it viable? We can’t have 50/50 men to women. 50/50 white to black. Red hair. Tall. Short. Fat. Skinny. Transsexual. Gay. Straight. Pan sexual. Etc. and it can go on and on and on and on. So where does the diversity stop. And when is it ok to push diversity over mission accomplishment? Especially in the military. We have a job to do. And we want the best. I don’t really care who’s next to me as long as they are the best at what they do. None of the other traits really matter. It’s only the mission. So diversity of thought, traits, backgrounds, etc are all good. But not when they hamper the mission because then diversity becomes the mission at the detriment of all other things. I believe in equality of opportunity. Everyone should have a chance. I don’t believe in equality of outcome which is where our society is leaning. The goals of having 50/50 of a character trait group regardless of ability isn’t what our country should be about. I believe the most persecuted group or class today is the white male. Persecuted because of his whiteness and fore fathers transgressions not based on his actions and the merits there in. And male because of radical feminism to the detriment of our society. Again. Let me be very clear I believe in equal opportunity for all in America. Military can limit that some for accomplishment of the mission. Weight and physical fitness. Mental. Etc. and in some senses civilian companies do some of the same. So when affirmative action allows someone in with less talents to do a task than someone else who is more qualified, isn’t that racist? Isn’t then affirmative action racist especially in a country where equal opportunity is the federal law and has been for some time? Moving on. 2nd paragraph. I like his description of civil discourse and agree. With this exception. “We have to listen to other perspectives and accept them as valid.” This is a politically correct and very very wrong statement and propagates the false idea of “your truth.” There is no such thing. There is only truth. Right and wrong. So this applied to a much larger scale, of we are talking to North Korea and telling them how they treat their own people and what they do with regards to their nuclear program is wrong. When they respond, according to the General we have to accept their statements as to why they have 25 million people in forced labor camps as “valid, but perhaps incomplete.” I realize that it’s not necessarily the same. But it proves the point of if you make everything valid and important then nothing becomes valid and important and truth loses its meaning. This is the definition of relativism which our society is doing a bad job of staying away from. Truth is truth. I fully expect him to have a statement coming up that he is going to check his white male privilege at the door. Which is another example of how the society is failing that they allow pandering to that B.S. line. Next. “If you see individual racism...bigotry...in our Air Force, call it out. If you see institutional racism in our Air Force, call it out. Our EO and IG offices are ready to assist. And we're listening. Tell us about the green triangles we can't see.” Hence what I’m doing. The CMSgt of the Air Force is wrong and needs removed. He’s going to start riots inside of the Air Force with comments and BS like that. Completely agree with the last paragraph. Over all interesting. A few points I don’t agree with though. I will take his challenge to listen to the Seeing White podcast. As well as I will read the wapo article you posted slack line (I think it was you who posted). Anyways.... 1 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sim Posted June 2, 2020 Share Posted June 2, 2020 1 3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mcbush Posted June 2, 2020 Share Posted June 2, 2020 1 hour ago, Guardian said: I hope the CSAF does the right thing and retracts his statement and takes a hard look at non judicial punishment for him. His statement is flat out wrong and causes further issues. In fact it is Sick to think that this man has sway over the susceptible young minds in the Air Force. For what it’s worth, CSAF apparently couldn’t agree with you less. He attached the Chief’s statement to an email sent to all wing commanders today, and told them to disseminate it to their wings. Standing by for words about Fingers in 3, 2, 1... 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guardian Posted June 2, 2020 Share Posted June 2, 2020 Very sad Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nsplayr Posted June 2, 2020 Share Posted June 2, 2020 16 hours ago, Guardian said: This dude is 20 kinds of wrong and needs to be not only booted from his position but looked at for charges. What type of charges do you propose? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nsplayr Posted June 2, 2020 Share Posted June 2, 2020 1 hour ago, Guardian said: I believe the most persecuted group or class today is the white male. Have you run this opinion past anyone who is not a white man? 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sim Posted June 2, 2020 Share Posted June 2, 2020 (edited) Also. https://m.washingtontimes.com/news/2016/may/2/police-more-reluctant-shoot-blacks-whites-study-fi/ Police more reluctant to shoot blacks than whites, study finds https://m.washingtontimes.com/news/2016/jul/11/no-racial-bias-police-shootings-study-harvard-prof/ No racial bias in police shootings, study by Harvard professor shows https://m.washingtontimes.com/news/2015/apr/21/police-kill-more-whites-than-blacks-but-minority-d/ Police kill more whites than blacks, but minority deaths generate more outrage Edited June 2, 2020 by Sim Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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